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Christ is the flaming sword that guards tree of life in the Garden of Eden.
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[quote:Bee Free:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE3MTEzX0JBNENBQjYx] [quote:Photine 75425980:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE3MDA5XzQyNDAxOTA5] [quote:Bee Free:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE2OTU3XzZGRTI5Q0Ex] [quote:Photine 75425980:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE2ODU1XzgwMkU5N0JB] [quote:Bee Free:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE2Nzg3X0QwRDJDRkU2] [quote:Photine 75425980:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE2NTA1X0Y1ODFGMEFD] [quote:Bee Free:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE2MzQ4X0VCRDEzNUE3] [quote:Photine 75425980:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE1NTU4X0U0RjJEN0JB] [quote:Bee Free:MV80MjEwODY5Xzc3NzE1NTE0Xzg5Mjg1RTk1] Evening, Photine. Mind if I trouble you for your thoughts on a reading I was doing earlier today? It's some real rudimentary kind of stuff. Possibly more basic than Christianity 101. [/quote] Proceed. [/quote] I was reading over these verses: John 6:51-52 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And this bread, which I will give for the life of the world, is My flesh.” At this, the J.ews began to argue among themselves, “How can this man give us His flesh to eat?” John 6:53-55 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I tell you, unless you eat the flesh and drink the blood of the Son of Man, you have no life in you. Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For My flesh is real food, and My blood is real drink." The controversy here has continuously come up for as long as I've been paying attention to debates within/against Christianity. One side attempts to make the words of Christ into something sinister. As in, a literal interpretation of eating flesh and drinking blood. Still, most others (even non-believers) explain the words of Christ as symbolic, and detail what the symbolism is meant to represent. They usually draw from other passages to make their arguments. But, as I re-read the following verses, it seems traversing beyond this passage isn't necessary. John 6:61 Aware that his disciples were grumbling about this, Jesus said to them, "Does this offend you? John 6:63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life. He just got through saying "this bread, which I will give for the life of the world, is My flesh" only a moment ago. Now, He's clarifying that "the flesh profits nothing"? Only one reading makes sense here. The point where He clarifies himself to His begrudging disciples, this is where He tells them what His words actually meant. Before, I thought He was just telling them not not to doubt His words as they are full of spirit and life. Now, I think He was actually interpreting His symbolism. "The Spirit gives life; the flesh profits nothing." He first lays this out there to show they should've caught onto His veiled language from the start. "The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life." He's telling them the words 'flesh' and 'blood' were stand-ins for the words 'spirit' and 'life'. Not too monumental a notion. But is He then saying His flesh is not actually flesh, but rather spirit in the form of flesh? I came to this reading after looking at the various ways Jesus tries to engage His disciples in symbolic teachings only to have to explain everything because they don't get it. Like when He warns them about the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees: Matthew 16:5-8, 11-12 5 When they crossed to the other side, the disciples forgot to take bread. 6 “Watch out!” Jesus told them. “Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees.” 7 They discussed this among themselves and concluded, “It is because we did not bring any bread.” 8 Aware of their conversation, Jesus said, “You of little faith, why are you debating among yourselves about having no bread? 11 How do you not understand that I was not telling you about bread? But beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees.” 12 Then they understood that He was not telling them to beware of the leaven used in bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Anyway, all this and my main takeaway is probably just that Jesus was telling us something about His 'flesh' being different than our flesh. This resonates as I've been contemplating the incarnation and how Jesus was likely only human in form but not in His true nature. [/quote] Exodus 16:6-14 6So Moses and Aaron said to all the Israelites, “This evening you will know that it was the LORD who brought you out of the land of Egypt, 7and [b][color=darkred][i]in the morning you will see [u]the LORD’s glory[/u], because [u]He has heard your grumbling against Him[/u][/i][/color][/b]. For who are we that you should grumble against us?” 8And Moses added, “[b][i][color=darkred]The LORD will give you meat to eat this evening and[u] bread [/u]to[u] fill you [/u]in the morning[/color][/i][/b], for He has heard your grumbling against Him. Who are we? Your grumblings are not against us but against the LORD.” 9Then Moses said to Aaron, “Tell the whole congregation of Israel, ‘Come before the LORD, for He has heard your grumbling.’” 