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Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre

 
thresh
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08/06/2014 09:43 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Shhhhhhh.....its a secret.
 Quoting: waterman


No, I will not shhhh.

What the fuck is your agenda?

Because while you promote this bullshit, the truth is being denied the people of the World that they continue to suffer under the weight of their bondage.

You keep them in that bondage by promoting ignorance of themselves, and an Idea that they are supposed to be submissive to a race of liars and thieves.

Do not tell me to shhhh...

Answer the fucking question.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 56366520


Omg you're my hero. Too damn funny!

And NOW we talking.
redhouserebel

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08/06/2014 10:08 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Dude - OP - your last post - the sages thing - too long to quote - oosh - a lot to say about that - but first - are you in some way implying somewhere in there that Benjamin Netanyahu is attempting to fulfil - some of what these learned 19th century scholars have interpreted?


If so - someone - please - they didn't exactly get it right.



xx



The unification concept is correct - of course it is - but not sure these lads had the whole thing sorted - there has to be a clearer and more accurate analysis available - beyond learned interpretation and fortunately there is -



I will try to find some time - as it is complex - but it begins with the secret hidden language in the languages - which when understood it cannot be denied - then there is the .... organisational code - of the twelve sons - who they are/were - what they represent etc - then there is a better understanding of the secret language and vice versa of the order of things - of the system - it becomes indisputable as opposed to... interpretation.




xxxx

Last Edited by redhouserebel on 08/06/2014 10:09 PM
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
redhouserebel

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08/06/2014 10:28 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Dude - OP - your last post - the sages thing - too long to quote - oosh - a lot to say about that - but first - are you in some way implying somewhere in there that Benjamin Netanyahu is attempting to fulfil - some of what these learned 19th century scholars have interpreted?


If so - someone - please - they didn't exactly get it right.



xx



The unification concept is correct - of course it is - but not sure these lads had the whole thing sorted - there has to be a clearer and more accurate analysis available - beyond learned interpretation and fortunately there is -



I will try to find some time - as it is complex - but it begins with the secret hidden language in the languages - which when understood it cannot be denied - then there is the .... organisational code - of the twelve sons - who they are/were - what they represent etc - then there is a better understanding of the secret language and vice versa of the order of things - of the system - it becomes indisputable as opposed to... interpretation.




xxxx
 Quoting: redhouserebel




If I might - briefly - interpret my understanding of what your learned rabbis were saying:

1. there is no two state solution - I agree

2. Israel extends its borders - this does not mean the annihilation of a people based on religious grouping or ethnicity or geographical location - as implied by your blog up there

Jeez - you can't have it both ways to suit your own personal ideologies


It is completely incorrect.

Netanyahu does not act with the authority of God - G-d Jehovah - the highest - the supreme being - the whoever you want to call it and neither do anyone who act following false philosophy and misinterpretation - no matter how learned a person is who advises in any way - there has to be absolute proof to act this way - and there is none in what is written above - but it does exist - and it does not follow the interpretation either of the learned scholarly rabbis of yesteryear - nor anyone else's interpretation of what they have said - when it suits their own person ideals or goals - this is disgraceful.

I am sorry - but it is.


X
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
redhouserebel

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08/06/2014 10:32 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Dude - OP - your last post - the sages thing - too long to quote - oosh - a lot to say about that - but first - are you in some way implying somewhere in there that Benjamin Netanyahu is attempting to fulfil - some of what these learned 19th century scholars have interpreted?


If so - someone - please - they didn't exactly get it right.



xx



The unification concept is correct - of course it is - but not sure these lads had the whole thing sorted - there has to be a clearer and more accurate analysis available - beyond learned interpretation and fortunately there is -



I will try to find some time - as it is complex - but it begins with the secret hidden language in the languages - which when understood it cannot be denied - then there is the .... organisational code - of the twelve sons - who they are/were - what they represent etc - then there is a better understanding of the secret language and vice versa of the order of things - of the system - it becomes indisputable as opposed to... interpretation.




xxxx
 Quoting: redhouserebel




If I might - briefly - interpret my understanding of what your learned rabbis were saying:

1. there is no two state solution - I agree

2. Israel extends its borders - this does not mean the annihilation of a people based on religious grouping or ethnicity or geographical location - as implied by your blog up there

Jeez - you can't have it both ways to suit your own personal ideologies


It is completely incorrect.

Netanyahu does not act with the authority of God - G-d Jehovah - the highest - the supreme being - the whoever you want to call it and neither do anyone who act following false philosophy and misinterpretation - no matter how learned a person is who advises in any way - there has to be absolute proof to act this way - and there is none in what is written above - but it does exist - and it does not follow the interpretation either of the learned scholarly rabbis of yesteryear - nor anyone else's interpretation of what they have said - when it suits their own person ideals or goals - this is disgraceful.

I am sorry - but it is.


X
 Quoting: redhouserebel



And I sincerely do not mean any offence whatsoever to your learned rabbis - they have worked hard to find understanding - nor do i mean to cause offence to those who interpret their interpretations - but I have to say - the interpretations implied by these interpretations are highly offensive in themselves - and their conveyance by any action is not the work of God - not now - not ever.




X
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
redhouserebel

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08/06/2014 10:35 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Dude - OP - your last post - the sages thing - too long to quote - oosh - a lot to say about that - but first - are you in some way implying somewhere in there that Benjamin Netanyahu is attempting to fulfil - some of what these learned 19th century scholars have interpreted?


If so - someone - please - they didn't exactly get it right.



xx



The unification concept is correct - of course it is - but not sure these lads had the whole thing sorted - there has to be a clearer and more accurate analysis available - beyond learned interpretation and fortunately there is -



I will try to find some time - as it is complex - but it begins with the secret hidden language in the languages - which when understood it cannot be denied - then there is the .... organisational code - of the twelve sons - who they are/were - what they represent etc - then there is a better understanding of the secret language and vice versa of the order of things - of the system - it becomes indisputable as opposed to... interpretation.




xxxx
 Quoting: redhouserebel




If I might - briefly - interpret my understanding of what your learned rabbis were saying:

1. there is no two state solution - I agree

2. Israel extends its borders - this does not mean the annihilation of a people based on religious grouping or ethnicity or geographical location - as implied by your blog up there

Jeez - you can't have it both ways to suit your own personal ideologies


It is completely incorrect.

