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No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...

 
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03/18/2011 01:08 AM
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No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
[link to shofarofeliyah.com]

The FIRST Resurrection/Catching Away, When and Why!!!

(Revelation 20:6 The Scriptures '98+) Blessed and set-apart is the one having part in the first resurrection. The second death possesses no authority over these, but they shall be priests of Elohim and of Messiah, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Shalom in Mashiyach Yeshua!!!

There are three main verses that supporters of the pre-tribulation catching away use; they are 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 and 1 Thessalonians 4:17. These verses are used OUT of CONTEXT, and then supported with NUMEROUS other verses from the WORD that are also taken OUT of CONTEXT!!!

If you believe in the pre-tribulation rapture, PLEASE read ALL of this article/teaching!!! If you believe it to be in error, PLEASE correct me using Scripture in CONTEXT, and I will post an official retraction with and apology! (This would NOT be the first time I had to teshuva/repent, and make restitution for teaching false doctrines that I was sharing from my Torah-less “pastors”!!!)

This article is SIMPLE. I stick to the CONTEXT of the verses used, and let the WORD speak for itself. The word “Parousia/Coming” is used in 1 Corinthians 15 and 1 Thessalonians 4, and in CONTEXT it is actually referring to the Second Coming of Yeshua. The word “Parousia” is used for the Coming of Mashiyach, and is used by Yeshua in Mattithyahu Chapter 24 in reference to His return! The awesome thing about Mattithyahu/Matthew Chapter 24 is that Yeshua gives us MANY warnings about the end, and He goes into great details about His parousia/coming!!! When reading Mattithyahu Chapter 24 you must keep in mind that His talmid/disciples asked three questions: 1. had to do with the destruction of the Temple, 2. had to do with the sign of His Coming/Parousia, and 3. had to do with the End/Sunteleia of the World.

May YHVH direct us into His Word, and His Interpretation, by the Ruach HaKodesh in the Name (Authority) of Yeshua HaMashiyach!!! Not my opinion, not your opinion, and definitely not the opinion of any man or religious organization!!! I do not care how many degrees your pastor or rabbi has!!! I do not care that your pastor/rabbi speaks, reads, and writes English, Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek!!! I do not care how big your assembly is either!!! But Chuck Smith says this, pastor Hagee says that, Hal Lindsey says such and such, or rabbi whatever says this; I DON’T CARE WHAT ANY MAN SAYS, IN PARTICULAR IF HE CONTRADICTS THE WORD’S OF YESHUA, VIOLATES TORAH, AND TAKES NUMEROUS VERSES OUT OF CONTEXT TO SUPPORT FALSE TEACHINGS/DOCTRINES!!!

To start off with, why are there so many different denominations and religious systems on earth today? Why are there different views and teachings on such topics as when the catching away occurs, Torah for all believers, Feast Days, Shabbat, etc...?

The answers are many, but primarily: hasatan (satan), the wicked in high places, hireling pastors/rabbis, traditions of men brought in, lack of knowledge of the Word, taking numerous verses out of CONTEXT to support belief systems, destructive doctrines like the doctrine of “the essentials of the faith”, not reading the Word and proving all things, etc...

My main focus here is the “Catching Away of Believers”, commonly called the Rapture (Latin based English word) and Harpazo (Greek-to seize or take up by force). I also believed (past tense!!!) in the pre-tribulation rapture doctrine for 16 years. I am writing this article not to defend my belief system, but to expound on the Word’s and Teaching of Yeshua HaMashiyach, and line ALL Scripture up!!! How sad that believers defend the pre-trib “Rapture” teaching even though it is NOT Scriptural, and most that keep and teach the FALSE pre-trib rapture doctrine do not even uphold Torah!!! Yeshua and His original talmid/disciples kept the Written Torah of YHVH!!! OY! How backwards we can be.

Let us start with the word for “caught up” in the New Covenant Writings. I hold to the Hebrew/Aramaic supremacy of the New Covenant Writings, but I will be expounding on the Greek New Covenant Writings.

The word for “caught up” is harpazo.

G726

harpazo

har-pad'-zo

From a derivative of G138; to seize (in various applications): - catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take (by force).

The word harpazo/726 is found 13 times in the Greek New Covenant Writings. Here are the verses in which it is used:

(Mattithyahu/Matthew 11:12) But from the days of Yohanan the Immerser until now, the kingdom of Heaven suffers violence, and the violent seize (harpazo/726) it.

(Mattithyahu/Matthew 13:19) Everyone hearing the Word of the kingdom, and not understanding, then the evil one comes and catches away (harpazo/726) that which was sown in his heart. This is that sown by the roadside.

(Yohanan/John 6:15) Then knowing that they were about to come and seize (harpazo/726) Him, that they might make Him king, Yeshua withdrew again to the mountain alone by Himself.

(Yohanan/John 10:12) But the hireling, not even being a shepherd, who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and forsakes the sheep and flees. And the wolf seizes (harpazo/726) them, and scatters the sheep.

(Yohanan/John 10:28) And I give eternal life to them, and they shall not perish to the age, never! And not anyone shall pluck (harpazo/726) them out of My hand.

(Yohanan/John 10:29) My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all, and no one is able to pluck (harpazo/726) out of My Father's hand.

(Acts 8:39) But when they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the YHVH caught away (harpazo/726) Philip. And the eunuch did not see him any more; for he went his way rejoicing.

(Acts 23:10) And discord having arisen, fearing lest Shaul should be torn by them, the chief captain commanded the soldiers to go down to snatch (harpazo/726) him out of their midst, and to bring him into the fortress.