10And as Aaron was speaking to the whole congregation of Israel, they looked toward the desert, and [b][i][color=darkred]there in a cloud [u]the glory of the LORD [/u]appeared.[/color][/i][/b] 11Then the LORD said to Moses, 12“I have heard the grumbling of the Israelites. Tell them, ‘At twilight you will eat meat, and in the morning you will be filled with bread. Then you will know that I am the LORD your God.’” 13That evening quail came and covered the camp, and in the morning there was a layer of dew around the camp. 14When the layer of dew had evaporated, [b][i][color=darkred]there were thin flakes on the desert floor, as fine as frost[/color][/i][/b] on the ground. 15When the Israelites saw it, they asked one another, “What is it?” For they did not know what it was. So Moses told them, “[b][i][color=darkred]It is the bread that the LORD has given you to eat[/color][/i][/b]. Nehemiah 9:20 20 You gave [b]your good Spirit[/b] to instruct them. You did not withhold [b]your manna[/b] from their mouths, and you gave them [b]water[/b] for their thirst. [/quote] Yes :hf: Another thought I have here is how Jesus is both the bread and He who gives the bread. John 6:51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world." I see confusion in similar expository passages. Many people I talk to conceive of the 'way' as the Holy Spirit (non-Jesus entity) which Jesus gave as means to communion and intercession between the realms of God and man. As if Jesus couldn't make the way and be the way at the same time. But relevant passages in the Gospel say otherwise: John 14:3-6 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. You know the way to the place where I am going.” Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don’t know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” Jesus answered, “I am the way" [/quote] The Glory of God in Exodus 16:7 is even treated as a distinct person from God, as you can see. [/quote] Yes, I see. There's plenty of language in the epistles that clears up the matter almost perfectly. Especially Paul's discussion on the various manifestations and gifts of the Spirit being of one single Spirit. But I'm trying to keep my premises within the scope of the OT and four accounts of the Gospel for now. But, soon. Soon I will argue unabashedly. [/quote] 1 Corinthians 10:3-5 3 They all ate [b]the same spiritual food[/b] 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from [b]the spiritual rock that accompanied them[/b], and [b]that rock was Christ.[/b] 5 Nevertheless, God was not pleased with most of them; their bodies were scattered in the wilderness. [/quote] Philippians 1:19 For I know that this will turn out for my deliverance through your prayer and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ. Romans 8:9 You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. 1 John 4:13 By this we know that we remain in Him, and He in us: He has given us of His Spirit. Galatians 4:6 And because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying out, "Abba, Father!" 1 Corinthians 12:13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body--whether J.ews or Gentiles, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. ... Ephesians 4:4 There is one body and one Spirit... 1 Corinthians 6:17 But he who is joined to the Lord becomes one spirit with him. Ephesians 2:18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father. Philippians 1:27 Then, whether I come and see you or only hear about you in my absence, I will know that you stand firm in the one Spirit… 1 Corinthians 12:11 There is only one Spirit who does all these things by giving what God wants to give to each person... [/quote]
Original Message
Gen 3:24
And so God cast out Adam, and to the east of the Garden of Eden he placed cherubim, and
a sword of flame
which turned about, to guard the way to the tree of life.
Ephesians 6:17
And take ye the helmet of health, and
the sword of the Ghost
, that is,
the Word of God
.
Luke 3:16
John answered them all, saying, “I baptize you with water, but he who is mightier than I is coming, He will baptize you with
the Holy Spirit
and with
fire
.
Jer 23:29
Is not My
Word
like
a fire
? saith the LORD? and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces?
2 Samuel 23:2
The Spirit of the Lord
spoke through me;
His Word
was on my tongue.
Ps 33:6
By
the Word of the Lord
the heavens were established; and all the power of them by
the Spirit of his mouth
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