Jesus did NOT teach eternal torture. IN fact he taught the very OPPOSITE of what christians teach about hell.

I would like to hear more about that hill in Kenya

share whatever you feel free to share

I thought of nothing much, i went with my fiends who are originally from there to kenya to see country and people. This was my first time in Kenya and i went to a smaller town called Gilgil, not a place tourists would go. There is lots of poverty there but the scenery is great, very beautiful. It was shortly before the elections which ended in a crisis and it almost came to a civil war. My friends went to see their parents, so i just walked around and climbed up a nearby hill, thinking about life and the universe, and why there is so much injustice, good people suffering and evil people getting away with what they do. I thought, if there is a god, how can he allow this. Is it the devil? If god is all powerful and created the universe, why does he nothing to stop it etc, such questions. I thought, this is all nonsense, nothing of that exists! We are all just animals it does not matter what we do on earth, we get born, eat, have sex and die and no one cares. Suddenly i got into a trance like state, i felt intense energy like the ground is electrified and i thought maybe i am getting sick or something, need to get back to the house but suddenly i felt this warm light and heard this voice in my head explaining to me what our purpose on earth is, that we are loved and that there is no hell as taught by the church, that hell is what we create ourselves and that we will have to relive all the pain and suffering we have caused to others during our lifetime after we die and that everyone will be held accountable, so i should feel no hate towards others as they will all have to answer to god, including myself and that we will be forgiven, but depending of the severity of our sins it can take a long time. I started thinking of bad things i had done in my life, i could not find many but i asked the voice/light to be forgiven. I felt this understanding, hard to describe, like suddenly all my questions i had at that moment where answered and everything made sense so i started crying a bit in joy. I had never experienced something like that before. As if to give me proof i am not just imagining this, i had visions of the people i would meet and the places i would go over the next days and even though it was exactly as i had been shown, i even knew the names of the people i had never met and even years later i still experienced things i had seen on that day, also when i went to texas i met people i had seen in that "vision". It changed me completely and i went from being an atheist to someone believing in god, but i never go to church etc and still think most religious people teach us is nonsense. But i tried to become a better person and helping where i can even if it's just small things. I had further visions later about other things and felt like i am being sent on "missions" by god, but i never tell people about it because i don't want them to think i am crazy.

I thought of nothing much, i went with my fiends who are originally from there to kenya to see country and people. This was my first time in Kenya and i went to a smaller town called Gilgil, not a place tourists would go. There is lots of poverty there but the scenery is great, very beautiful. It was shortly before the elections which ended in a crisis and it almost came to a civil war. My friends went to see their parents, so i just walked around and climbed up a nearby hill, thinking about life and the universe, and why there is so much injustice, good people suffering and evil people getting away with what they do. I thought, if there is a god, how can he allow this. Is it the devil? If god is all powerful and created the universe, why does he nothing to stop it etc, such questions. I thought, this is all nonsense, nothing of that exists! We are all just animals it does not matter what we do on earth, we get born, eat, have sex and die and no one cares. Suddenly i got into a trance like state, i felt intense energy like the ground is electrified and i thought maybe i am getting sick or something, need to get back to the house but suddenly i felt this warm light and heard this voice in my head explaining to me what our purpose on earth is, that we are loved and that there is no hell as taught by the church, that hell is what we create ourselves and that we will have to relive all the pain and suffering we have caused to others during our lifetime after we die and that everyone will be held accountable, so i should feel no hate towards others as they will all have to answer to god, including myself and that we will be forgiven, but depending of the severity of our sins it can take a long time. I started thinking of bad things i had done in my life, i could not find many but i asked the voice/light to be forgiven. I felt this understanding, hard to describe, like suddenly all my questions i had at that moment where answered and everything made sense so i started crying a bit in joy. I had never experienced something like that before. As if to give me proof i am not just imagining this, i had visions of the people i would meet and the places i would go over the next days and even though it was exactly as i had been shown, i even knew the names of the people i had never met and even years later i still experienced things i had seen on that day, also when i went to texas i met people i had seen in that "vision". It changed me completely and i went from being an atheist to someone believing in god, but i never go to church etc and still think most religious people teach us is nonsense. But i tried to become a better person and helping where i can even if it's just small things. I had further visions later about other things and felt like i am being sent on "missions" by god, but i never tell people about it because i don't want them to think i am crazy.

