They that love their father, mother, son or daughter more than Christ do not deserve Christ. Believers must bear the sword.

Real parents love their children more than anything and anyone.

This type of shit is exactly why relegion needs to be abolished.

A person loves their family the most when they tell them the truth and live right. I don't think you understand what we believe.

I do not deserve Christ

The OP has given an Extremely Sound witness.

Not so much Christ as The Father MUST Be FIRST in your life!

Can't keep The First Commandment if you love anyone or anything more than you Love God...

Jesus Witnesses that even the thief loves his children. How much more fully and completely does Our Father In Heaven Love each of us than our earthly parents? About a trillion times more...


Not so much that "Believers must bear the sword" as Believers must Trust God Fully With Every Aspect of their lives. Make your surrender Unto The Father. Give HIM Dominion over all your life. HE already Has It, but you must surrender self Unto HIM...

Surrender is like a Medieval Knight giving his dagger or sword to the New King he swears fealty to, and then lays his head on the King's Knee so King may Do As HE Wills with the gift the Knight has made of his life...

Can't love anyone or anything more than you Love God.
Have to Trust God Fully with every aspect of your life.


Maranatha!!!

Those who love themselves and their family more than Christ when they die will go to hell.

You dorks must not have kids.

Sorry, but only a realist can love something they can see and touch. A realist won't and can't love something that can't be touched or seen.

Daydreamers and wishers are the ones who are fully capable of loving something that doesn't actually exist.

Put simply, your love is based on FALSE HOPE.

I have children. I remember my first love. The greatest of all the commandments.

So I have been told. I am glad that I will be going to hell with the family I love.

Creepy shit.

fck you asshat.

"First love" of Revelation 2:4? The word for love in that verse is agape. 2John 1:6 gives us a definition of agape.

2John 1:6, "And this is love, that we walk after his commandments."

Therefore, loving God with all your heart is obeying him with all your heart. Otherwise you may fall into this cateogory:

Titus 1:16, "They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate."

Mark 7:6-9, "He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do. And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition."

There are two primary words for "love" in the Greek NT: phileo and agape. Phileo means affection, agape means commandments.

Some of us do not, some of us do. Much of us have family members we love dearly who do not want the truth. We have no choice but to separate from them.

Don't want your god.

Loving is doing.

OP

Would you sell your children into slavery?

hello, just giving you a bump.

OP You're an idiot. Take your blasphemies far from here. Fool xtian.

I think Jesus said whoever gives to a child or a poor person, loves the sick and the blind, has loved me, so the only tangible way you can love Christ is by loving the less fortunate. It is impossible for a man to love god, only vice versa.

i do not understand why there is so much controversy. it is simple. you can love your families. but God must be first and foremost. your wife will love you. and the way its supposed to work is than both of you are mindful of God and will work together to solve the problems that arise.

your love for the Lord is supposed to set an example for your children to observe and follow when they get older, mindful there is a God. when they marry they enter the relationship love God first and formost, perhaps as an example to their spouse and unto their own children as well.

love is conditional. if your children turn out to be murderers you should be the first to lock them up. without justice there can be no love. they go together.

all things of this earth will pass, God is forever.

Just because the family disagrees about something doesnt mean total separation. after the Gospel went to the Gentiles Paul told the desciples that if new converts were married to non believers they could remain married to them. but that we should not married non believers. it is interesting he said to remain married to the non believer! (Corinthians 7)

My family (relatives) are masonic (secretly) and put pentagrams all over their house. this has caused many problems between us. my own beliefs about the true sabbath and dietary truth only causes more division, and this will happen. truth is more important. they also reject 9/11 truth and anything negative about washington. total obamanauts.

All people throughout their lives are slaves one way or another, so that would depend on what you mean by "slavery" and what you mean by "sell." I'll give you an example of the sanctioned "slavery" of a child from birth to death:

1Samuel 1:1-2, "Now there was a certain man of Ramathaimzophim, of mount Ephraim, and his name was Elkanah, the son of Jeroham, the son of Elihu, the son of Tohu, the son of Zuph, an Ephrathite: And he had two wives; the name of the one was Hannah, and the name of the other Peninnah: and Peninnah had children, but Hannah had no children."

1Samuel 1:5-6, "But unto Hannah he gave a worthy portion; for he loved Hannah: but the LORD had shut up her womb. And her adversary also provoked her sore, for to make her fret, because the LORD had shut up her womb."

1Samuel 1:11, "And she vowed a vow, and said, O LORD of hosts, if thou wilt indeed look on the affliction of thine handmaid, and remember me, and not forget thine handmaid, but wilt give unto thine handmaid a man child, then I will give him unto the LORD all the days of his life, and there shall no razor come upon his head."

1Samuel 1:19-20, "And they rose up in the morning early, and worshipped before the LORD, and returned, and came to their house to Ramah: and Elkanah knew Hannah his wife; and the LORD remembered her. Wherefore it came to pass, when the time was come about after Hannah had conceived, that she bare a son, and called his name Samuel, saying, Because I have asked him of the LORD."

1Samuel 1:22, "But Hannah went not up; for she said unto her husband, I will not go up until the child be weaned, and then I will bring him, that he may appear before the LORD, and there abide for ever."

How's that for "selling" your child into "slavery?"

Last Edited by Philemon on 05/06/2011 12:10 AM

The reason it is hard for people to understand and accept is because it involves giving up on yourself and your dreams of becoming "somebody." But in order for anyone to give up on themselves, God must first chastise them. That is how it happened to me; that is how it happens to all believers.

Last Edited by Philemon on 05/06/2011 12:26 AM

I have 3, and i put Christ before them. You see, some of us actually BELIEVE in the resurrection. If you actually believe in something 100%, then it drives out all fear and second-guessing. I believe 100% that Christ was God in flesh, and i believe that God created all existence as we know it, therefor by rank, and by default, God is the obvious choice above everything else- even your own kids.

I believe the reason Christ gave this teaching is to try and explain that some of our closest loved ones will be cast into hell, and that if those loved ones are closer to you than the savior, then naturally you would have hatred towards God for his punishment of your loved ones.

We as true believers have to be prepared to see even our kids possibly go to the bad place, because once they reach the age of accountability, their own choices will dictate where they spend eternity......regardless of whether or not they are our children. Once we all stand before the great throne of God, it's every man for himself....unless you have held Christ as the one above all else, in which case he is your judge and declares you innocent.

The criteria for total separation are as follows:

(1) If the person teaches a counterfeit gospel.
Galatians 1:8-9, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed."

(2) If anyone does not abide in the doctrine of Christ.
2John 1:9-11, "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: for he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

(3) If a person is sinning presumptuously.
1Corinithians 5:11, "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat."
1Corinithians 5:13, "But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."

The grounds for reconciliation of the "excommunicated" are as follows:

Matthew 3:8, "Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance"

Acts 26:20 "....Shewed first unto them ...that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."



Yes, Paul did say a believer could remain married to an unbeliever if married prior to conversion and if the unbeliever is pleased to stay with that person. But Paul also said that if the unbeliever is not pleased to stay, the believer should let that person leave.

As for a believer marrying an unbeliever: not a good idea at all. A believer that is very serious about the bible marrying someone who is not serious about the bible is not only a bad idea but almost entirely prohibited by the bible, on that grounds that it will most likely lead the spouse and/or future children astray and into error.

You say God will send people to hell for loving their family? Seems unlikely.

Those who love family and falsehood more than truth and reality do not deserve Christ. And those who do not have Christ do not have eternal life.

Last Edited by Philemon on 05/06/2011 01:50 AM