Godlike Productions - Discussion Forum
Users Online Now: 2,208 (Who's On?)Visitors Today: 1,099,905
Pageviews Today: 1,988,539Threads Today: 877Posts Today: 15,291
10:27 PM


Rate this Thread

Absolute BS Crap Reasonable Nice Amazing
 

How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?

 
TXGal4Truth

User ID: 1013398
United States
07/28/2011 08:29 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
It is a weak & pathetic argument to think that if you commit a sin, it is ok because supposedly some bugger who died 2000 years ago will allow you to escape punishment & judgement. What a load of bollocks. If you commit any sin you are the one who is responsible and will have to face the subsequent consequences. Confessing your sins on Sunday then doing sinful acts during the week is like a vortex whose depth is never ending.
 Quoting: EvilBugger


No one ever said that you can go on sinning EB. And the whole confession thing should be between the Father and Child alone.

Oh and one more thing...the actual Sabbath begins on Friday evening and ends on Saturday evening. Sadly the RCC changed it.

:)
So have I now become your enemy for telling you the TRUTH? Galatians 4:16
***********************************
You call me paranoid. I call you uninformed.

:tgdmwt:
teacup

User ID: 1457660
Australia
07/28/2011 08:29 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
God used to be quite happy with animal sacrifices. He used to content himself smelling the burned flesh, but like all psychos, he graduated to human sacrifice. First he had people just cut bits of their bodies off, but I guess that was not enough, so he moved in to full blown slaughter and cruel death like cruxifixion.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


If you do not accept the sacrifice that God Himself made for mankind, then you will die in your sins, and be required to pay to the uttermost. I pray that God grants your wicked soul the light of His redemption in Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


I am just quoting this so that you have a chance to re-read it. There is nothing godly in using prayer as a weapon. And those words were not spoken with true hope that the person you wrote them too will have redemption. They were daggers.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


I truly prayed for the individual that posted it. What I spoke was the truth, all who do not accept the sacrifce of Jesus Christ will be damned, that's the truth, and it would be unloving to say anything otherwise. Edited to add: I am also a wicked soul apart from Jesus Christ, and His righteous sacrifice.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


Jesus is love, He would never let any of his children be 'damned'. Personally, I find your words evil. It is not the truth, its a threat by the church.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1394404
United States
07/28/2011 08:29 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
God is both righteous and He is just. We all have sin, which requires justice (in the same way that heinous crimes have a consequence and punishment...a judge in court would not be serving justice if he were not to sentence a crime that was committed...justice would not be served, and he would be a corrupt and immoral judge). God is not unjust or immoral. God is Just. BUT God is also righteous and loving, so the payment of sin, which is death, was taken by Christ. Christ received death not just physically, but spiritually. In the moment that Christ was on the Cross, the spiritual wrath of God was placed on Christ. He experienced the agony of God's wrath for the sins committed by man.

God Himself took the punishment that is required for justice to be served, while simultaneously committing the most loving and self-sacrificial act imaginable. Christ lived a perfect and sinless life, what we are incapable of doing, and was completely blameless...and yet had the sins of man imputed upon Him, while His righteous was imputed on us. The balance was then paid. Once imputed with His righteousness, we are now seen as blameless before God. His sinlessness, through His act of atonement, was transferred to us, it is credited to our account because the payment was made for justice to be served.

This does not give us a license to sin, or to continue doing what we are doing scott-free....once you realize the magnitude of the act performed on our behalf, you will no longer want to sin, and will respond with praise and gratitude at the realization of your redemption, and how undeserving you are of it...and how merciful and sacrificial it was for Him to pay the price for you when He didn't have to, for no other reason than out of love for His own children. Many parents would take a sacrifice for their children...and what God did is infinitely greater. He took the punishment for all the sins of man.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1394404


Yes, but, as I have said, I am well aware of everything you just said. I have read the same book many times. It is spelled out very clearly in that book but, when it comes to actually explaining what changed, there is no answer. There are just metaphors of his blood and how clean we are now. But in terms of actually saying "Jesus died and his soul left his body with such force that it created a void so intense that all of the energy vibrating at the same frequency was sucked in, inescapably. The only energy that matches the void's vibration is Sin. Hence we are all washed of our sins.