(2 Corinthians 12:2) I know a man in Mashiyach fourteen years before (whether in the body, I do not know; or outside of the body, I do not know; Elohim knows) such a one was caught up (harpazo/726) to the third Heaven.

(2 Corinthians 12:4) that he was caught up (harpazo/726) into Paradise and heard unspeakable words, which it is not allowed for a man to utter.

(1 Thessalonians 4:17) Then we who remain alive will be caught up (harpazo/726) together with them in the clouds to a meeting with the Master/Adonai in the air. And so we will always be with the Master/Adonai.

(Jude 1:23) But save others with fear, snatching (harpazo/726) them out of the fire, hating even the garment being stained from the flesh.

(Revelation 12:5) And she bore a male child who was to shepherd all nations with a rod of iron. And her child was caught away (harpazo/726) to Elohim and to His throne.

The pre-tribulation “rapture” teaching takes numerous verses OUT of CONTEXT to support a FALSE belief system!!!

We are going to start with 1 Thessalonians 4:17 because it actually contains the word “harpazo/catching away” in it:

Let us take 1 Thessalonians 4:17 in CONTEXT!!! This verse is a favorite for pre-tribers. The only problem is that they just take this single verse, and then add numerous other verses, which they also take OUT of CONTEXT to support their belief system!!!

We are going to read and break down each verse in CONTEXT:

(1 Thessalonians 4:13) Now, brothers, we do not wish you to be ignorant concerning those who have fallen asleep/died, lest you be sad as others who have no expectation.

The purpose in verse 13 is clear. Brothers we do NOT want you to be ignorant in regards to those that have already died in Mashiyach. The expectation we have is that we will see our believing loved ones again!!! Do not be sad like those who have NO hope, unbelievers!!!

(1 Thessalonians 4:14) For if we believe that Yeshua died and rose again, so also Elohim shall bring with Him those who sleep/died physically (1) in Yeshua. Footnote: (1) A euphemism for death, a typical Hebrew word for it.

Those who died in Mashiyach Yeshua before His Coming/Parousia will return with Him!!! We are going to see our believing loved ones again! The criterion for obtaining the Resurrection is to be found in Yeshua!!! Your position in the Kingdom will be based on your Torah observance!!! You don’t believe me, read Mattithyahu/Matthew Chapter 5:17-19, and maybe you will believe the Word’s of Yeshua, maybe???

(1 Thessalonians 4:15) For this we say to you by the word of the Master, that we, the living who are left over at the coming/parousia/3952 of the Master shall in no way go before those who are asleep.

The righteous dead in Mashiyach resurrect first!!!

G3952

parousia

par-oo-see'-ah

From the present participle of G3918; a being near, that is, advent (often, return; specifically of Messiah to punish Jerusalem, or finally the wicked); (by implication) physical aspect: - coming, presence.

The word “parousia” is referring to the Second Coming, and is also used in 1 Corinthians 15:23, and let us not forget that the CONTEXT of 1 Corinthians Chapter 15 is the RESURRECTION!!! The word “Parousia/Coming” actually ties 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 with 1 Corinthians 15:1-58 and Mattithyahu 24!!!

Those of us that remain alive, or are left over, at the coming/parousia of the Master Yeshua, will not go up before those that are already dead/asleep in Mashiyach. In other words, the dead in Mashiyach rise first, and then we meet them in the air at His coming/parousia. (See next verse!)

(1 Thessalonians 4:16) Because the Master Himself shall come down from heaven with a shout, with the voice of a chief messenger, and with the trumpet of Elohim and the dead in Messiah shall rise first.

Again, the dead in Mashiyach rise first!!! Our believing loved ones will rise first and we will meet them in the air, and return with Mashiyach as He rules and reigns from Yerushalayim, Yisrael in the Kingdom on earth. You know, what Yeshua taught His talmid/disciples to pray: Your Kingdom Come, Your Will be done on earth, as it is in heaven (Mattithyahu 6:10)!!!

(1 Thessalonians 4:17) Then we, the living who are left over, shall be caught away/harpazo/726 together with them in the clouds to meet the Master in the air – and so we shall always be with the Master.

Again, those of us that remain alive at the coming/parousia (1 Thessalonians 4:15) will be caught up/harpazo together with the righteous dead in Mashiyach!!!

(1 Thessalonians 4:18) So, then, encourage one another with these words.

Again, the encouragement is not that we are taken out before the Tribulation, but that we are to be encouraged that those brothers and sisters that have died physically already in Mashiyach before the coming/parousia of Mashiyach, will rise first and come with Him, and we that remain alive at the coming/parousia will be caught up/harpazo and meet them in the air!!!

AGAIN, NOWHERE DOES IT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT A PRE-TRIBUALTAION RAPTURE!!! THE WORD TRIBULATION IS NOT EVEN MENTIONED!!!

Two more verses that once again are used OUT of CONTEXT are 1 Corinthians 15:51-52.

Please, the CONTEXT of 1 Corinthians Chapter 15 is the RESURRECTION and the Raising/Awakening!!! The word for “resurrection” is anastasis/386. The word “resurrection/ anastasis/386” is used 4 times in 1 Corinthians Chapter 15. The word “egiro/raising/1453” is used 19 times in 1 Corinthians Chapter 15; just in case you think the CONTEXT is NOT referring to the RESURRECTION!!!

G386

anastasis

an-as'-tas-is

From G450; a standing up again, that is, (literally) a resurrection from death (individual, general or by implication (its author)), or (figuratively) a (moral) recovery (of spiritual truth): - raised to life again, resurrection, rise from the dead, that should rise, rising again.

