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Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.

 
Chrit
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Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Snip; The UN Charter is clear that any use of force against another state is prohibited, unless this is an action of self-defence or is authorised by the Security Council.

With regard to Syria, self-defence is definitely out, as there has been no attack against another state, or even the imminent possibility of such an attack.
Dr James Green, International Law Expert


[link to www.itv.com]



Article 25
The Members of the United Nations agree to accept and carry out the decisions of the Security Council in accordance with the present Charter.



Article 26
In order to promote the establishment and maintenance of international peace and security with the least diversion for armaments of the world's human and economic resources, the Security Council shall be responsible for formulating, with the assistance of the Military Staff Committee referred to in Article 47, plans to be submitted to the Members of the United Nations for the establishment of a system for the regulation of armaments.


Article 33
1. The parties to any dispute, the continuance of which is likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security, shall, first of all, seek a solution by negotiation, enquiry, mediation, conciliation, arbitration, judicial settlement, resort to regional agencies or arrangements, or other peaceful means of their own choice.
2. The Security Council shall, when it deems necessary, call upon the parties to settle their dispute by such means.


Article 34
The Security Council may investigate any dispute, or any situation which might lead to international friction or give rise to a dispute, in order to determine whether the continuance of the dispute or situation is likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security.


Article 35
1. Any Member of the United Nations may bring any dispute, or any situation of the nature referred to in Article 34, to the attention of the Security Council or of the General Assembly.
2. A state which is not a Member of the United Nations may bring to the attention of the Security Council or of the General Assembly any dispute to which it is a party if it accepts in advance, for the purposes of the dispute, the obligations of pacific settlement provided in the present Charter.
3. The proceedings of the General Assembly in respect of matters brought to its attention under this Article will be subject to the provisions of Articles 11 and 12.

Read 11 and 12 if you want, I did not want to add to much info.



Article 37
1. Should the parties to a dispute of the nature referred to in Article 33 fail to settle it by the means indicated in that Article, they shall refer it to the Security Council.
2. If the Security Council deems that the continuance of the dispute is in fact likely to endanger the maintenance of international peace and security, it shall decide whether to take action under Article 36 or to recommend such terms of settlement as it may consider appropriate.


3. Article 39
4. The Security Council shall determine the existence of any threat to the peace, breach of the peace, or act of aggression and shall make recommendations, or decide what measures shall be taken in accordance with Articles 41 and 42, to maintain or restore international peace and security.


Article 51
Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security. Measures taken by Members in the exercise of this right of self-defence shall be immediately reported to the Security Council and shall not in any way affect the authority and responsibility of the Security Council under the present Charter to take at any time such action as it deems necessary in order to maintain or restore international peace and security.

.



Article 53
1. The Security Council shall, where appropriate, utilize such regional arrangements or agencies for enforcement action under its authority. But no enforcement action shall be taken under regional arrangements or by regional agencies without the authorization of the Security Council, with the exception of measures against any enemy state, as defined in paragraph 2 of this Article, provided for pursuant to Article 107 or in regional arrangements directed against renewal of aggressive policy on the part of any such state, until such time as the Organization may, on request of the Governments concerned, be charged with the responsibility for preventing further aggression by such a state.
2. The term enemy state as used in paragraph 1 of this Article applies to any state which during the Second World War has been an enemy of any signatory of the present Charter.


3. Article 106
4. Pending the coming into force of such special agreements referred to in Article 43 as in the opinion of the Security Council enable it to begin the exercise of its responsibilities under Article 42, the parties to the Four-Nation Declaration, signed at Moscow, 30 October 1943, and France, shall, in accordance with the provisions of paragraph 5 of that Declaration, consult with one another and as occasion requires with other Members of the United Nations with a view to such joint action on behalf of the Organization as may be necessary for the purpose of maintaining international peace and security.
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 12:17 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
So the question begs, will the UN fold on article 25 and do nothing and go the way of the League of Nations?

Or will they attempt to enforce the charter and sanction the US for an aggressive action that is illegal with out approvial.
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 12:20 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
bump 5 stars! Thanks for update Chrit! rockon
Chrit  (OP)

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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
bump 5 stars! Thanks for update Chrit! rockon
 Quoting: GT500




UN may not survive by lack of enforcement of their own charter.

Under the charter Russia will be able to legally defend their ally against the aggressor, which would be the US.