Its all here in black and white.

If you say this is not true you are calling jesus a LIAR.

Mat 18:32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:

Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?

Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.


Notice he said "TILL" the debt was paid...clearly stating that it COULD and WOULD be paid.

Christians teach it to mean..

Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, and even after he should pay all that was due unto him he would never be let out and writhe in torture forever..

And again he said.

Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.

Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

So what it means is to work things out NOW while you have life and an easy chance to do so.

Otherwise if you dont deal with things now while its "Easy" to do so, you will have to pay for it the hard way.

But notice he still menationed it was "UNTIL" the last farthing was paid, and that he would NOT get out "UNTIL" it was paid in full.

In other words there is a limit to the the price you pay commesurate with what you owed.

But christians teach it like this.


Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, And even after you have paid you will never get out.

They like to teach the exact opposite to what Jesus said.

Its very clear.

How can anyone miss it??

But it sells books and makes money and keeps everyone in contant fear and easlily controlled.

The LAKE OF FIRE is NOT torture..its LOVE!!!!

Like flame melts the coldest of ice the lake of fire will melt and soften even the hardest of hearts.

There you will be surrounded by pure love and holiness.

This would be torment to a dark and evil heart and there they remail till all the evil in them is burt away.

Evil is death. Thats why death gets destroyed in the lake.

It cannot survive pure love.

So those in the lake will face the results of every evil action they ever committed and they will wail and gansh their teeth, as they feel the pain they caused others but not in "Revenge" state as is taught, but in a "Corrective" state.

They will finally understand at last their true state and that they are loved so deeply that they will be ashamed and eventually be purified of all their evil.

Im not talking about the catholic "Purgatory" where they are tortured for tortures sake in sadistic ways.

Its more like they get flooded and saturated by pure love itself and in their final understanding of what Love is they have all their hate and evil burnt out of them.

Because it happens in the PRESENCE of the LAMB (So much for it being a SEPERATION from him)


Rev_14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,(WHICH HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT CORRECTION NOT POITNLESS CRUELTY) which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

Death dies because evil dies.

What is left at the end is just themselves...finally repentant and educated in the ways of mercy and love..all their hate and evil destroyed.\

The price they pay for doing things the "Hard" way is they hold themselves in everlasting contempt and shame and are never allowed into the holy city.

The will forever be on the "Outside" looking in.

But in no way screaming in torture forever.

Instead at the end when all is said and done every one of them will bow before their creator and confess "Jesus is Lord" and mean it because to do so they will have "Learnt: rightousness and been granted the Holy Spirit in order to be able to make that confession.

And that confession will be to the "Glory" of the Father.

How can the father get much "Glory" if they are all making that Meaningful heartfelt confession if they arew doing so under torture and duress?

IN the end LOVE wins because it cant LOSE.

It never fails.

And according to scripture..

Rom_10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

1Jn 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

om_14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

AND..they CANT make this confession UNLESS..

1Co 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

And to HAVE the Holy Ghost requires REPENTANCE..

And therefore ALL who confess this AT the end MUST have God dwelling iN them DUE to repentance..

Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
Php 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

In other words they paid the last farthing..have learnt their lesson..have repented and are now able to make this confession and mean it.

Those whose names were not found written in the book of life and had to die the "Second death" were never allowed into the city..

Rev 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

And after they have paid the last farthing in the lake of the fire of His pure love he will..

Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

So sorrow and pain and agony and tears HAVE AN END.

Its the opposite of what is taught where they say that those very things will continue on forever in a place sustained BY God.

But at the end even the hardests of sinners will be made whole and have all their tears wiped away.

But they can never enter the city. They were not among the ones who "Took care of busines" on the way to court.

They had to pay it all in full to the last stripe..