G1453

egeiro

eg-i'-ro

Probably akin to the base of G58 (through the idea of collecting one’s faculties); to waken (transitively or intransitively), that is, rouse (literally from sleep, from sitting or lying, from disease, from death; or figuratively from obscurity, inactivity, ruins, nonexistence): - awake, lift (up), raise (again, up), rear up, (a-) rise (again, up), stand, take up.

The CONTEXT of 1 Corinthians Chapter 15 is the RESURRECTION at the Coming of Mashiyach, and NOT a pre-tribulation “rapture”!!! :

(1 Corinthians 15:1) But brothers, I make known to you the Good News, which I brought as Good News to you, which you also did receive, and in which you stand,

(1 Corinthians 15:2) through which also you are being saved, if you hold fast that word I brought as Good News to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.

(1 Corinthians 15:3) For I delivered to you at the first that which I also received: that Messiah died for our sins according to the Scriptures/TaNaKh,

(1 Corinthians 15:4) and that He was buried, and that He was raised/egiro/1453 the third day, according to the Scriptures/TaNaKh,

(1 Corinthians 15:5) and that He was seen by Kepha, then by the twelve.

(1 Corinthians 15:6) After that He was seen by over five hundred brothers at one time, of whom the greater part remain till now, but some have fallen asleep/died.

THAT’S A LOT OF WITNESSES!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:7) After that He was seen by Yaaqob, then by all the emissaries.

(1 Corinthians 15:8) And last of all He was seen by me also, as if to one born prematurely.

(1 Corinthians 15:9) For I am the least of the emissaries, who am not worthy to be called an emissary, because I persecuted the assembly of Elohim.

(1 Corinthians 15:10) But by the favour of Elohim I am what I am, and His favour toward me was not in vain, but I laboured much more than they all, yet not I, but the favour of Elohim with me.

(1 Corinthians 15:11) Whether, then, it was I or they, so we proclaimed and so you believed.

(1 Corinthians 15:12) And if Messiah is proclaimed that He has been raised/egiro/1453 from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection/anastasis/386 of the dead?

1 Corinthians is addressing believers in Corinth, and correcting some of them that did NOT believe in the resurrection from the dead!!! There is NO mention of being taken out before the Tribulation!!! If anything this chapter teaches that the Coming/Parousia of Mashiyach will bring in the resurrection of the righteous!!! This would be the First Resurrection as mentioned in Revelation 20:5-6!!! When reading Revelation 20 in CONTEXT, one should notice that the dead/nekros do NOT rise until after the 1,000 year reign of Mashiyach. I do not know about you, but I want to take part in the First Resurrection and reign with Mashiyach for a 1,000 years!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:13) And if there is no resurrection/anastasis/386 of the dead, then Messiah has not been raised/egiro/1453.

(1 Corinthians 15:14) And if Messiah has not been raised/egiro/1453, then our proclaiming is empty, and your belief also empty,

Remember, the Good News, is that Mashiyach rose again, conquering sin and death for us!!! HE is our life, HE is the Resurrection!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:15) and we are also found false witnesses of Elohim, because we have witnessed of Elohim that He raised/egiro/1453 up Messiah, whom He did not raise/egiro/1453 up, if then the dead are not raised/egiro/1453.

(1 Corinthians 15:16) For if the dead are not raised/egiro/1453, then neither Messiah has been raised/egiro/1453.

(1 Corinthians 15:17) And if Messiah has not been raised/egiro/1453, your belief is to no purpose, you are still in your sins!

(1 Corinthians 15:18) Then also those who have fallen asleep/died in Messiah have perished.

(1 Corinthians 15:19) If in this life only we have expectation in Messiah, we are of all men the most wretched.

(1 Corinthians 15:20) But now Messiah has been raised/egiro/1453 from the dead, and has become the first-fruit of those having fallen asleep.

(1 Corinthians 15:21) For since death is through a man, resurrection/anastasis/386 of the dead is also through a Man.

(1 Corinthians 15:22) For as all die in Adam, so also all shall be made alive in Messiah.

HalleluYaH!!! HalleluYaH!!! HalleluYaH!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:23) And each in his own order: Messiah the first-fruits, then those who are of Messiah at His coming/parousia/3952,

It does NOT say at the “rapture”, but at His Coming/Parousia; this ties into 1 Thessalonians 4:15 and Mattithyahu 24:3, 27, 37, and 39. Remember, the term “rapture” is Latin, and the actual word in Greek is “harpazo”. Harpazo simply means to take up by force!!! I am NOT teaching that there is NO catching away, but simply teaching what the Word says in CONTEXT. The taking up by force/harpazo happens at the Coming/Parousia of Yeshua HaMashiyach, and NO where does it say it happens before the time of Yaaqob’s/Jacob’s Trouble (Great Tribulation)!!! Yeshua actually tells us that it happens immediately AFTER the Tribulation of those days!!! Have you NEVER read Mattithyahu 24: 29-31??? There is another collection (gathering of) in Greek it is “sullego/4816”. This is the collection or gathering of the tares or wicked at the End of the World, which occurs at the End of the 1,000 year reign of Mashiyach!!! Please read Mattithyahu 13: 36-50!!! It is true that the Kingdom is currently in His talmid/disciples now, and that we should be walking in the Kingdom Principles, which is Torah, but there will also be an earthly Kingdom set up at the Coming/Parousia of Mashiyach. The righteous dead, and those righteous followers of Mashiyach that remain alive, at His Coming/Parousia will all meet in the air, and return to Yerushalayim, Yisrael and rule and reign with Yeshua!!! The timing of this earthly Kingdom is after the Tribulation, and it will last for 1,000 years and hasatan is bound during this time. You might say how can these tares spring up if hasatan is bound??? The seeds have been planted already, and they simply grow up during this time!!! Tares will spring up during this earthly Kingdom, and they will be gathered at the End for destruction!!! Let us also not forget that hasatan is loosed for a short while at the end of the 1,000 years and he goes about to deceive the nations for one last time. hasatan gathers with his forces from the four corners and comes against Mashiyach and the saints in the Land of Yisrael!!! We all know what happens, HalleluYaH!!! YHVH our Mashiyach WINS!!! Game Over hasatan and the wicked!!! I suggest that you read Revelation 20!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:24) then the end/telos/5056, when He delivers up the reign to Elohim the Father, when He has brought to naught all rule and all authority and power.