I understand that explanation is lofty and laughable, but to be honest, it is a better attempt than the Bible ever made.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


It's like a credit transaction, not something that is necessarily tangible, measurable, or based on physics...I suppose if you are looking for the actual mechanisms by which it occurs, a good study to do would be on Imputation and also on Regeneration. In terms of the actual process that occurs, it happens through the Holy Spirit...the Holy Spirit is the medium by which we receive Imputed Righteousness.

Prior to being saved, we are spiritually dead...when we are saved, we are Regenerated. This process occurs through the Holy Spirit (who is like the messenger)...it is when we receive Christ's Imputed Righteousness. That may seem a bit ethereal...but it can actually get quite complicated once you begin to do a deep study on Regeneration or Imputation. On the one hand, what your asking is similar to asking "what is the substance of God?" It is also like asking "how can you measure infinity?" Kind of tricky, you must admit ;) But our inability to grasp infinite love, power, justice, beauty, etc., etc., is only restricted by our flawed and finite minds. These things exist, nonetheless.
Scrodiddles  (OP)

User ID: 1122076
United States
07/28/2011 08:30 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
You will forgive me when I say that my experience has lead me to never "Just Know" something. It is not wise to take something so profound and just run with it. Especially when those that espouse it as the truth can't actually explain it. I never buy a product that doesn't have instructions and, as far as I can tell, the bible is lacking instructions on a very large part of it's teachings.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Nothing to forgive here.

What do want to hear as an explanation that will satisfy you?

Yes, search the depths of God.
But also realize that you don't have to fully comprehend something to be a functional part of it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 498151


I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
I am in search of Truth, but still emptying my cup.
Celia D.

User ID: 1473141
United States
07/28/2011 08:30 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
It is a weak & pathetic argument to think that if you commit a sin, it is ok because supposedly some bugger who died 2000 years ago will allow you to escape punishment & judgement. What a load of bollocks. If you commit any sin you are the one who is responsible and will have to face the subsequent consequences. Confessing your sins on Sunday then doing sinful acts during the week is like a vortex whose depth is never ending.
 Quoting: EvilBugger


But, we don't know if we ever are "punished" for some "sin." We don't really know what the consequences are for our actions, or if there are consequences....

This whole place may have been solely created just for observation by someone else, for their own means.

Last Edited by Celia D. on 07/28/2011 08:31 PM
Needles Eye

User ID: 1480101
United States
07/28/2011 08:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
God used to be quite happy with animal sacrifices. He used to content himself smelling the burned flesh, but like all psychos, he graduated to human sacrifice. First he had people just cut bits of their bodies off, but I guess that was not enough, so he moved in to full blown slaughter and cruel death like cruxifixion.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


If you do not accept the sacrifice that God Himself made for mankind, then you will die in your sins, and be required to pay to the uttermost. I pray that God grants your wicked soul the light of His redemption in Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


Stupid psycho ass did not ask me if I wanted him to sacrifice for me, then he demands payment. What a dipshit. If that's the way he behaves then I want nothing to do with him.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


God was gracious and thoughtful enough to know that you needed a Savior even when you did not know that you needed one. Now you mock Him for selflessly giving His life for you?
The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1485849
Canada
07/28/2011 08:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
God used to be quite happy with animal sacrifices. He used to content himself smelling the burned flesh, but like all psychos, he graduated to human sacrifice. First he had people just cut bits of their bodies off, but I guess that was not enough, so he moved in to full blown slaughter and cruel death like cruxifixion.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


If you do not accept the sacrifice that God Himself made for mankind, then you will die in your sins, and be required to pay to the uttermost. I pray that God grants your wicked soul the light of His redemption in Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


I am just quoting this so that you have a chance to re-read it. There is nothing godly in using prayer as a weapon. And those words were not spoken with true hope that the person you wrote them too will have redemption. They were daggers.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


I truly prayed for the individual that posted it. What I spoke was the truth, all who do not accept the sacrifce of Jesus Christ will be damned, that's the truth, and it would be unloving to say anything otherwise. Edited to add: I am also a wicked soul apart from Jesus Christ, and His righteous sacrifice.
 Quoting: Needles Eye