Netanyahu does not act with the authority of God - G-d Jehovah - the highest - the supreme being - the whoever you want to call it and neither do anyone who act following false philosophy and misinterpretation - no matter how learned a person is who advises in any way - there has to be absolute proof to act this way - and there is none in what is written above - but it does exist - and it does not follow the interpretation either of the learned scholarly rabbis of yesteryear - nor anyone else's interpretation of what they have said - when it suits their own person ideals or goals - this is disgraceful.

I am sorry - but it is.


X
 Quoting: redhouserebel



And I sincerely do not mean any offence whatsoever to your learned rabbis - they have worked hard to find understanding - nor do i mean to cause offence to those who interpret their interpretations - but I have to say - the interpretations implied by these interpretations are highly offensive in themselves - and their conveyance by any action is not the work of God - not now - not ever.




X
 Quoting: redhouserebel




But if any are offended by me saying this - then good - you should be off-ended - I am sickened.


x
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
Base12

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08/07/2014 03:06 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Historically, Jews had evolved mostly from the Tribe of...

01) Judah - Lion
02) Simeon - Fortress/Castle
03) Binyamin - Wolf
04) Levi - Breastplate

...who had all together formed the ancient Kingdom of Judah (alongside the remnants of the Northern Kingdom of Israel who migrated to their Southern counterpart and assimilated there).

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

01) to 04) = Stick of Judah
05) to 12) = Stick of Ephraim

05)Joseph (Ephraim/Manasseh)
06)Asher
07)Gad
08)Naphtali
09)Dan
10)Zebulun
11)Issachar
12)Reuben

Ten names in above list (Ten Lost Tribes?). Fourteen names total.
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[link to www.mostholyplace.com]
Base12

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08/07/2014 03:22 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
If YOU believe in talking snakes that is.

Who here believes in talking snakes?

Ever seen one?

LOL
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 53202638

Yes.

I wholeheartedly believe in Talking Snakes.

I have two of them named Lucifer seething through my entire being. So do you. So do all of us.

caduceus

That's God's "inside joke" by the way. Get it?

Romans 7:18
"For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not"

Wait until everyone wakes up to this fact. There's your lulz.

Yes the Snake RNA Strands of Phosp-Horus talks.

unclemikey-584

unclemikey-420

Lots of people want to hear what Lucy says about the Lost Word...

unclemikey-448

So, just so we are clear...

RNA is a Talking Snake that lives inside of us.

KD
Visit my website...
[link to www.mostholyplace.com]
Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 04:32 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
QUOTE "the millennial sacrificial system will be instituted as a commemorative celebration of the completeness of the last and efficacious sacrifice of our Saviour, Jesus Christ our Lord and redeemer. The temple will truly become a house of prayer for all nations." UNQUOTE

Blasphemous.

28Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?”
29Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

38For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

"But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE MERCY AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,


How can anyone believe that "a millennial sacrificial system will be instituted"?
But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE MERCY AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners

If you had known what these words mean, 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice,' you would not have condemned the innocent.
( sacrifice=condemning the innocent)
Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 05:43 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Hi waterman. Hope you've been doing well. Interesting thread. I've thought about the northern and southern kingdom kinda in the same way you have, minus the two witnesses aspect. Didn't know much about that topic back then.

Have you ever thought about how easily it would be for people nowadays to try to replicate the events in the Bible and try to fulfill prophecy themselves by copying the "Playbook"? I think about this, and I think about how God must have "known" this too and He's steps ahead of them. I can't wait to see how He has orchestrated the whole thing for the good. It's going to be mind boggling. He's such a genius, beyond genius level, beyond comprehension. I think the book of Malachi plays into His grand scheme somehow, as do all His words.

Are we really meant to understand the final outcome or be left in the dark, hanging on faith? Is everything set in stone, or is there room for free will? I think that all the answers lie in the Bible, but for anyone to get too close to that kind of knowledge, they obviously have to go through the Fire. Paul had to endure his thorn in the flesh. Solomon was perplexed by too much wisdom. David sinned. Moses screwed up. Noah....

I'm really humbled by the mere fact that God even gives us the time of day, and I know that's my own sinful nature speaking. The Master of the Universe, of all things known and unknown, and to stoop to our level. Nothing in my life has gone the way I wanted, and yet I feel Him closer than ever. It's such a wonderful paradox, it makes me cry. Some might classify me as bipolar, for I've experienced the lowest of lows and the highest of highs (at least in my own puny mind), and always it circles back to me standing in awe and respect of Him who controls it all, despite my shortcomings. I still, to this day, cannot get over that simple fact that...He loves us in spite of. In spite of... He is incredible. Even those words sound stupid to describe Him.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17856444


AMEN! EVERYONE SHOULD FEEL THIS WAY, BECAUSE IT IS TRUE!!!! GOD LOVES US! HE TESTS US, MORE AND MORE EACH DAY! TIME IS SHORT, BE READY FOR THE COMING OF THE SON OF GOD!


who lived thousands of years ago has nothing to do with today.... why live in the past?
 Quoting: Funnycat


Let's just say for fun. Next year or the year after your country the greatest country and super-power in the world was destroyed and you were lucky enough not to have to die from pestilence or starvation. You are taken into captivity and made a slave through what I will call a furnace of affliction. How would you come out of that furnace. Would you seek God or would you curse God. The secret to widson is knowing that history repeats itself. God has 12 tribes of Israel. Only 2 are in geographical Israel today. Those other 10 tribes are going to have to go through the furnace of affliction before they join those other 2 and those other 2 are going to have to come to the realization Jesus is the only way to salvation.

Your world is repetative....day after day the same thing...but soon it will flip upside down and you won't know if today is the last day you live. There are no atheists in foxholes....prepare for you life to change because very soon it will. For the better or for the worse will be your choice.
Knowing the past is to know the future!
 Quoting: waterman


I understand what you are saying now, OP. Yes, many will go through the Great Tribulation. The Great Trial will end when Christ, our Lord, returns. That is when the doors will be shut and no one else will have a chance at salvation. Saw a video on how they were developing the "GOD GENE" virus, which makes you disgusted with the mention of God, basically. There is a verse in Revelation that speaks of how people won't be able to seek God anymore, because all that are left will not believe or never will, until we all return.
Firastorm
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08/07/2014 05:51 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
QUOTE "the millennial sacrificial system will be instituted as a commemorative celebration of the completeness of the last and efficacious sacrifice of our Saviour, Jesus Christ our Lord and redeemer. The temple will truly become a house of prayer for all nations." UNQUOTE

Blasphemous.

28Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?”
29Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

38For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

"But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE MERCY AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,


How can anyone believe that "a millennial sacrificial system will be instituted"?
But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE MERCY AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners

If you had known what these words mean, 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice,' you would not have condemned the innocent.
( sacrifice=condemning the innocent)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 11046360


Who is innocent? Not you, not I, not anyone on Earth is innocent. We are all sinners. There is no sacrifice. The true test of faith will come when they are beating you and telling you to denounce your God and deny Christ. Will you fold!? Will you suffer for the sake of your faith? Great rewards are for those who endure. Remember Simon, He was stoned to death, and He came for him. He did not stop the stoning, but, Simon could see that his Lord was waiting for him.

You really have to believe, trust, and love God and Christ. That is it, tell others without being too harsh, while others you must snatch them up and show them the importance of believing. I believe because I have seen, but blessed are those who believe and have not seen.
Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 05:55 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
I just want to know if David is coming back as a King. Or possibly as a witness. I feel this is my birthright and that he should stand as an earthly King down deeply in my heart.
 Quoting: Lion of Judah 4239957


David will appear when the champion of the enemy shows his cowardly face on the battlefield and starts shouting his blasphemies at God and His people.

Don't you know his spirit yet?
Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 05:58 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
discover the secrets of your future
anonymous
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08/07/2014 06:22 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
King David will rule over all Israel. Contrary to the what the English twit said earlier it is NOT "David de Rothschild". Some fools will never understand the Word. The truth to that is in I Corinthians 2.
waterman  (OP)

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08/07/2014 10:44 AM

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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
THE HIGH PRIEST ANOINTED FOR WAR


A subject not mentioned in most Bible studies, is that of the "second High Priest," who was called the (High) Priest Anointed for War. Scripture only gives a brief non-specific mention to this person and his role:

Deuteronomy 20:1-3: When thou goest out to battle against thine enemies, and seest horses, and chariots, and a people more than thou, be not afraid of them: for the LORD thy God is with thee, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt. And it shall be, when ye are come nigh unto the battle, that the priest shall approach and speak unto the people, And shall say unto them, Hear, O Israel, ye approach this day unto battle against your enemies: let not your hearts faint, fear not, and do not tremble, neither be ye terrified because of them.

This High Priest did not serve in the Tabernacle/Temple as did the High Priest we read much more about in the Tenakh. Rather, his assignment centered around the caring and preparedness of the men going to battle -- to assure they were prepared physically and spiritually, even sending home those he deemed unfit to fight.

The first Priest anointed for war that we find mention of, was Phineas, the grandson of Aaron:

Midrash Rabbah - Leviticus XX:2 - Elisheba the daughter of Amminadab did not enjoy happiness in the world. True, she witnessed five crowns [attained by her relatives] in one day: her brother-in-law was a king, her brother was a prince, her husband was High Priest, her two sons were both Deputy High Priests, Phinehas her grandson was a Priest anointed for war.

Talmud - Mas. Sotah 43a - Thus it states: And Moses sent them, a thousand of every tribe, to the war, them and Phinehas* — ‘them’ refers to the Sanhedrin; ‘Phinehas’ was the [priest] Anointed for Battle;

* Num. XXXI, 6.

Elsewhere in Midrash Rabbah (below) we find reference to the same person, this time called, "the War Messiah." What is interesting here is the footnote, which links the Priest Anointed for War to the coming Messiah.



* Lit.,the priest anointed for war’, an expression originally applied to the priest who accompanied the troops. Cf. Suk. 52a, where instead of ' War Messiah ' we have ' Messiah son of Joseph’. The two are probably identical, Messiah the son of Joseph being regarded as the forerunner of the Messiah during the wars that will precede his advent.

The grouping of Elijah, the Messiah, Melchizedek, and the War Messiah together (in the above section), is also interesting as the last three are linked to Yeshua, who was and again will be preceded by Elijah the prophet.

There are distinctions made in Talmud between the two High Priests. As might be expected, the Temple High Priest is given a higher "rank" than his counterpart. However the following section of the Talmud, shows distinctions drawn between the Deputy Temple High Priest and the High Priest Anointed for War, with the former taking precendent regarding issues of defilement, but the latter's life being considered more important (if one had to choose between the two of them) as he has a responsibility to many people:

Talmud - Mas. Nazir 47b - The question was propounded: As between [the High Priest] anointed for a war, and the deputy [High Priest], which is of superior sanctity? Does the [High Priest] anointed for war take precedence, because he is qualified to go to war, or does the deputy take precedence, because he is qualified to perform the Temple service?* — Come and hear: For it has been taught: The only difference between a [High Priest] anointed for war and a deputy is that if they were both walking by the way and encountered a meth mizwah, the [High Priest] anointed for war is to defile himself, but not the deputy. But has it not been taught: A [High Priest] anointed for war takes precedence of a deputy? — Mar Zutra replied: As far as saving his life is concerned, the [High Priest] anointed for war has a superior claim for many [people] depend upon him, but as regards defilement, the deputy is of superior sanctity, as has been taught: R. Hanina b. Antigonus said that the reason the office of deputy to the High Priest was created, was that should any disqualification happen to him [the High Priest], he can enter and minister in his stead.

* But once a priest had been anointed for war, he could no longer take part in the Temple service.












This is why we see Joshua the high priest(one of the 2 anointed witnesses) in heaven getting his dirty garments taken away because elijah(messiah ben joseph) is the war messiah anointed for war but can't serve as Temple High Priest service because of it therefore Elijah is killed by armillius and lays dead for 40/45 days and is in heaven as described in zechariah 3:

Zechariah 3
King James Version (KJV)
3 And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

5 And I said, Let them set a fair mitre upon his head. So they set a fair mitre upon his head, and clothed him with garments. And the angel of the Lord stood by.

6 And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying,

7 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge, then thou shalt also judge my house, and shalt also keep my courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these that stand by.
-Heed the warning or endure the mourning
Favor ain't fair

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Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 11:01 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Yes.

I wholeheartedly believe in Talking Snakes.

I have two of them named Lucifer seething through my entire being. So do you. So do all of us.


One can only speak for themselves stupid.
redhouserebel

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08/07/2014 11:33 AM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
THE HIGH PRIEST ANOINTED FOR WAR


A subject not mentioned in most Bible studies, is that of the "second High Priest," who was called the (High) Priest Anointed for War. Scripture only gives a brief non-specific mention to this person and his role:

Deuteronomy 20:1-3: When thou goest out to battle against thine enemies, and seest horses, and chariots, and a people more than thou, be not afraid of them: for the LORD thy God is with thee, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt. And it shall be, when ye are come nigh unto the battle, that the priest shall approach and speak unto the people, And shall say unto them, Hear, O Israel, ye approach this day unto battle against your enemies: let not your hearts faint, fear not, and do not tremble, neither be ye terrified because of them.