I knew memorizing the entire UN charter would one day be useful, just did not imagine it would be useful against illegal US aggression.
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 12:31 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
So the question begs, will the UN fold on article 25 and do nothing and go the way of the League of Nations?

Or will they attempt to enforce the charter and sanction the US for an aggressive action that is illegal with out approvial.
 Quoting: Chrit


Those where some of the intersting points brought up during the intervensions of the floor of the House of Commons, questioning if the UN is going the same way as the league of nations what with all the constant veteos undermining the power of the UN.. it was certainly some food for thought and verbalising what I beleive many people think about the UN.
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08/30/2013 12:34 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
bump 5 stars! Thanks for update Chrit! rockon
 Quoting: GT500




UN may not survive by lack of enforcement of their own charter.

Under the charter Russia will be able to legally defend their ally against the aggressor, which would be the US.


I knew memorizing the entire UN charter would one day be useful, just did not imagine it would be useful against illegal US aggression.
 Quoting: Chrit


I hope we do not do this, it would be a very foolish mistake!

I think we will know by this afternoon what's going down!

Market starting to go red, maybe they know something already we don't!
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08/30/2013 01:03 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
monkey boy don't listen to nobody , needs to go swing on a branch in kennya
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 01:06 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
monkey boy don't listen to nobody , needs to go swing on a branch in kennya
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 3176897


Honey badger don't give a shit!

scream
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 01:25 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Well after that Kerry speech I will have to say Syria is a green light!
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 01:40 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
OK correct me if I'm wrong...

Aren't the ones being gassed the Muslim brotherhood and followers that back the radical Muslims and could be the radical Muslims

So we want to kill them not not with gas?

I'm confused..
Chrit  (OP)

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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Flash back




Head-desk
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 02:53 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
OK correct me if I'm wrong...

Aren't the ones being gassed the Muslim brotherhood and followers that back the radical Muslims and could be the radical Muslims

So we want to kill them not not with gas?

I'm confused..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 44792902


If you’re the leader of Syria who is being attacked by an outside source ”the brotherhood” and you are clearly winning and you also know for a fact if you use chemical weapons that the UN will intervene why would you use chemical weapons?

Now if you’re the brotherhood and losing a proxy revolution funded by outside sources, but you know if you gas your own people and blame the Syrian government that the UN will intervene and change the fate of the war you are currently loosing. Would you not have any choice but to use the chemical weapons to attempt to force outside intervention?
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
davvi

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08/30/2013 02:56 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
So the question begs, will the UN fold on article 25 and do nothing and go the way of the League of Nations?

Or will they attempt to enforce the charter and sanction the US for an aggressive action that is illegal with out approvial.
 Quoting: Chrit


Hmm...such a dilemma for the Organization Against White people who do they support, the black guy or the muzz?
davvi

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08/30/2013 02:57 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
OK correct me if I'm wrong...

Aren't the ones being gassed the Muslim brotherhood and followers that back the radical Muslims and could be the radical Muslims

So we want to kill them not not with gas?

I'm confused..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 44792902


If you’re the leader of Syria who is being attacked by an outside source ”the brotherhood” and you are clearly winning and you also know for a fact if you use chemical weapons that the UN will intervene why would you use chemical weapons?

Now if you’re the brotherhood and losing a proxy revolution funded by outside sources, but you know if you gas your own people and blame the Syrian government that the UN will intervene and change the fate of the war you are currently loosing. Would you not have any choice but to use the chemical weapons to attempt to force outside intervention?
 Quoting: Chrit


***THIS***
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 02:59 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
OK correct me if I'm wrong...

Aren't the ones being gassed the Muslim brotherhood and followers that back the radical Muslims and could be the radical Muslims

So we want to kill them not not with gas?

I'm confused..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 44792902


If you’re the leader of Syria who is being attacked by an outside source ”the brotherhood” and you are clearly winning and you also know for a fact if you use chemical weapons that the UN will intervene why would you use chemical weapons?

Now if you’re the brotherhood and losing a proxy revolution funded by outside sources, but you know if you gas your own people and blame the Syrian government that the UN will intervene and change the fate of the war you are currently loosing. Would you not have any choice but to use the chemical weapons to attempt to force outside intervention?
 Quoting: Chrit


December 12, 2012

Snip; The rebels have seized chemical weapons, and they are willing to use them on innocent people. According to Russia Today, Syrian rebels have obtained chemical weapons from Libya and are planning on using them on civilians, and then blaming it on Assad. This is an effort between the Syrian rebels and their allies in Turkey, alongside cooperation with Libyan rebels under Abdel Hakim bel Haj.