If you feel the need to waste your life praying then go ahead. Prayer does nothing but waste the minutes of your life. It is unfortunate that people feel the need to pray instead of doing real world work for the betterment of humankind, but I suppose it keeps you out of trouble.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1457831
United States
07/28/2011 08:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
It is a weak & pathetic argument to think that if you commit a sin, it is ok because supposedly some bugger who died 2000 years ago will allow you to escape punishment & judgement. What a load of bollocks. If you commit any sin you are the one who is responsible and will have to face the subsequent consequences. Confessing your sins on Sunday then doing sinful acts during the week is like a vortex whose depth is never ending.
 Quoting: EvilBugger


The question is "Who or what are You willing to die for?"
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1394404
United States
07/28/2011 08:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Sister hf

;)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1394404


hehe I thought that the moment I posted. Please forgive my assumption :)
 Quoting: Needles Eye


No problemo at all! :D
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1485849
Canada
07/28/2011 08:32 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
God used to be quite happy with animal sacrifices. He used to content himself smelling the burned flesh, but like all psychos, he graduated to human sacrifice. First he had people just cut bits of their bodies off, but I guess that was not enough, so he moved in to full blown slaughter and cruel death like cruxifixion.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


If you do not accept the sacrifice that God Himself made for mankind, then you will die in your sins, and be required to pay to the uttermost. I pray that God grants your wicked soul the light of His redemption in Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


Stupid psycho ass did not ask me if I wanted him to sacrifice for me, then he demands payment. What a dipshit. If that's the way he behaves then I want nothing to do with him.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


God was gracious and thoughtful enough to know that you needed a Savior even when you did not know that you needed one. Now you mock Him for selflessly giving His life for you?
 Quoting: Needles Eye

I mock you for wasting your life in superstitious drivel instead of actually reading the words Jesus spoke and following his example.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1475638
United States
07/28/2011 08:33 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Yes, but, as I have said, I am well aware of everything you just said. I have read the same book many times. It is spelled out very clearly in that book but, when it comes to actually explaining what changed, there is no answer. There are just metaphors of his blood and how clean we are now. But in terms of actually saying "Jesus died and his soul left his body with such force that it created a void so intense that all of the energy vibrating at the same frequency was sucked in, inescapably. The only energy that matches the void's vibration is Sin. Hence we are all washed of our sins.

I understand that explanation is lofty and laughable, but to be honest, it is a better attempt than the Bible ever made.


Washing away sins is a metaphor.

But Jesus' blood sacrifice? How can you think that was anything other than literal?

Just because it doesn't fit the 20k meta physical jargon doesn't make it a bad attempt. Maybe you just make a bad attempt at being willing to accept it?
Needles Eye

User ID: 1480101
United States
07/28/2011 08:34 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
...


If you do not accept the sacrifice that God Himself made for mankind, then you will die in your sins, and be required to pay to the uttermost. I pray that God grants your wicked soul the light of His redemption in Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


I am just quoting this so that you have a chance to re-read it. There is nothing godly in using prayer as a weapon. And those words were not spoken with true hope that the person you wrote them too will have redemption. They were daggers.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


I truly prayed for the individual that posted it. What I spoke was the truth, all who do not accept the sacrifce of Jesus Christ will be damned, that's the truth, and it would be unloving to say anything otherwise. Edited to add: I am also a wicked soul apart from Jesus Christ, and His righteous sacrifice.
 Quoting: Needles Eye

If you feel the need to waste your life praying then go ahead. Prayer does nothing but waste the minutes of your life. It is unfortunate that people feel the need to pray instead of doing real world work for the betterment of humankind, but I suppose it keeps you out of trouble.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


Prayer is never a waste. What higher work can a person do than appeal to the Almighty and Holy judge of the universe for the eternal salvation of a soul?
The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
cdhowlett
User ID: 1472636
United States
07/28/2011 08:35 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
If you believe at all in the bible, here is the answer:

Adam was perfect, when he sinned in the garden of eden he lost that perfect life, passing on sin to his offspring, also rejecting God's authority to rule humans. God needed another perfect human to balance out what Adam lost, as was foretold in [Genesis 3:14,15].