This High Priest did not serve in the Tabernacle/Temple as did the High Priest we read much more about in the Tenakh. Rather, his assignment centered around the caring and preparedness of the men going to battle -- to assure they were prepared physically and spiritually, even sending home those he deemed unfit to fight.

The first Priest anointed for war that we find mention of, was Phineas, the grandson of Aaron:

Midrash Rabbah - Leviticus XX:2 - Elisheba the daughter of Amminadab did not enjoy happiness in the world. True, she witnessed five crowns [attained by her relatives] in one day: her brother-in-law was a king, her brother was a prince, her husband was High Priest, her two sons were both Deputy High Priests, Phinehas her grandson was a Priest anointed for war.

Talmud - Mas. Sotah 43a - Thus it states: And Moses sent them, a thousand of every tribe, to the war, them and Phinehas* — ‘them’ refers to the Sanhedrin; ‘Phinehas’ was the [priest] Anointed for Battle;

* Num. XXXI, 6.

Elsewhere in Midrash Rabbah (below) we find reference to the same person, this time called, "the War Messiah." What is interesting here is the footnote, which links the Priest Anointed for War to the coming Messiah.



* Lit.,the priest anointed for war’, an expression originally applied to the priest who accompanied the troops. Cf. Suk. 52a, where instead of ' War Messiah ' we have ' Messiah son of Joseph’. The two are probably identical, Messiah the son of Joseph being regarded as the forerunner of the Messiah during the wars that will precede his advent.

The grouping of Elijah, the Messiah, Melchizedek, and the War Messiah together (in the above section), is also interesting as the last three are linked to Yeshua, who was and again will be preceded by Elijah the prophet.

There are distinctions made in Talmud between the two High Priests. As might be expected, the Temple High Priest is given a higher "rank" than his counterpart. However the following section of the Talmud, shows distinctions drawn between the Deputy Temple High Priest and the High Priest Anointed for War, with the former taking precendent regarding issues of defilement, but the latter's life being considered more important (if one had to choose between the two of them) as he has a responsibility to many people:

Talmud - Mas. Nazir 47b - The question was propounded: As between [the High Priest] anointed for a war, and the deputy [High Priest], which is of superior sanctity? Does the [High Priest] anointed for war take precedence, because he is qualified to go to war, or does the deputy take precedence, because he is qualified to perform the Temple service?* — Come and hear: For it has been taught: The only difference between a [High Priest] anointed for war and a deputy is that if they were both walking by the way and encountered a meth mizwah, the [High Priest] anointed for war is to defile himself, but not the deputy. But has it not been taught: A [High Priest] anointed for war takes precedence of a deputy? — Mar Zutra replied: As far as saving his life is concerned, the [High Priest] anointed for war has a superior claim for many [people] depend upon him, but as regards defilement, the deputy is of superior sanctity, as has been taught: R. Hanina b. Antigonus said that the reason the office of deputy to the High Priest was created, was that should any disqualification happen to him [the High Priest], he can enter and minister in his stead.

* But once a priest had been anointed for war, he could no longer take part in the Temple service.












This is why we see Joshua the high priest(one of the 2 anointed witnesses) in heaven getting his dirty garments taken away because elijah(messiah ben joseph) is the war messiah anointed for war but can't serve as Temple High Priest service because of it therefore Elijah is killed by armillius and lays dead for 40/45 days and is in heaven as described in zechariah 3:

Zechariah 3
King James Version (KJV)
3 And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

5 And I said, Let them set a fair mitre upon his head. So they set a fair mitre upon his head, and clothed him with garments. And the angel of the Lord stood by.

6 And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying,

7 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge, then thou shalt also judge my house, and shalt also keep my courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these that stand by.
 Quoting: waterman




When you understand you will see that none is more important than any other - the messiah is not more important than the baker or the butcher or the water bearer or the transporter - the man with the donkey or the soldier - they are all equally valuable to the plot.


None of the sons of Jacob are more valuable than any other of them - but some are given positions during certain phases which give them appearance of higher authority in a particular circumstance - and certainly Dinah also is no less an equal.

The only distinction is between the righteous and the unrighteous - and some people have difficulty in defining this - which creates problems, of course.


"And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; he made the stars also.

And God set them in the firmament of the Heaven to give light upon the earth,

And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good."



A ruler over the free and a ruler over the exiled or outsider - the slave, imprisoned - excluded.

The stars have authority to take light - knowledge and understanding - law - to those who did not have it.

To rule you over from the day to the night - or - from the night to the day - to take you from freedom to exile or from exile to freedom - so light would always be divided from darkness - the righteous from the unrighteous.


Maybe start here:


Thread: The Ark Of The Covenant



Because it all gets very deep and complex.


Imagine all the actors in a play - some roles may be appear more important than others - but everyone is needed for the story to be told - and everyone is reading their lines as instructed by the script - hence Isaac [EDIT: I meant to say Jacob here - but it doesn't matter with respect to the point I am making] has his script - and all his sons play their part - as prescribed by Abraham before him and Abram and Terah etc.


And so Dinah is brought forth.



All metaphor.

Last Edited by redhouserebel on 08/07/2014 11:39 AM
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
redhouserebel

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08/07/2014 12:24 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Waterman - if we are talking using these terms: birthright and sceptre - then would it be fair to further ask these questions:

Who has the birthright and the sceptre out of the children of Abraham's two wives' sons? Ishmael and Isaac. From Hagar and Sarai

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Isaac's sons Jacob and Esau?

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Jacob's sons from his two wives: Joseph and Judah - From Rachel and Leah

Would you say these stories are comparative in any way? That the division of these duties among sons is continued down Isaac's line; Ishmael becoming head of the arab nations line - Esau marrying into the Hittite line - also arab nations etc.
A MILF Mortgage - coming soon ;)
Base12

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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
One can only speak for themselves stupid.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 54167063

Lol... I've always wanted to use this...

:thassabutthurt:

Truth hurts doesn't it?

You can always prove me wrong anytime by editing Wikipedia...

"hence its name given from Greek mythology, meaning "light-bearer" (Latin Lucifer), referring to the "Morning Star", the planet Venus"

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

It's ironic... the one thing people are taught to hate the most ends up being their own reflection.

mirror

Talk about deflating the Ego... ouch. Good one God!