G5056

telos

tel'-os

From a primary word tello (to set out for a definite point or goal); properly the point aimed at as a limit, that is, (by implication) the conclusion of an act or state (termination [literally, figuratively or indefinitely], result [immediate, ultimate or prophetic], purpose); specifically an impost or levy (as paid): - + continual, custom, end (-ing), finally, uttermost. Compare G5411.

(1 Corinthians 15:25) For He has to reign until He has put all enemies under His feet.

(1 Corinthians 15:26) The last enemy to be brought to naught is death.

(1 Corinthians 15:27) For “He has put all under His feet.” But when He says “all are put under Him,” it is clear that He who put all under Him is excepted.

(1 Corinthians 15:28) And when all are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself shall also be subject to Him who put all under Him, in order that Elohim be all in all.

(1 Corinthians 15:29) Otherwise, what shall they do who are immersed for the dead, if the dead are not raised/egiro/1453 at all? Why indeed are they immersed for the dead?

(1 Corinthians 15:30) And why do we stand in danger every hour?

(1 Corinthians 15:31) I affirm, by the boasting in you which I have in Messiah Yeshua our Master, I die day by day.

(1 Corinthians 15:32) If, as men do, I have fought with beasts at Ephesos, of what good is it to me? If the dead are not raised/egiro/1453, “Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die.”

(1 Corinthians 15:33) Do not be led astray, “Evil company corrupts good habits.”

(1 Corinthians 15:34) Wake up to soberness, righteously, and do not sin, for some do not have the knowledge of Elohim. I speak this to your shame.

(1 Corinthians 15:35) But someone might say, “How are the dead raised/egiro/1453 up? And with what body do they come?”

(1 Corinthians 15:36) Senseless one! What you sow is not made alive unless it dies.

(1 Corinthians 15:37) And as to what you sow: you do not sow the body which is to be, but a bare grain, it might be wheat or some other grain.

(1 Corinthians 15:38) But Elohim gives it a body as He wishes, and to each seed a body of its own.

(1 Corinthians 15:39) All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one flesh of men, and another flesh of beasts, and another of fishes, and another of birds.

(1 Corinthians 15:40) And there are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the esteem of the heavenly is truly one, and the esteem of the earthly is another,

(1 Corinthians 15:41) one esteem of the sun, and another esteem of the moon, and another esteem of the stars – for star differs from star in esteem.

(1 Corinthians 15:42) So also is the resurrection/anastasis/386 of the dead: it is sown in corruption, it is raised/egiro/1453 in incorruption;

(1 Corinthians 15:43) it is sown in disrespect, it is raised/egiro/1453 in esteem; it is sown in weakness, it is raised/egiro/1453 in power;

(1 Corinthians 15:44) it is sown a natural body, it is raised/egiro/1453 a spiritual body; there is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

(1 Corinthians 15:45) And so it has been written, “The first man Adam became a living being,” the last Adam a life-giving Spirit.

(1 Corinthians 15:46) The spiritual, however, was not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual.

(1 Corinthians 15:47) The first man was of the earth, earthy; the second Man is the Master from heaven.

(1 Corinthians 15:48) As is the earthy, so also are those who are earthy; and as is the heavenly, so also are those who are heavenly.

(1 Corinthians 15:49) And as we have borne the likeness of the earthy, we shall also bear the likeness of the heavenly.

(1 Corinthians 15:50) And this I say, brothers, that flesh and blood is unable to inherit the reign of Elohim, neither does corruption inherit incorruption.

(1 Corinthians 15:51) See, I speak a secret to you: We shall not all sleep/die, but we shall all be changed,

(1 Corinthians 15:52) in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at THE LAST TRUMPET. For the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised/egiro/1453 incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

PLEASE NOTICE THAT IT DOES NOT SAY FIRST TRUMPET, SECOND TRUMPET, MIDDLE TRUMPET, BUT THE LAST TRUMPET; and the Trumpets happen when? Yes, during the Great Tribulation/Yaaqob’s Trouble (Read Revelation Again)!!!

The righteous dead are raised, and we, the ones remaining are changed. It states that not all die, but are changed instantly. Compare this with 1 Thessalonians 4: 13-18, which deals with the righteous dead rising first, then those righteous who remain alive next meet in the air, at the Coming/Parousia of Mashiyach. It seems that the emphasis in 1 Corinthians 15: 51-52 is what happens to the believers that remain alive at the Coming/Parousia of Mashiyach, and the emphasis in 1 Thessalonians 4: 13-18 is on what happens to the righteous dead in Mashiyach at His Coming/Parousia. Again, these are the same event, the Coming of Mashiyach Yeshua, and the First Resurrection!!!

(1 Corinthians 15:53) For this corruptible has to put on incorruption, and this mortal to put on immortality.