The nation of Israel needed continual animal sacrifices because no amount of animals can equal a perfect human life. [Hebrews 10:4].

Before Jesus was born on earth, he was Michael, the archangel and first of all creation. [John 8:23]. Jesus was born a perfect human shielded by holy spirit in Mary's womb. [John 11:27] Was on the earth to tell others about God's kingdom [John 18:36] and what that would bring: i.e.: perfection, everlasting life, etc. [John 17:3]. His death paved the way for people to come to an accurate knowledge of God and the bible with the possibility of everlasting life.

He was dead for 3 days, [Luke 24:46] and was around for over a month to continuing teaching his disciples until he was raised to heaven [Hebrews 9:24] to serve as God's vassal king and back to being in his archangel position...ready to fight at [Revelation 19:14, 16] Armageddon and rule 1,000 years. [Isaiah 2:4].

Hope this helps. The added scripture is so you can see I'm quoting the bible.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 498151
United States
07/28/2011 08:36 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Thank you for sharing what you believe.
Needles Eye

User ID: 1480101
United States
07/28/2011 08:36 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I mock you for wasting your life in superstitious drivel instead of actually reading the words Jesus spoke and following his example.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


I have read the Words He spoke, and will continue to pray for the lost.

Last Edited by Needles Eye on 07/28/2011 08:37 PM
The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1483769
United States
07/28/2011 08:36 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I am actually being sincere here. I was raised in a Southern Babtist home and have read the bible a fair share of times, but I am at a total loss when it comes to understanding how Jesus dying on the cross translates into me being forgiven for my "sins".

And please don't just post scripture that just states it matter-of-factly as if I should ignore that we live in a world where things have to correlate.

So they torture him, place him on a cross, and then wait for him to die. He passes away, is reborn and then ascends to heaven. Now I get forgiven if I have impatient thoughts? How does that work? Did he die, go to heaven and flip on a breaker switch, resurrect on earth to check if it worked and then just strolled on back to heaven? What happened during his death that made our sins forgivable?

It's like a father bursting through the door and telling his son that cursing is now allowed in the house because he hit a deer on the way home. How in the world is it connected?
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


It doesn't. the bible is full of lies and so are the teachings about Jesus. The way the soul is constructed, only YOU can clear your sins recorded in your morontial soul. That will be proven as science one day.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1475638
United States
07/28/2011 08:37 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
You will forgive me when I say that my experience has lead me to never "Just Know" something. It is not wise to take something so profound and just run with it. Especially when those that espouse it as the truth can't actually explain it. I never buy a product that doesn't have instructions and, as far as I can tell, the bible is lacking instructions on a very large part of it's teachings.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Nothing to forgive here.

What do want to hear as an explanation that will satisfy you?

Yes, search the depths of God.
But also realize that you don't have to fully comprehend something to be a functional part of it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 498151


I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Washing away sins is a metaphor.

But Jesus' blood sacrifice? How can you think that was anything other than literal?

Just because it doesn't fit the 20k meta physical jargon doesn't make it a bad attempt. Maybe you just make a bad attempt at being willing to accept it?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1486719
United States
07/28/2011 08:37 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Jesus last words on the cross were <<<1 Corinthians 15:55 >>

"Now,Where, O death, is your victory? Where, O death, is your sting?"

The Biblical story of Christ's life and ultimate death on the cross, symbolizes the fulfillment of a long story which began in Genesis, in the Garden of Eden, where man(men and woman) first sinned and received the punishment of death, banishment from the presence of God.

The story finally ends in the New Testament with the telling of the life of Christ and his sacifice on the cross. Just as in Genesis man was sentenced to death, in the end that death becomes nothing more than a portal to life everlasting. Death was conquered by a savior sent to man by God, and man no longer has a spiritual death, only a physical death.

The story goes , "Because God loved man so much, God sends Christ, a savior to restore and return sinful man back to God. The story is long but it is worth the read, you will get, all is explained in the details.