Don't worry, our Sins can be made white as Snow...

unclemikey-596

birthofvenus

Note that Ice (Snow) is the opposite of Fire (Phosp-Horus).


Visit my website...
[link to www.mostholyplace.com]
anonymous
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
The birthright blessings of Abraham went to Ephraim and Manasseh (Gen. 48) the sceptre went to Judah. It's all in the Bible. There are only a couple nations in all of history that exhibit the traits of Gen. 48.
Base12

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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Ruddy means red and so does Adam meaning red man.

Ramesses and Isi

[link to biblehub.com]
 Quoting: Gnostic Warrior

Redhead gonna Redhead... and bee-head.

2014-08-07
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
:dividedkingdom::2housesofIsrael::leftrightkingpri:


Names of divided Israel in different pairings in the bible:

Israel (northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)
Jacob (northern kingdom) Israel(southern kingdom)
Ephraim(northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)

The division of leadership will be divided just as the nation is divided, two families/kingdoms...two witnesses:

The northern kingdom will have a leader(Joseph/Ephraim)
The southern kingdom will have a leader(Judah)
These two leaders will be the two witnesses and they will be in charge of uniting these two kingdoms/families

Joseph is represented by the bullock/unicorn as is shown in deut 33 as smiting the people together bringing the lost 10 tribes together:

13 ¶ And of Joseph he said, Blessed of the Lord is his land for the sweetness of heaven, for the dew, and for the [m]depth lying beneath,
14 And for the sweet increase of the Sun, and for the sweet increase of the Moon,
15 And for thy sweetness of the top of the ancient mountains, and for the sweetness of the old hills,
16 And for the sweetness of the earth, and abundance therefore: and the good will of him that dwelt in the [n]bush, shall come upon the head of Joseph, and upon the top of the head of him that was separated from his brethren.
17 His beauty shall be like his firstborn bullock, and his [o]horns as the horns of an unicorn: with them he shall smite the people together, even the ends of the world: these are also the ten thousands of Ephraim, and these are the thousands of Manasseh.

Joseph will recognize Judah but Judah will not recognize Joseph until Judahs purpose is accomplished:
Gen 42:8
King James Bible
And Joseph knew his brethren, but they knew not him.

:judahephraim4::unibull:

Judah is represented by the lion:

:judahlion:

There are two families just as Jacob was married to two wives:
Leah and Rachael and as ruth tells us the house of Israel was built by these two wives Rachel giving birth to Joseph the birthright holder and Leah giving birth to Judah the sceptre holder and these two will reunite all of Israel being used as that instrument in the hand of God:

Ruth 4:11:
And all the people that were in the gate, and the elders, said, We are witnesses. The LORD make the woman that is come into thine house like Rachel and like Leah, which two did build the house of Israel: and do thou worthily in Ephratah, and be famous in Bethlehem:

1 chronicles 5:2

Jubilee Bible 2000
For Judah prevailed above his brethren and was their prince, but the birthright was Joseph's:)

:judahandephraim1:



The fact that Jacob’s two wives, Leah and Rachel, are spoken of as "building the House of Israel," of necessity divides the immediate household of Jacob into "two families." In Jeremiah 33:24 they are spoken of as "the two families which the Lord hath chosen." The Covenant promise of the BIRTHRIGHT was given to one of these families, and that of the SCEPTRE to the other family. Rachel was to be the mother of "thousands of millions" while Leah was to be the mother of royalty. Genesis 49:10 shows us that Judah represents the SCEPTRE family; and I Chronicles 5:2 tells us "THE BIRTHRIGHT is Joseph’s." Never try to apply a BIRTHRIGHT blessing to the Jews. Judah and the Jews were excluded from the BIRTHRIGHT promises, Joseph from the SCEPTRE. The BIRTHRIGHT people are not, and are never in the Scriptures called Jews.

In Ezekiel the 37th chapter we are told that "the two sticks" which are still separate, but which are yet to be reunited, represent Judah on the one hand, and Joseph and the "House of Israel" on the other. One of these sticks represents the SCEPTRE people and the other the BIRTHRIGHT people. Judah, the inheritor of the SCEPTRE, is only a half bother to Joseph, the inheritor of the BIRTHRIGHT. The SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT inheritors are "two-families" with different mothers. How could the distinction between the SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT families Judah and Israel be more emphatic?

Each leader will be leader of one of the two families. The two leaders will be Joseph and Judah as the northern kingdom inherits the birthright blessing and the southern kingdom inherits the sceptre blessing

Two families two leaders....Judah the king and Joseph the "prime minister"(high priest) each destined to rule in the 1000 year millennium and then sit as prince of priests(Joseph) and prince of kings(Judah/David) on the left and right of Jesus in the new heaven and new earth for all eternity!
Joseph converses with Judah:

:Joseph and Judah:
 Quoting: waterman


Joseph and Judah are 2 tribes in the Nation of Israel...
the Nation has 12 tribes....Jacob was told by YHVH on this death bed what these two tribes would look like in the latter days (now) Genesis 49

Judah was seduced by Tamar, his daughter-in-law whom was married to both Judah's sons, but they both died, leaving Tarama childless....Judah in his elderly years had no wife, but regularly slept with prostitutes...Tamar (tribe of Joseph) tricked Judah her father-in-law probably in his 70's to sleep with her by her dressing up as a prostitute and seduced him.

She bore twins, Zarah and Pherez....Zarah seedline lives on today.....Pherez, the oldest twin was the seedline of Christ...since Christ had no children, that seedline died with Christ.

Zarah is the seedline of Juda and Tamar....known as the scarlet thread....and remains pure in some who have not inbred....

Yes the Scepter will always remain with Juda...but the real strength is given to Joseph whom is double blessed....and there are some walking the earth today that are both Judah and Joseph....it is these pure ones who will put the two sticks back together after Christ gathers all his children together, for that joining of the stick, then Shiloh returns!