(1 Corinthians 15:54) And when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall come to be the word that has been written, “Death is swallowed up in overcoming.”

(1 Corinthians 15:55) “O Death, where is your sting? O grave, where is your overcoming?”

(1 Corinthians 15:56) And the sting of death is the sin, and the power of the sin is the Torah.

(1 Corinthians 15:57) But thanks to Elohim who gives us the overcoming through our Master Yeshua Messiah.

(1 Corinthians 15:58) Therefore, my beloved brothers, be steadfast, immovable, always excelling in the work of the Master, knowing that your labour is not in vain in the Master.

Why do pre-tribers always go to Revelation Chapter 4???

REVELATION CHAPTER 4 HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CATCHING AWAY!!! THE WORD HARPAZO IS NOT MENTIONED EVEN ONCE IN THE ENTIRE CHAPTER!!!

Revelation Chapter 4, in its CONTEXT!!!

(Revelation 4:1) After these things I saw. And behold, a door being opened in Heaven! And I heard the first voice as a trumpet speaking with me, saying, Come up here, and I will show you what needs to happen after these things.

Who saw and who heard, Yohanan/John saw and heard.

A door opened in Heaven.

The voice that spoke to him was like a trumpet, saying come up here and I will show you (JOHN) what needs to happen after these things.

Who is told to come up here, the "church", NO, John is told to come up here!!!

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:2) And at once I became in spirit. And, behold, a throne was set in Heaven, and One sitting on the throne.

WHAT HAPPENS AFTER YOHANAN/JOHN SEES, HEARS, AND IS TOLD TO COME UP HERE!!! HE BECAME IN THE SPIRIT AND SEES A THRONE SET IN HEAVEN, AND ONE SITTING ON THE THRONE!!!

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:3) And the One sitting was in appearance like a jasper stone, and a sardius; and a rainbow was around the throne, in appearance like an emerald.

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:4) And around the throne I saw twenty four thrones, and on the thrones I saw twenty four elders sitting, having been clothed in white garments. And they had golden crowns on their heads.

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:5) And out of the throne come forth lightnings and thunders and voices. And seven lamps of fire are burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God;

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:6) and a glassy sea before the throne, like crystal. And in the midst of the throne and around the throne were four living creatures, full of eyes before and behind.

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:7) And the first living creature was like a lion; and the second living creature like a calf; and the third living creature having a face like a man; and the fourth living creature like an eagle flying.

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:8) And the four living creatures each one had six wings around, and within being full of eyes. And they had no rest day and night, saying, "Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty," the One who was, and is, and is coming! Isa. 6:3

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:9) And whenever the living creatures shall give glory and honor and thanks to the One sitting on the throne, to the One living to the ages of the ages,

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:10) the twenty four elders fall down before Him sitting on the throne; and they will worship the One living to the ages of the ages, and will throw their crowns before the throne, saying,

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!



(Revelation 4:11) YHVH, You are worthy to receive the glory and the honor and the power, because You created all things, and through Your will they exist and were created.

THE RAPTURE IS NOT SPOKEN OF ANYWHERE HERE!!!

DO I BELIEVE IN THE HARPAZO/CATCHING AWAY, YES, BUT AS SPOKEN OF IN THE CONTEXT OF SCRIPTURE, NOT MY PERSONAL BELIEF SYSTEM.

DID I USED TO BELIEVE IN THE PRE-TRIB RAPTURE, YES!!! WHY DID I BELIEVE IN THE PRE-TRIB RAPTURE; BECAUSE THIS WAS THE TRADITION AND VIEW TAUGHT TO ME BY CHUCK SMITH, STEVE MAYS, HAL LINDSEY, ETC...

WHY DO I NO LONGER HOLD TO THE PRE-TRIB RAPTURE DOCTRINE; BECAUSE IT DOES NOT HOLD TO BEING TRUE, WHEN THE CONTEXT OF SCRIPTURE IS USED, AND IT ACTUALLY TEACHES THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT YESHUA SAYS!!! YOU KNOW WHAT THE OPPOSITE OF MASHIYACH IS; YEAH YOU GUESSED IT ANTI-MASHIYACH!!!

You can teach just about any doctrine, just as long as you use enough verses out of context. Does this make the doctrine true, NO!!!

Am I afraid of being left behind, not in the least! YHVH can preserve me on earth as He did with Noah, Lot, and the Hebrews in Egypt.

We were warned by Yeshua and those talmid/taught ones that walked with Him in the following verses about false prophets and false doctrines (teachings). There are many more verses of warning, including many from TaNaKh that I am not including.

Warnings:

(Mattithyahu/Matthew 24:11) And many false prophets shall rise up and lead many astray.

(Matthew 24:12) And because of the increase in Torah-lessness (Greek word is “anomia”, Strong’s #458) the love of many shall become cold.

G458

anomia

an-om-ee'-ah

From G459; illegality, that is, violation of law or (generally) wickedness: - iniquity, X transgress (-ion of) the law, unrighteousness.

“Anomia” literally means violation of Torah (Greek word is “nomos”, Strongs’s #3551)!!!

(2 Kepha/Peter 3:16) as also in all his epistles, speaking in them concerning these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the unlearned and unsettled pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures/TaNaKh, to their own destruction.

(2 Peter 3:17) Then beloved, you knowing beforehand, watch lest being led away by the error of the lawless you fall from your own steadfastness.

(2 Peter 3:18) But grow in grace and knowledge of our Master and Savior, Yeshua HaMashiyach. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amein.

(2 Timothy 3:1) But know this, that in the last days grievous times will be upon us.