Christ's final words were laughing at death saying, "Hahaah We have won now, Death where is your sting?"
Scrodiddles  (OP)

User ID: 1122076
United States
07/28/2011 08:38 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Yes, but, as I have said, I am well aware of everything you just said. I have read the same book many times. It is spelled out very clearly in that book but, when it comes to actually explaining what changed, there is no answer. There are just metaphors of his blood and how clean we are now. But in terms of actually saying "Jesus died and his soul left his body with such force that it created a void so intense that all of the energy vibrating at the same frequency was sucked in, inescapably. The only energy that matches the void's vibration is Sin. Hence we are all washed of our sins.

I understand that explanation is lofty and laughable, but to be honest, it is a better attempt than the Bible ever made.

Washing away sins is a metaphor.

But Jesus' blood sacrifice? How can you think that was anything other than literal?

Just because it doesn't fit the 20k meta physical jargon doesn't make it a bad attempt. Maybe you just make a bad attempt at being willing to accept it?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1475638


I would hope you can see that I managed to upload a picture and pay for an account on GLP so I am clearly not mentally handicapped. I know better than to take anything in religion as something other than a metaphor. But even the metaphor lacks an explanation. There is no sequence of logic that spells out what exactly changed in both the physical and spiritual world when Jesus was killed. It just says "He died for you. And now your sins are forgiven". That is quite a syntax gap if you asked me. The question is "HOW?!". How in the world did his death actually help me be forgiven. Who was condemning me in the first place? God? So why send another of your creations to be killed and then use that as a catalyst to change your mind? There is a lot of reasoning missing here and metaphor, or not, it just isn't enough to really base something of off.

Last Edited by Scrodiddles on 07/28/2011 08:41 PM
I am in search of Truth, but still emptying my cup.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1472636
United States
07/28/2011 08:39 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
If you believe at all in the bible, here is the answer:

Adam was perfect, when he sinned in the garden of eden he lost that perfect life, passing on sin to his offspring, also rejecting God's authority to rule humans. God needed another perfect human to balance out what Adam lost, as was foretold in [Genesis 3:14,15].

The nation of Israel needed continual animal sacrifices because no amount of animals can equal a perfect human life. [Hebrews 10:4].

Before Jesus was born on earth, he was Michael, the archangel and first of all creation. [John 8:23]. Jesus was born a perfect human shielded by holy spirit in Mary's womb. [John 11:27] Was on the earth to tell others about God's kingdom [John 18:36] and what that would bring: i.e.: perfection, everlasting life, etc. [John 17:3]. His death paved the way for people to come to an accurate knowledge of God and the bible with the possibility of everlasting life.

He was dead for 3 days, [Luke 24:46] and was around for over a month to continuing teaching his disciples until he was raised to heaven {presenting the value of his sacrificial death to God} [Heb. 9:11, 12] [Hebrews 9:24] to serve as God's vassal king and back to being in his archangel position...ready to fight at [Revelation 19:14, 16] Armageddon and rule 1,000 years. [Isaiah 2:4].

Hope this helps. The added scripture is so you can see I'm quoting the bible.
 Quoting: cdhowlett 1472636
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1457831
United States
07/28/2011 08:39 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
You will forgive me when I say that my experience has lead me to never "Just Know" something. It is not wise to take something so profound and just run with it. Especially when those that espouse it as the truth can't actually explain it. I never buy a product that doesn't have instructions and, as far as I can tell, the bible is lacking instructions on a very large part of it's teachings.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Nothing to forgive here.

What do want to hear as an explanation that will satisfy you?

Yes, search the depths of God.
But also realize that you don't have to fully comprehend something to be a functional part of it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 498151


I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


You used a quote so fair is fair: "What My Father has given to Me nothing can take them out of My hand".

Christ beat satan and stole his lunch, now "Where do You want to go today?"
fairflight

User ID: 1071336
United States
07/28/2011 08:40 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
It is a weak & pathetic argument to think that if you commit a sin, it is ok because supposedly some bugger who died 2000 years ago will allow you to escape punishment & judgement. What a load of bollocks. If you commit any sin you are the one who is responsible and will have to face the subsequent consequences. Confessing your sins on Sunday then doing sinful acts during the week is like a vortex whose depth is never ending.
 Quoting: EvilBugger


I don't think any Christian would say that it's "ok" to commit sin because Jesus paid for it.