And this includes christians who dont do what the Lord asked..they get the SAME punishment as the "Unbeleivers"

Luk 12:46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.

There is no discrimination made here.

A Christian who treats his fellows badly will get the SAME punishment even if he did "Beleive"

Luk 12:47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.

Notice it didnt say "INFINITE" Stripes but "Many".

Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

So once again He is clearly saying that there IS AN END and a LIMIT to how one paid their debt and that "Christians" who are ratbags to others get the SAME punishment in the SAME place as the "UNBELEIVERS"...who of course get FEWER stripes because they DID NOT KNOW.

But christians teach it to mean..once again the OPPOSITE

Luk 12:46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.

Luk 12:47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with INFINITE stripes.

Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with INFINITE STRIPES as well. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

But Why did Jesus die you may ask if everyone "Repents" at the end??

He died so you would not HAVE to experience the second death.

If you want to experience it..and it probably wont be fun..keep preaching fear and terror..you know..the very OPPOSITE of what Jesus taught.

Read the post again..see what HE TAUGHT!

And if you do..you will realise that NOT EVERYONE gets to HEAVEN..as Heaven IS the New Jerusalem.

The ones that had to die the "Second death" ..are forever denied entrance or any authority in the Kindom.

They themselves are saved..but they sure did SUFFER LOSS..and will hold themselves in "Everlasting" contempt..for being so foolish as to have NOT done things the easy way when they had the chance.

1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.


Notice it said "ANY MAN"..no discrimination here again.

Notice the "FIRE"?..Thats his PURE LOVE..and it will BURN UP DROSS..and everything NOT DONE in love will BURN.

But the person..even if they were evil to the core..will lose EVERYTHING..ALL rewards..but they themselves WILL be saved..but,,are never allowed into the city..EVER.[/

didn't want to repost the above

I am going to do a copy of that

as good as it gets - very well done

not sure it is all 100% but nothing as of right now
I will throw out

Blessings

Its very straight forward isnt it?

Plus it uses Jesus very OWN WORDS.

Not words of someone trying to push an agenda of fear and control.

you post often

are you hiding as a AC

Not hiding as such.

Just cant register.

No paypal or credit card.

Anyway i dont want to be known or idolised or anything.

I am happy being a nobody.

What i do i seek no reward for.

I am going home soon.

My reward is there.

Not here.

I remember you now

I have this this thread on my personnel pin

anytime you need anything

contact me on this thread

Blessings

Australia brother or sister

first off are you are flesh and blood and have a mother and a father ?

I ask this because you speak and teach as Yahshua

I would think in your walk you have the oneness

I seek the oneness and feel daily the spirit of the oneness

I work in a very stressful and on going business type work

I have a desire to walk off for a season to bring the oneness

you have closer to me

I am flesh and blood and have a mum and dad.

I have faults and stuff ups like anyone as well.

Ive done things in my life i am ashamed of.

I am no different to anyone really.

Except God is My FRIEND before anything else.

you are a ray of light in my life

please us this thread to share

I will protect it and keep it cleaned up !

:sunrise 3444:

They love a dark merciless angry arrogant god because it suits their own personality.

The LAKE OF FIRE is NOT torture..its LOVE!!!!

Like flame melts the coldest of ice the lake of fire will melt and soften even the hardest of hearts.

There you will be surrounded by pure love and holiness.

Yes.

the reason is FEAR.

the only people that worry about hell are christians.

and they are only christians because of their fear of hell.

take away that sword hanging over them and they would be doing whatever they want to do.

they even admit this.

so they are fake in their love and loyalty to god or doing good...as both are done under fear and duress.

and god knows hearts.

there will be very few christians as we know them today anywhere near close to god in the ages to come.

god knows fakes...and he knkws when people do something out of fear and not out of love.

Hell will become a theme park for them.

Their need to sneer and curse and gloat is bottomless.

No doubt they will set up viewing platforms to observe hell from so they can spend their free time masturbating and gloating over the billions being tortured.

Its a hell screamers wet dream.

Who does?