[link to frontpagemag.com]

I did a very detailed analyses on it very early about the real damage removing a government form Libya did before the main stream even picked it up.

from 11/28/2012 Thread: WH: Obama 'Is Not Particularly Concerned' Whether Susan Rice Misled the American People (Page 5)
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 02:59 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
The League Of Nations was inept.

The United Nations has become inept.

It is now seen as an obstacle to war as opposed to an instrument for peace.

No one goes to the UN to resolve a dispute peacefully, they only go there to try an action a war, thats if they can be bothered to go through the motions.

The UN is now just another corrupt institution that means nothing.
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08/30/2013 03:02 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
The League Of Nations was inept.

The United Nations has become inept.

It is now seen as an obstacle to war as opposed to an instrument for peace.

No one goes to the UN to resolve a dispute peacefully, they only go there to try an action a war, thats if they can be bothered to go through the motions.

The UN is now just another corrupt institution that means nothing.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45985576


exactly where we were just prior to ww2

not good
violentoppisition

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08/30/2013 03:10 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Who is the head, or in charge of the u.n. security council?
Look that up to find out were fucked
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 03:15 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Flash back




Head-desk
 Quoting: Chrit


“Us rushing head long in to a war unilaterally, if at that point it has happened then at that point what the debate is really going to be about is what is our long term commitment there. How much is it going to cost? What does it mean for us to rebuild Iraq? How do we stabilize and make sure this country does not splinter in to factions….” -- Said by the big O on 11/25/2002 about the unilateral decision to invade Iraq.


Now today were going it alone?


Snip; Although Kerry did not commit to a specific plan for a U.S. attack on Syria, he laid out extensive justification for a military strike, saying that the United States commitment to decency and the rule of law demands action. He vowed that any military action would not involve "boots on the ground," would not be open-ended, and would not mean assuming responsibility for a years-long civil war in Syria that is already long underway.


[link to news.msn.com]



this one is rich... wow





 Quoting: Salt


Last Edited by Chrit on 08/30/2013 03:16 PM
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
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08/30/2013 03:17 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
yawn.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 03:25 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
yawn.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46026151


busy today...

Thx for all the wonderful well thought out responses you have had...

my guess this is another failed attempt of another glplike deranged retard.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46026151


Man, that is some seriously awesome proof you have there.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46026151


and people wonder why i carry a gun
 Quoting: eekers


nobody wants to rape your nasty ass.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46026151


putin

J.e.s.u.s. C.h.r.i.s.t.sbustard
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46026151

I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Mickeyblue
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
We are a sovereign nation that can determine our own path. Saying that, there is no reason whatsoever that we should be doing anything like what has been suggested with or without UN approval.
Resister

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08/30/2013 03:42 PM

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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
I couldn't care less about what the UN thinks. I do care what our own constitution says about an unprovoked military act of war from the United States against another nation that we are not currently at war with or responding in defense to. That requires congressional approval. Obama doesn't have that right now, so it would be an illegal act according to U.S. law.
"God forbid we should ever be 20 years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, & always, well informed... If they remain quiet under such misconceptions it is a lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty... Let them take arms... What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. " - Thomas Jefferson in 1787
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 03:48 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
I couldn't care less about what the UN thinks. I do care what our own constitution says about an unprovoked military act of war from the United States against another nation that we are not currently at war with or responding in defense to. That requires congressional approval. Obama doesn't have that right now, so it would be an illegal act according to U.S. law.
 Quoting: Resister


You got it
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 05:04 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Snip; It was not certain the U.S. would have to act alone. France announced that its armed forces "have been put in position to respond" if President Francois Hollande commits forces to intervention against Syria. Hollande does not need French parliamentary approval to launch military action that lasts less than four months.

Assad, who has denied using chemical weapons, vowed his country "will defend itself against any aggression."

Some of the U.N. chemical weapons experts will travel directly from Syria on Saturday to different laboratories around Europe to deliver "an extensive amount of material" gathered, U.N. spokesman Farhan Haq said. While the mandate of the U.N. team is to determine whether chemical agents were used in the attack, not who was responsible, Haq suggested the evidence — which includes biological samples and witness interviews — might give an indication of who deployed gases.