It's not "ok". Jesus paid a HEAVY price for it, and every sin we commit just adds to that burden. If sin were "ok" to commit, God would not have sent His only begotten Son to pay for it. It's not and never will be "ok
".
 Quoting: Needles Eye


You are right, mostly!
It is not ok, and we will receive the penalty of justice rather than mercy, if we willfully sin.

There are 'Eternal Principles' at play and they are strict.
There are two ways to cleanse ourselves from sin.

Either we believe in and love the Lord and keep his commandments and receive the gift of 'mercy' or we pay the penalty of 'justice' which 'will' be required of us if we do not except the gift of the 'atonement' by keeping Gods commandments.

Last Edited by fairflight on 07/28/2011 08:40 PM
"Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be. ALL truth is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, to act for itself."
EvilBugger

User ID: 1466774
Australia
07/28/2011 08:41 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
It is a weak & pathetic argument to think that if you commit a sin, it is ok because supposedly some bugger who died 2000 years ago will allow you to escape punishment & judgement. What a load of bollocks. If you commit any sin you are the one who is responsible and will have to face the subsequent consequences. Confessing your sins on Sunday then doing sinful acts during the week is like a vortex whose depth is never ending.
 Quoting: EvilBugger


I don't think any Christian would say that it's "ok" to commit sin because Jesus paid for it.

It's not "ok". Jesus paid a HEAVY price for it, and every sin we commit just adds to that burden. If sin were "ok" to commit, God would not have sent His only begotten Son to pay for it. It's not and never will be "ok".
 Quoting: Needles Eye


I wonder how many of these believers think on a sub-conscious level that they can escape their past sins and possible future sins because of this idea that someone else died for everyone's sins. It allows for a dangerous path to be tread by souls who do not understand the law of give and take and who may at one point in life be indifferent as to what they do with their lives and what actions are carried through. In the annals of their minds, they will always have the sub-conscious programming that Jesus died for their sins and therefore a level of naivety may allow for a walk on the razor's edge. And to think that everyone is born a sinner is probably the most self-defeating notion of them all because from the start, a brain-washed soul will always live a life of less magnitude until it breaks free of this ridiculous paradigm.
I throw idiots on the bbq...™

Best Idiot Idiom so far:
You are about as far from the truth as can be ! thats why you are a EvilBugger
 Quoting: AC1457060 - Zionist shill
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1485849
Canada
07/28/2011 08:41 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Prayer is never a waste. What higher work can a person do than appeal to the Almighty and Holy judge of the universe for the eternal salvation of a soul?
 Quoting: Needles Eye


Prayer serves no objective purpose. You people should busy yourself doing what Jesus instructed instead of beating up on people who do not accept you rather evil world view. You so called Christians act out of selfish desire, not the altruism that Jesus instructed. Who teaches this evil drivel that you have committed yourself to? Have you ever read the red words in the Bible?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 498151
United States
07/28/2011 08:42 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Two things:

1. No one will ever be able to explain it to anyone. The belief and understanding is a gift.

2. Regarding the forces of nature: can you explain to anyone everything, both unseen and seen, regarding the force of what we call gravity to the point where the another person will understand everything about it?
Scrodiddles  (OP)

User ID: 1122076
United States
07/28/2011 08:42 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
You will forgive me when I say that my experience has lead me to never "Just Know" something. It is not wise to take something so profound and just run with it. Especially when those that espouse it as the truth can't actually explain it. I never buy a product that doesn't have instructions and, as far as I can tell, the bible is lacking instructions on a very large part of it's teachings.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Nothing to forgive here.

What do want to hear as an explanation that will satisfy you?

Yes, search the depths of God.
But also realize that you don't have to fully comprehend something to be a functional part of it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 498151


I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


You used a quote so fair is fair: "What My Father has given to Me nothing can take them out of My hand".

Christ beat satan and stole his lunch, now "Where do You want to go today?"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1457831


Fair is fair, I agree. But I haven't the slightest clue what you are trying to say to me.
I am in search of Truth, but still emptying my cup.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1475638
United States
07/28/2011 08:43 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
The idea that a God higher with a mind greater than mine, who invented the confines of man's ability to reason, would exist outside the confines of TIME and do things that don't make SENSE to me, seems hardly inappropriate.