(2 Timothy 3:2) For men will be lovers of themselves, money-lovers, braggarts, arrogant, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

(2 Timothy 3:3) without natural feeling, unyielding, slanderers, without self-control, savage, haters of good,

(2 Timothy 3:4) betrayers, reckless, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of Elohim,

(2 Timothy 3:5) having a form of g-dliness, but denying the power of it; even turn away from these.

(2 Timothy 3:6) For of these are those creeping into houses and leading silly women captive, the ones having been heaped with sins, being led away by various lusts,

(2 Timothy 3:7) always learning, but never being able to come to a full knowledge of the truth.

(2 Timothy 3:8) But in the way Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so also these withstand the truth, men having been corrupted in mind, found worthless concerning the faith.

(2 Timothy 3:9) But they will not go further, for their foolishness will be plain to all, as also that of those became.

(2 Timothy 3:10) But you have closely followed my doctrine, the conduct, the purpose, the faith, the long-suffering, the love, the patient endurance,

(2 Timothy 3:11) the persecutions, the sufferings, such as happened to me in Antioch, in Iconium, in Lystra, what persecutions I bore. And the YHVH delivered me out of all.

(2 Timothy 3:12) And, indeed, all desiring to live g-dly in Mashiyach Yeshua will be persecuted.

(2 Timothy 3:13) But evil men and pretenders will go forward to worse, leading astray and being led astray.

(2 Timothy 3:14) But you keep on in what you learned and were assured of, knowing from whom you learned,

(2 Timothy 3:15) and that from a babe you know the Holy Scriptures (TaNaKh), those being able to make you wise to salvation through belief in Mashiyach Yeshua.

(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture (TaNaKh) is G-d-breathed and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness (This is the definition of TORAH!!!),

(2 Timothy 3:17) so that the man of Elohim may be perfected, being fully furnished for every good work.

(2 Timothy 4:3) For a time will be when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own lusts, they will heap up to themselves teachers tickling the ear;

(2 Timothy 4:4) and they will turn away the ear from the truth and will be turned aside to myths.

The DANGERS of false doctrines/teachings, such as the pre-tribulation “rapture”!!!

The pre-tribulation rapture, meaning that the body of Mashiyach is taken out before the Great Tribulation, is harmful on many levels. First off, the pre-tribulation “rapture” is NOT Scriptural!!!

I heard a pastor that has about 12,000 attendees every sun-day, say that even if we did have to go through the Tribulation, he would not be dismayed and take the mark of the beast, nor lose his faith. How thoughtful of him, what about the 12,000 that attend his chapel, and the countless thousands that hear him around the world???

What about the countless believers throughout the world that are martyred and suffer major tribulation now; I guess they just live in the wrong country, and only the believers in the "Christian" nation of America will be raptured before the Tribulation. I do NOT think so!

Before any of you say if you do not like this country then leave. It is not the country but the wicked leadership that has sold us out to the New World Order, and trashed the beautiful Constitution!!! I am not against our soldiers; I am against the unjust war for global domination and oil that our wicked leaders and the military industrial complex are profiting off of, at the expense of our young men and women!!!

I am not against Israel, but against the oppression of the people within its borders. Both Jews and the Arabs that call themselves “Palestinians” are suffering at the hand of the anti-Torah and anti-Mashiyach government officials of Israel!!! Wake up Israel, you are setting yourself up for a major fall! Put your trust back in YHVH and not in any prince or nation!!!

If everyone would simply do their homework, they would realize that the events that are taking place have all been orchestrated!!! The wicked in high places rule by fear, intimidation, deceit, force, oppression, etc...; they create so called order out of chaos!!!

Please listen to the Word’s of Yeshua!!!

(Mattithyahu/Matthew 24:25) Behold, I have told you beforehand.

(Matthew 24:26) Therefore if they shall say to you, Behold, He is in the desert! Do not go out. Behold, He is in the secret rooms! Do not believe it.

(Matthew 24:27) For as the lightning comes out of the east and shines even to the west, so also will be the coming/parousia/3952 of the Son of Adam.

(Matthew 24:28) For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered.

(Matthew 24:29) And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun shall be darkened and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from the heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.

(Matthew 24:30) And then the sign of the Son of Adam shall appear in the heavens. And then all the tribes of the earth shall mourn, and they shall see the Son of Adam coming in the clouds of the heaven with power and great glory.

(Matthew 24:31) And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

After reading the Word's of Yeshua in Mattithyahu; I can see no other option for when the catching away occurs, but after the Tribulation. Yes, that is right, we are going through it, be ready. Remember, YHVH is able to keep us through it, and if we are killed, only our bodies are not working; they can not kill our soul in Mashiyach. If you never bowed the knee to Yeshua as Mashiyach, PLEASE do not hesitate to teshuva/repent and receive the Mashiyach of ALL peoples and nations!!! HE came the first time as Mashiyach Ben Yoseph, the LAMB of Elohim that laid down His Life for us!!! Yeshua will return as Mashiyach Ben Dawid, the Conquering LION of the Tribe of Yehudah, to set up the Kingdom on earth from Yerushalayim, Yisrael!!!

I am afraid that many of you will continue to walk in the teachings of men, and not listen to what Yeshua says, my heart breaks at this thought, but what else can I do. If you will not listen to His Words, and you continue to take Scripture out of Context to fit your belief system, you will continue to walk in the doctrines of men and their traditions.

Most of the confusion is cleared up by simply staying within the CONTEXT!



May YHVH bless and keep you all in the Name (Authority) of Yeshua HaMashiyach!!!