Remember Christ told us those who say they are Jews (tribe of judah) do worship the synagogue of satan...Rev 2:9, 3:9

the tribe of Judah is very, very small, their are few left who do not worship satan.
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08/07/2014 12:52 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
:dividedkingdom::2housesofIsrael::leftrightkingpri:


Names of divided Israel in different pairings in the bible:

Israel (northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)
Jacob (northern kingdom) Israel(southern kingdom)
Ephraim(northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)

The division of leadership will be divided just as the nation is divided, two families/kingdoms...two witnesses:

The northern kingdom will have a leader(Joseph/Ephraim)
The southern kingdom will have a leader(Judah)
These two leaders will be the two witnesses and they will be in charge of uniting these two kingdoms/families

Joseph is represented by the bullock/unicorn as is shown in deut 33 as smiting the people together bringing the lost 10 tribes together:

13 ¶ And of Joseph he said, Blessed of the Lord is his land for the sweetness of heaven, for the dew, and for the [m]depth lying beneath,
14 And for the sweet increase of the Sun, and for the sweet increase of the Moon,
15 And for thy sweetness of the top of the ancient mountains, and for the sweetness of the old hills,
16 And for the sweetness of the earth, and abundance therefore: and the good will of him that dwelt in the [n]bush, shall come upon the head of Joseph, and upon the top of the head of him that was separated from his brethren.
17 His beauty shall be like his firstborn bullock, and his [o]horns as the horns of an unicorn: with them he shall smite the people together, even the ends of the world: these are also the ten thousands of Ephraim, and these are the thousands of Manasseh.

Joseph will recognize Judah but Judah will not recognize Joseph until Judahs purpose is accomplished:
Gen 42:8
King James Bible
And Joseph knew his brethren, but they knew not him.

:judahephraim4::unibull:

Judah is represented by the lion:

:judahlion:

There are two families just as Jacob was married to two wives:
Leah and Rachael and as ruth tells us the house of Israel was built by these two wives Rachel giving birth to Joseph the birthright holder and Leah giving birth to Judah the sceptre holder and these two will reunite all of Israel being used as that instrument in the hand of God:

Ruth 4:11:
And all the people that were in the gate, and the elders, said, We are witnesses. The LORD make the woman that is come into thine house like Rachel and like Leah, which two did build the house of Israel: and do thou worthily in Ephratah, and be famous in Bethlehem:

1 chronicles 5:2

Jubilee Bible 2000
For Judah prevailed above his brethren and was their prince, but the birthright was Joseph's:)

:judahandephraim1:



The fact that Jacob’s two wives, Leah and Rachel, are spoken of as "building the House of Israel," of necessity divides the immediate household of Jacob into "two families." In Jeremiah 33:24 they are spoken of as "the two families which the Lord hath chosen." The Covenant promise of the BIRTHRIGHT was given to one of these families, and that of the SCEPTRE to the other family. Rachel was to be the mother of "thousands of millions" while Leah was to be the mother of royalty. Genesis 49:10 shows us that Judah represents the SCEPTRE family; and I Chronicles 5:2 tells us "THE BIRTHRIGHT is Joseph’s." Never try to apply a BIRTHRIGHT blessing to the Jews. Judah and the Jews were excluded from the BIRTHRIGHT promises, Joseph from the SCEPTRE. The BIRTHRIGHT people are not, and are never in the Scriptures called Jews.

In Ezekiel the 37th chapter we are told that "the two sticks" which are still separate, but which are yet to be reunited, represent Judah on the one hand, and Joseph and the "House of Israel" on the other. One of these sticks represents the SCEPTRE people and the other the BIRTHRIGHT people. Judah, the inheritor of the SCEPTRE, is only a half bother to Joseph, the inheritor of the BIRTHRIGHT. The SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT inheritors are "two-families" with different mothers. How could the distinction between the SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT families Judah and Israel be more emphatic?

Each leader will be leader of one of the two families. The two leaders will be Joseph and Judah as the northern kingdom inherits the birthright blessing and the southern kingdom inherits the sceptre blessing

Two families two leaders....Judah the king and Joseph the "prime minister"(high priest) each destined to rule in the 1000 year millennium and then sit as prince of priests(Joseph) and prince of kings(Judah/David) on the left and right of Jesus in the new heaven and new earth for all eternity!
Joseph converses with Judah:

:Joseph and Judah:
 Quoting: waterman


your map is incorrect. i have an atlas of the map of King David's era....the gaza strip belongs to the nation of Israel...all the way from the Jordan east to the great sea
belongs to the nation of Israel, for in the days of King David, we were one nation.
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08/07/2014 12:53 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
:dividedkingdom::2housesofIsrael::leftrightkingpri:


Names of divided Israel in different pairings in the bible:

Israel (northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)
Jacob (northern kingdom) Israel(southern kingdom)
Ephraim(northern kingdom) Judah (southern kingdom)

The division of leadership will be divided just as the nation is divided, two families/kingdoms...two witnesses:

The northern kingdom will have a leader(Joseph/Ephraim)
The southern kingdom will have a leader(Judah)
These two leaders will be the two witnesses and they will be in charge of uniting these two kingdoms/families

Joseph is represented by the bullock/unicorn as is shown in deut 33 as smiting the people together bringing the lost 10 tribes together:

13 ¶ And of Joseph he said, Blessed of the Lord is his land for the sweetness of heaven, for the dew, and for the [m]depth lying beneath,
14 And for the sweet increase of the Sun, and for the sweet increase of the Moon,
15 And for thy sweetness of the top of the ancient mountains, and for the sweetness of the old hills,
16 And for the sweetness of the earth, and abundance therefore: and the good will of him that dwelt in the [n]bush, shall come upon the head of Joseph, and upon the top of the head of him that was separated from his brethren.
17 His beauty shall be like his firstborn bullock, and his [o]horns as the horns of an unicorn: with them he shall smite the people together, even the ends of the world: these are also the ten thousands of Ephraim, and these are the thousands of Manasseh.

Joseph will recognize Judah but Judah will not recognize Joseph until Judahs purpose is accomplished:
Gen 42:8
King James Bible
And Joseph knew his brethren, but they knew not him.

:judahephraim4::unibull:

Judah is represented by the lion:

:judahlion:

There are two families just as Jacob was married to two wives:
Leah and Rachael and as ruth tells us the house of Israel was built by these two wives Rachel giving birth to Joseph the birthright holder and Leah giving birth to Judah the sceptre holder and these two will reunite all of Israel being used as that instrument in the hand of God:

Ruth 4:11:
And all the people that were in the gate, and the elders, said, We are witnesses. The LORD make the woman that is come into thine house like Rachel and like Leah, which two did build the house of Israel: and do thou worthily in Ephratah, and be famous in Bethlehem:

1 chronicles 5:2

Jubilee Bible 2000
For Judah prevailed above his brethren and was their prince, but the birthright was Joseph's:)

:judahandephraim1:



The fact that Jacob’s two wives, Leah and Rachel, are spoken of as "building the House of Israel," of necessity divides the immediate household of Jacob into "two families." In Jeremiah 33:24 they are spoken of as "the two families which the Lord hath chosen." The Covenant promise of the BIRTHRIGHT was given to one of these families, and that of the SCEPTRE to the other family. Rachel was to be the mother of "thousands of millions" while Leah was to be the mother of royalty. Genesis 49:10 shows us that Judah represents the SCEPTRE family; and I Chronicles 5:2 tells us "THE BIRTHRIGHT is Joseph’s." Never try to apply a BIRTHRIGHT blessing to the Jews. Judah and the Jews were excluded from the BIRTHRIGHT promises, Joseph from the SCEPTRE. The BIRTHRIGHT people are not, and are never in the Scriptures called Jews.