Just because YOU don't get it does not mean it cannot be gotten.

The creator of the universe existing outside of time. = Sensible idea.

The creator of the universe giving us eternal/unlimited sin-mulligans because he exists outside of time. = Sensible idea.

Are you so void of understanding "grace" and "forgiveness" that you have to explain it with some sort of new lingo?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1485849
Canada
07/28/2011 08:43 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I mock you for wasting your life in superstitious drivel instead of actually reading the words Jesus spoke and following his example.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485849


I have read the Words He spoke, and will continue to pray for the lost.
 Quoting: Needles Eye


Then you have read, but not comprehended. You are lost.
fairflight

User ID: 1071336
United States
07/28/2011 08:44 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
Yes, but, as I have said, I am well aware of everything you just said. I have read the same book many times. It is spelled out very clearly in that book but, when it comes to actually explaining what changed, there is no answer. There are just metaphors of his blood and how clean we are now. But in terms of actually saying "Jesus died and his soul left his body with such force that it created a void so intense that all of the energy vibrating at the same frequency was sucked in, inescapably. The only energy that matches the void's vibration is Sin. Hence we are all washed of our sins.

I understand that explanation is lofty and laughable, but to be honest, it is a better attempt than the Bible ever made.

Washing away sins is a metaphor.
But Jesus' blood sacrifice? How can you think that was anything other than literal?

Just because it doesn't fit the 20k meta physical jargon doesn't make it a bad attempt. Maybe you just make a bad attempt at being willing to accept it?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1475638


I would hope you can see that I managed to upload a picture and pay for an account on GLP so I am clearly not mentally handicapped. I know better than to take anything in religion as something other than a metaphor. But even the metaphor lacks an explanation. There is no sequence of logic that spells out what exactly changed in both the physical and spiritual world when Jesus was killed. It just says "He died for you. And now your sins are forgiven". That is quite a syntax gap if you asked me. The question is "HOW?!". How in the world did his death actually help me be forgiven. Who was condemning me in the first place? God? So why send another of your creations to be killed and then use that as a catalyst to change your mind? There is a lot of reasoning missing here and metaphor, or not, it just isn't enough to really base something of off.
 Quoting: Scrodiddles



Washing away sins is not just a metaphor. It is a requirement!

This was shown when John baptized the Son of God.
Even in His perfection, it was and is one of the requirements to enter the kingdom of God.

Last Edited by fairflight on 07/28/2011 08:44 PM
"Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be. ALL truth is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, to act for itself."
Scrodiddles  (OP)

User ID: 1122076
United States
07/28/2011 08:44 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: How did Jesus' death wash away our sins?
I will agree with you there. I meditate almost three hours a day and would definitely say that, although I can't possibly fully understand God, I DEFINITELY believe in him/her. I also believe in Jesus and that he is A son of god. As am I. As are you. But the death/sacrifice thing never really got explained well enough for me to understand it. The God I have come to understand uses the elements and forces around us to create this universe. All things are bound by God's creative laws. The sacrifice of Jesus leading to all of our sins being forgiven jumps outside of the laws our God uses to hold this Universe together. There is no correlation. It is basically one statement trying to be connected to another statement. Nothing, within the realm of reason, has seemed to explain this crucifixion thing. All I see is a man that rose above the bindings of the flesh and understood God's workings so perfectly that he could actually make them work for him: i.e. walking on water, curing illness. But his teachings actually fit better if he was trying to explain to people that the only way to rise above the suffering of physical bonds was to seek the truth of our father and ascend just like Jesus: "The only way to salvation is through me".
 Quoting: Scrodiddles


Two things:

1. No one will ever be able to explain it to anyone. The belief and understanding is a gift.

2. Regarding the forces of nature: can you explain to anyone everything, both unseen and seen, regarding the force of what we call gravity to the point where the another person will understand everything about it?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 498151


I can explain WHAT WE KNOW about gravity to anyone and, yes, eventually they will understand it. There is backing to the theories. However, and un-relatedly, I feel we are quite ignorant when it comes to gravities true nature. Now that being said, there is an age old religion built around gravity that has resulted in millions of deaths. At least not yet.
I am in search of Truth, but still emptying my cup.





GLP