Eliyah Ben Yisrael
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1269125
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03/18/2011 01:14 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
You are correct.

The Christians have been brainwashed to believe that they would be raptured before the tribulation to keep them from preparing for these days and and to prevent them from fighting the evil doers all of this time in an effort to prevent/slow the Illuminati/NWO end game plans.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 01:16 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
You are correct.

The Christians have been brainwashed to believe that they would be raptured before the tribulation to keep them from preparing for these days and and to prevent them from fighting the evil doers all of this time in an effort to prevent/slow the Illuminati/NWO end game plans.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1269125


No he is incorrect......
Spitting Into The Wind

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03/18/2011 01:20 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
Matthew 24 and Mark 13 tells all we need to know. Take this to the Lord in prayer! Ask for truth and He will give it to you.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 01:22 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
That's right, no pre-trib rapture. He who endures to the end shall be saved...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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03/18/2011 01:30 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
You are correct.

The Christians have been brainwashed to believe that they would be raptured before the tribulation to keep them from preparing for these days and and to prevent them from fighting the evil doers all of this time in an effort to prevent/slow the Illuminati/NWO end game plans.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1269125


No he is incorrect......
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1012325


Please reveal my error, and I will retract my article and retract this information.

Also, if "Project Blue-Beam" has any merit, it will fit in perfectly with the FALSE "pre-tribulation rapture" doctrine and really shatter whatever faith "pre-trib believers" had. They are going to freak out because they have been brain washed to believe, "they have been left behind..."

Shalom, all I can say is that I tried to warn you.

Eliyah Ben Yisrael
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 04:08 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
GREAT DOCUMENTATION!!!
But if your read what the Early Church Fathers taught... they CLEARLY taught a pretrib rapture.... going so far as to say that anyone who teaches or thinks differently is extremely immature and should not be listened to.

I would term that FAIL!
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 04:18 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
GREAT DOCUMENTATION!!!
But if your read what the Early Church Fathers taught... they CLEARLY taught a pretrib rapture.... going so far as to say that anyone who teaches or thinks differently is extremely immature and should not be listened to.

I would term that FAIL!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1284035


Complete :bs:

OP is correct.
".
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Netherlands
03/18/2011 04:23 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
well i don't know.

they don't like there own kids they only like a few stupid buildings.

they realy wait on something because the human will not change.

they throw away lots and lots of fun for nothing.

and that all for ?
Anonymous Coward
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Australia
03/18/2011 04:28 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
GREAT DOCUMENTATION!!!
But if your read what the Early Church Fathers taught... they CLEARLY taught a pretrib rapture.... going so far as to say that anyone who teaches or thinks differently is extremely immature and should not be listened to.

I would term that FAIL!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1284035


Jesus said when he returns is the first ressurection...yes???


And those who are alive and remain get taken just AFTER this...


So how can the rapture happen BEFORE the first ressurection?

1st Thessalonians 4:14-17
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them that sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. (DEAD)
16 For the Lord himself shall descend with a shout, with the voice of an arch angel, and with the trump of God: and the dead will rise first:(FIRST RESSURECTION)17 Then (MEANING RIGHT AFTER THE FIRST RESSURECTION)we which are alive and remain (THOSE THAT ENDURED TO THE END AND SURVIVED)shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air, (THE RAPTURE)and so we shall ever be with the Lord.

There can be no resurrection before the first resurrection, otherwise it would be a SECOND ressurection..or a THIRD even, therefore there can not be a mass resurrection of the dead in Christ before the tribulation. Seeing that the first resurrection takes place at the end of the tribulation, the pretrib rapture along with the mid trib, and pre wrath rapture become biblically impossible. The only view that fits is that of a post trib rapture. The first resurrection is the resurrection of the just and the rapture immediately proceeds it.

But then..to sell all the books...and all the movies...and make millions of dollars for the false teachers..you simply HAVE to ignore what the bible clearly says.

Its all about the BUCKS...always has been...always will be.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 04:30 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
GREAT DOCUMENTATION!!!
But if your read what the Early Church Fathers taught... they CLEARLY taught a pretrib rapture.... going so far as to say that anyone who teaches or thinks differently is extremely immature and should not be listened to.

I would term that FAIL!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1284035


Show me a document in which the early church fathers taught of a pre-tribulation rapture, because I've never seen one.
S'gan-Levi

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03/18/2011 04:31 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
That's right, no pre-trib rapture. He who endures to the end shall be saved...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288139

^^^THIS^^^
Revelation 1:7 "Behold, He comes with clouds; and every eye shall see Him, and they also which pierced Him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Even so, Amen."

Zechariah 12:10 "And I will pour on the house of David, and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look on Me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for Him, as one mourns for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for Him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn."
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 04:32 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
Mmmmm that tastes good joint rolled out of bible mmmMMMMmmmmmmmmm
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 04:33 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
It is impossible to get a pre-tribulation rapture from the Bible unless you seriously misconstrue and twist the scripture around to fit your needs. People who believe in a pre-tribulation rapture need to open their Bibles up and read things for themselves instead of relying on the teachings of those who are out solely to make money.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 05:22 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
I'm amazed about the trouble people go through to debunk the pre-trib rapture. Why? Why why why why? If you think it's false just ignore it. It must be thousands of different beliefs represented on GLP. Why does the pri-trib rapture stir up such anger?
Armageddon Thru To You

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03/18/2011 09:00 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
There won't be for folks like you. You can't believe the Church is the body of Christ, modeled after an ancient Jewish wedding practice, and then ignore the bridal week mentioned in Genesis and elsewhere. Yes, those who believe like you may find that their faith was not deemed worthy and will therefore not see it.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1290728
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03/18/2011 09:11 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
You are correct.