In Ezekiel the 37th chapter we are told that "the two sticks" which are still separate, but which are yet to be reunited, represent Judah on the one hand, and Joseph and the "House of Israel" on the other. One of these sticks represents the SCEPTRE people and the other the BIRTHRIGHT people. Judah, the inheritor of the SCEPTRE, is only a half bother to Joseph, the inheritor of the BIRTHRIGHT. The SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT inheritors are "two-families" with different mothers. How could the distinction between the SCEPTRE and the BIRTHRIGHT families Judah and Israel be more emphatic?

Each leader will be leader of one of the two families. The two leaders will be Joseph and Judah as the northern kingdom inherits the birthright blessing and the southern kingdom inherits the sceptre blessing

Two families two leaders....Judah the king and Joseph the "prime minister"(high priest) each destined to rule in the 1000 year millennium and then sit as prince of priests(Joseph) and prince of kings(Judah/David) on the left and right of Jesus in the new heaven and new earth for all eternity!
Joseph converses with Judah:

:Joseph and Judah:
 Quoting: waterman


your map is incorrect. i have an atlas of the map of King David's era....the gaza strip belongs to the nation of Israel...all the way from the Jordan east to the great sea
belongs to the nation of Israel, for in the days of King David, we were one nation.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 60438315


correction...all the way from the Jordan WEST to the great sea (Mediterranean)
waterman  (OP)

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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
The birthright blessings of Abraham went to Ephraim and Manasseh (Gen. 48) the sceptre went to Judah. It's all in the Bible. There are only a couple nations in all of history that exhibit the traits of Gen. 48.
 Quoting: anonymous 60168501



King James 2000 Bible

For Judah prevailed above his brethren, and from him came the prince; but the birthright was Joseph's:)


judahandephraim1judahephraim2JOSEPHANDJUDAH50
judahephraim4unibulljudahlion

Last Edited by waterman on 08/07/2014 01:17 PM
-Heed the warning or endure the mourning
Favor ain't fair

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Anonymous Coward
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Waterman - if we are talking using these terms: birthright and sceptre - then would it be fair to further ask these questions:

Who has the birthright and the sceptre out of the children of Abraham's two wives' sons? Ishmael and Isaac. From Hagar and Sarai

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Isaac's sons Jacob and Esau?

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Jacob's sons from his two wives: Joseph and Judah - From Rachel and Leah

Would you say these stories are comparative in any way? That the division of these duties among sons is continued down Isaac's line; Ishmael becoming head of the arab nations line - Esau marrying into the Hittite line - also arab nations etc.
 Quoting: redhouserebel


Who has the birthright and the sceptre out of the children of Abraham's two wives' sons? Ishmael and Isaac. From Hagar and Sarai

Answer: Sarai was renamed by YHVY to Sarah, he called her the Mother Of All Living...and Issac his God's Chosen child, Sarah bore Issac at 90 years old. Issac carries the birthright and the sceptre...through his Seeline...to Jacob, since Esau sold his birthright to Jacob for a bowl of portage....then Jacob fought all night long with the Angel of the Lord (YHVH) to get his blessing...before the sun rose, YHVH gave Jacob the blessing, and renamed him O'Israel....Jocob's 12 sons are the Nation of Israel.

You see Sarai, took God's plan into her own hands, since she was barren, she sent her handmaiden, Haggar, an egyptian, to Abraham so he would have a son, Ishmael, was Sarai's plan, not God's plan.....Ishmael was jealous of Issac because he was YHVH's chosen, because of this jealousy, Sarah banned Haggar and Ishmael from their camp; Abraham didn't want to do it; however, YHVY told Abraham in a dream to do as Sarah wanted, so they were banned.

In the desert, Haggar and Ishmeal were about to die, from thirst, and YHVH spring up water for them to drink, and HE gave them the land of sand and wells....we call them today ARABS....Ishmeal's descendents also married Esau's descendents.....this is why Russia has wells...............

this is all in the Bible, have you read it?
Anonymous Coward
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08/07/2014 01:16 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
"Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Jacob's sons from his two wives: Joseph and Judah - From Rachel and Leah"

Joseph is firstborn of Jacob and Rachel, the woman he truly loved and had to wait 14 years to marry, because Laban, the girls father's rule was the older had to be married before the younger. Leah being the holder bore Jacob 6 children:

1. Ruben (who slept with Bilha, handmaiden of Leah, lost his birthright and Bilha was banned from the camp)

2. Simeon, Leah

3. Levi, Leah

4. Judah, Leah (Leah becomes temporary barren)

5. Dan, of Bilha

6. Naphtali, Bilha

7. Gad, Zilpha Rachael's Handmaiden

8. Asher, Zilpha

9. Issacar, Leah

10.Zebulon, Leah, 14 years is up Rachael becomes Jacob's wife

11.Joseph is Rachel and Jacob's first born, receives the firstborn birthright, Joseph's firstborn Mannasseh, receives Ruben's firstborn right...

THEREFORE THE BIRTHRIGHT REMAINS WITH JOSEPH/MANNASSEH
WHICH IS THE LAND OF THE U.S.A./CANADA --HOUSE OF ISRAEL

12. Benjamin, remains with tribe of Judah in Jerusalem, both very small tribes.

The Scepter (lawgiver) will always remain with Judah...for it was through Judah/Tamar, the twin of Zarah, PHEREZ bore Jesus Christ, the King...so the Scepter remains with Judah...

Read Genesis 49...to see what Judah looks like today, and Joseph!
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
Waterman - if we are talking using these terms: birthright and sceptre - then would it be fair to further ask these questions:

Who has the birthright and the sceptre out of the children of Abraham's two wives' sons? Ishmael and Isaac. From Hagar and Sarai

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Isaac's sons Jacob and Esau?

Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Jacob's sons from his two wives: Joseph and Judah - From Rachel and Leah

Would you say these stories are comparative in any way? That the division of these duties among sons is continued down Isaac's line; Ishmael becoming head of the arab nations line - Esau marrying into the Hittite line - also arab nations etc.
 Quoting: redhouserebel


Who has the birthright and the sceptre out of the children of Abraham's two wives' sons? Ishmael and Isaac. From Hagar and Sarai

Answer: Sarai was renamed by YHVY to Sarah, he called her the Mother Of All Living...and Issac his God's Chosen child, Sarah bore Issac at 90 years old. Issac carries the birthright and the sceptre...through his Seeline...to Jacob, since Esau sold his birthright to Jacob for a bowl of portage....then Jacob fought all night long with the Angel of the Lord (YHVH) to get his blessing...before the sun rose, YHVH gave Jacob the blessing, and renamed him O'Israel....Jocob's 12 sons are the Nation of Israel.

You see Sarai, took God's plan into her own hands, since she was barren, she sent her handmaiden, Haggar, an egyptian, to Abraham so he would have a son, Ishmael, was Sarai's plan, not God's plan.....Ishmael was jealous of Issac because he was YHVH's chosen, because of this jealousy, Sarah banned Haggar and Ishmael from their camp; Abraham didn't want to do it; however, YHVY told Abraham in a dream to do as Sarah wanted, so they were banned.

In the desert, Haggar and Ishmeal were about to die, from thirst, and YHVH spring up water for them to drink, and HE gave them the land of sand and wells....we call them today ARABS....Ishmeal's descendents also married Esau's descendents.....this is why Russia has wells...............

this is all in the Bible, have you read it?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 60438315


And YOU believe just because some man wrote it, the God Almighty, Creator of ALL, is so petty that he pits one of his children against the another?

No.

Go back to God, the Beginning, he created Man in his image and gave Man dominion over the Earth.

That is the inheritance of ALL Mankind.

Keep your serpents tale.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 60438315
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08/07/2014 01:27 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
"[In Ezekiel 37:16, Ezekiel was told to take one stick, FOR JUDAH. Ezekeil was then told to take ANOTHER STICK, FOR JOSEPH. Ezekiel was told in Ezekiel 37:17 to join the two sticks together. THEY SHALL BECOME ONE IN THINE HAND. The two sticks (representing Judah and Joseph) were to first become one in the hand of Ezekiel. In Ezekiel 37:19 God says that the two sticks SHALL BE ONE IN MINE HAND.] [Ezekiel says that] First the two sticks will become one in your hands and afterwards they will be one in my [God’s] hand.” [i.e. This means that: First Judah and Joseph should try to join together from below and afterwards God will help them from above]. On the same theme: “Kol HaTor” emphasizes The Two Sticks (representing Judah and Joseph) Must be Joined Together Through Our Initiative! [2.101] Ezekiel (37) speaks of the stick of Joseph [and Judah and the union of Judah with Joseph]. This concerns the MESSIAH SON OF JOSEPH. The Redemption is dependent on the union of the two sticks, the stick of Joseph with the stick of Judah. These are the two Messiahs, the MESSIAH SON OF JOSEPH and the MESSIAH SON OF DAVID. [It says: “Join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in your hand” (Ezekiel 37;17)]."

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it doesn't matter about which stick is first or second....what matters is the ONE putting the sticks together....of course it isn't Ezekiel....it's one
of God's Chosen, and that ONE will know he/she is suppose to do this at an appointed time...God will tell that one when do to it....Christ said, my sheep know me, and they hear my voice.....this is true, i am one of may who can testify to this truth!
waterman  (OP)

User ID: 57420208
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08/07/2014 01:27 PM

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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
"Who has the birthright and sceptre out of Jacob's sons from his two wives: Joseph and Judah - From Rachel and Leah"

Joseph is firstborn of Jacob and Rachel, the woman he truly loved and had to wait 14 years to marry, because Laban, the girls father's rule was the older had to be married before the younger. Leah being the holder bore Jacob 6 children:

1. Ruben (who slept with Bilha, handmaiden of Leah, lost his birthright and Bilha was banned from the camp)

2. Simeon, Leah

3. Levi, Leah

4. Judah, Leah (Leah becomes temporary barren)

5. Dan, of Bilha

6. Naphtali, Bilha

7. Gad, Zilpha Rachael's Handmaiden

8. Asher, Zilpha

9. Issacar, Leah

10.Zebulon, Leah, 14 years is up Rachael becomes Jacob's wife

11.Joseph is Rachel and Jacob's first born, receives the firstborn birthright, Joseph's firstborn Mannasseh, receives Ruben's firstborn right...

THEREFORE THE BIRTHRIGHT REMAINS WITH JOSEPH/MANNASSEH
WHICH IS THE LAND OF THE U.S.A./CANADA --HOUSE OF ISRAEL

12. Benjamin, remains with tribe of Judah in Jerusalem, both very small tribes.

The Scepter (lawgiver) will always remain with Judah...for it was through Judah/Tamar, the twin of Zarah, PHEREZ bore Jesus Christ, the King...so the Scepter remains with Judah...

Read Genesis 49...to see what Judah looks like today, and Joseph!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 60438315


Gen 49:10:

King James Bible
The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

Jesus has the sceptre and will give it to the witness(David) that will rule in the 1000 year millennium. This David is the shiloh that is coming and to him shall be the gathering of the people after messiah ben "Joseph" pushes the lost 10 tribes together as is stated in deut 33:

13 And of Joseph he said, Blessed of the Lord be his land, for the precious things of heaven, for the dew, and for the deep that coucheth beneath,

14 And for the precious fruits brought forth by the sun, and for the precious things put forth by the moon,

15 And for the chief things of the ancient mountains, and for the precious things of the lasting hills,

16 And for the precious things of the earth and fulness thereof, and for the good will of him that dwelt in the bush: let the blessing come upon the head of Joseph, and upon the top of the head of him that was separated from his brethren.

17 His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh.

judahephraim4unibull
-Heed the warning or endure the mourning
Favor ain't fair

[link to www.timeanddate.com]
[link to www.timeanddate.com]
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 31113085
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08/07/2014 01:33 PM
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Re: Joseph and Judah the birthright and the sceptre
I didn't read much of this thread but did you account for the false Jew Synagogue of Satan (the Khazars) who occupy Palestine currently and claim to be Jewish but are not, but are liars?





GLP