Obama and other top officials have not revealed definitive evidence to back claims that Assad used chemical weapons on Syrians. U.S. officials say the intelligence assessments are no "slam dunk," with questions remaining about who actually controls some of Syria's chemical weapons stores and doubts about whether Assad himself ordered the strike.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the intelligence publicly.

Despite shortcomings in the intelligence, the White House signaled urgency in acting, with Earnest, the White House spokesman, saying the president believes there is a "compressed time frame" for responding.



Now the line that gets me

"It is important for the Assad regime and other totalitarian dictators around the world to understand that the international community will not tolerate the indiscriminate, widespread use of chemical weapons, particularly against women and children as they're sleeping in their beds," he said


[link to news.msn.com]

international community??? ehh
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 05:11 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Black jesus don't need no constitution!!!

ochange
Chrit  (OP)

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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Just went up 15 min ago.


As Syria strikes loom, Samatha Power's skills better suited to classroom than UN

Read more: [link to www.foxnews.com]


Snip; While we all want the U.N. to live up to its original intent and be the place where the world comes together to solve international problems, the reality is the U.N. isn’t all that different from any other political body. Countries and individuals play to the cameras, create good theatre and negotiate selfishly.

Ambassador Power has very little experience in multilateral diplomacy or political positioning. She has even less practice in negotiating on behalf of the United States.

Her writings and previous work point to a long history of making highly intellectual arguments about what the world should look like.



She is better suited to convincing Harvard graduate students to write more about international problems. Her lack of experience sitting across the table from an experienced Russian diplomat could prove disastrous for the United States.

[link to www.foxnews.com]


Too many members of the U.N. benefit from the status quo and won’t make decisions for purely altruistic reasons. Ambassador Power doesn’t understand this reality.
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Anonymous Coward
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08/30/2013 05:22 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Snip; It was not certain the U.S. would have to act alone. France announced that its armed forces "have been put in position to respond" if President Francois Hollande commits forces to intervention against Syria. Hollande does not need French parliamentary approval to launch military action that lasts less than four months.

Assad, who has denied using chemical weapons, vowed his country "will defend itself against any aggression."

Some of the U.N. chemical weapons experts will travel directly from Syria on Saturday to different laboratories around Europe to deliver "an extensive amount of material" gathered, U.N. spokesman Farhan Haq said. While the mandate of the U.N. team is to determine whether chemical agents were used in the attack, not who was responsible, Haq suggested the evidence — which includes biological samples and witness interviews — might give an indication of who deployed gases.

Obama and other top officials have not revealed definitive evidence to back claims that Assad used chemical weapons on Syrians. U.S. officials say the intelligence assessments are no "slam dunk," with questions remaining about who actually controls some of Syria's chemical weapons stores and doubts about whether Assad himself ordered the strike.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the intelligence publicly.

Despite shortcomings in the intelligence, the White House signaled urgency in acting, with Earnest, the White House spokesman, saying the president believes there is a "compressed time frame" for responding.



Now the line that gets me

"It is important for the Assad regime and other totalitarian dictators around the world to understand that the international community will not tolerate the indiscriminate, widespread use of chemical weapons, particularly against women and children as they're sleeping in their beds," he said


[link to news.msn.com]

international community??? ehh
 Quoting: Chrit


Have you seen George Galloway's powerful speech in the House of Commons yesterday? The sound is not very good, I had to use my speakers.

[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]

'When have 2.5 billion people been excluded from what you call 'International community'? Who are you...
Nine's

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08/30/2013 05:24 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Chilling, but good thread Chrit. Thanks for posting it.

Guess I might run out and get a few more gallons of olive oil and some Crisco. Maybe some spare leathers for a hand pump. Just in case.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 06:01 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Have you seen George Galloway's powerful speech in the House of Commons yesterday? The sound is not very good, I had to use my speakers.



'When have 2.5 billion people been excluded from what you call 'International community'? Who are you...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 46005043


I was looking for that, thank you!

Last Edited by Chrit on 08/30/2013 06:02 PM
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.
Chrit  (OP)

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08/30/2013 06:15 PM
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Re: Without UN security council approval any action against Syria is an illegal act of aggression.
Chilling, but good thread Chrit. Thanks for posting it.

Guess I might run out and get a few more gallons of olive oil and some Crisco. Maybe some spare leathers for a hand pump. Just in case.
 Quoting: Nine's


I hear ya

battlesheeple
I'm only human, it's my biggest flaw.

We must all realize a sink a chair and a pillow are all luxuries of home and a soldiers helmet takes the place of all three.





GLP