The Christians have been brainwashed to believe that they would be raptured before the tribulation to keep them from preparing for these days and and to prevent them from fighting the evil doers all of this time in an effort to prevent/slow the Illuminati/NWO end game plans.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1269125


No he is incorrect......
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1012325


Please reveal my error, and I will retract my article and retract this information.

Also, if "Project Blue-Beam" has any merit, it will fit in perfectly with the FALSE "pre-tribulation rapture" doctrine and really shatter whatever faith "pre-trib believers" had. They are going to freak out because they have been brain washed to believe, "they have been left behind..."

Shalom, all I can say is that I tried to warn you.

Eliyah Ben Yisrael
 Quoting: Eliyah


Problem is, they can't reveal any error's.

I will add thanks for the posting. Good post.
Might wake up one or two, but the others are already brain washed and are not sealed with 'truth'.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 09:12 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
The majority of UK churches have NO teachings about pre- tribulation rapture.

Is this mainly as US thing ?
ceawaves

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03/18/2011 09:14 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
it's been a man made up, added to story, So they would not know the times they are living in..
me777

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03/18/2011 09:17 AM

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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
That's right, no pre-trib rapture. He who endures to the end shall be saved...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288139

^^^THIS^^^
 Quoting: S'gan-Levi

Subscribe to my blog:
Exposing The Darkness
End times headline news. Research and analysis of world events in light of Bible prophecy.
[link to lionessofjudah.substack.com (secure)]
Anonymous Coward
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Australia
03/18/2011 09:22 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
There is no pre trib rapture. The tribulation will start with the Pole flip, on the 8th of October, just prior to Jesus opening the 7th Seal, when God will send his 7 Angels.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 09:30 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
May 21 2011 will be a sad day for many.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 09:31 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
The black ops folks placed that in the religious teachings back in the late 1880's and they remodel the bible as neccessary. What the teaching is, that when the planet goes into pole reversal or nuclear meltdown, the people are evacuated prior to those events.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 09:37 AM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
I was thrown out of a church because I did not by into the false doctrine of the rapture.

Had the elder, president of the church scream at me at the top of his lungs that the rapture was true and I was evil for not believing it.

I laughed at his ignorance and everyone got to see that elders demeanor quite clearly that day.

If you pull the rug out from those that believe the rapture, you will get a blasting. They love the word rapture more than Christ.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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United States
03/18/2011 12:10 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
GREAT DOCUMENTATION!!!
But if your read what the Early Church Fathers taught... they CLEARLY taught a pretrib rapture.... going so far as to say that anyone who teaches or thinks differently is extremely immature and should not be listened to.

I would term that FAIL!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1284035


Laughable! :)

Seems that you have chosen to fallow the early "church" f-thers instead of Yeshua and what his original taught ones had to say.

You need to realize how many lies crept in via the so called "church" f-thers.

Here is an interesting read if Scripture in context is not enough to convince you:

The Rapture
of the Saints

by Duncan McDougall

A detailed, suspense filled account of how Christian groups in England were infiltrated in the 1600's and sold the fallacious "Rapture" doctrine. The basis of the Rapture teaching was to take pressure off Roman Catholicism which was branded by early Christians as "The Mystery Harlot of Babylon". A serious read for Christian Bible students. This is the account of a Jesuit priest who posed as a Jewish Rabbi converted to Christianity who invented the rapture doctrine.

WORD document download:
[link to www.mashiyach.com]

PDF document download:
[link to www.mashiyach.com]

But then again, there might be no convincing you of the truth.

Shalom,

Eliyah Ben Yisrael
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1047766
United States
03/18/2011 12:21 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
WTF? You means christians don't ALL AGREE?

tounge

So - at least half of you are going to that hell that you assume is for everyone else.

That must suck for you.
Anonymous Coward
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03/18/2011 12:25 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
That's right, no pre-trib rapture. He who endures to the end shall be saved...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1288139


There will be no pre-tribulation rapture. Believers have been brainwashed by a doctrine that is appealing but not scripturally supported.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 733974
Canada
03/18/2011 12:29 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
Non of you truly know,argue back and forth claiming each is right,either way when it happens regardless you have to be prepared and still no guarantees YOU are going.
dereistic

User ID: 846424
United Kingdom
03/18/2011 12:30 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
No such thing as rapture. Now raptors, yes, those are real.
"And as things fell apart, nobody paid much attention"
Anonymous Coward
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United States
03/18/2011 12:31 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
Non of you truly know,argue back and forth claiming each is right,either way when it happens regardless you have to be prepared and still no guarantees YOU are going.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 733974



Dude - none of them know if the bible is even TRUE. No matter what they say, it's all based on a "feeling". Not one of these people KNOWS anything that they spew about.

Fact.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 1292606
United States
03/18/2011 12:38 PM
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Re: No such thing as a "pre-tribulation rapture"...
Non of you truly know,argue back and forth claiming each is right,either way when it happens regardless you have to be prepared and still no guarantees YOU are going.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 733974


I never claimed to be anything, let alone right or wrong.

I am simply showing what is actually written within the texts that so called "believers" claim to believe and adhere to.

Sadly most that claim they follow the Messiah, are actually following the opposite.

I direct my life based on the Written Torah taking everything else in CONTEXT.

Yes, I FEAR the Creator YHVH/YaHWeH.

Yes, I believe Yeshua was and is Mashiyach.

No, I am NOT welcome in the "churches/assemblies/synagogues" of the mainstream religious movements of the world.

Shalom,

Eliyah





GLP