The enemy of my enemy is my friend... | |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yes. That is why I utilized it as a example that we can all rather agree, is a common threat. So can cancer be your friend then, one gathers thats what you are infering. I suppose if one was subject to schadenfreude and took enjoyment in having a perceived enemy 'get cancer', then I suppose it could be seen that way. In a twisted sense. Difficulties strengthen the Mind as labor does the body... ~Seneca |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67806333 United States 02/07/2015 04:13 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | People in general share certain commonalities (the desire to live, to persue what makes life enjoyable, and to not be harmed). Unity under the "Common Threat" was born of that reason-commonality. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67806333 Maybe it would be easier to explain it with a hypothetical situation. Imagine an apartment complex full of people, each with their own families, ideals, creeds, etc. Many of these people are familiar with each other. Some are even friends and enemies. All of the occupants of this complex share one thing in common, they live in the same apartment complex. One day, a gang attacks the complex. The complex is on fire shooting and cries of despair and confusion can be heard inside the complex and on the streets. The members of the complex each go about trying to save their home, some even helping neighbors, some running out to safety and to seek help. All of the apartment dwellers shared commonality, but in this instance they were under common threat and reacted to that common threat. --- Yes exactly. It has been suggested that the only thing that may ever unite Man as a whole, is that which immediately threatens us as a species. Portrayed in movies, like Independence Day and Armageddon. [link to www.youtube.com (secure)] The desire for survival (or that of others)has been a great motivating force throughout know history. It seems to be the easiest to understand aspect of human society, or at least the most commonly recognized one. I don't believe humanity will ever be completely united under threat of survival, as I've seen too often the reactions to such threats and history and my own life. Unity will have to come from another commonality, in my opinion, one not born of fear or threat of harm. True. What is more common than our Humanity? Our planet perhaps. I like that. Any thought on what that may or might be? Well, as we are human, I don't believe that the unifying force which could unite us all will be separate from our commonality as humans. In my thought meanderings, I believe it will have to do with the fact that we share this common ground (and what it means to be human). I expect, that the uniting force will have something to do with human discovery, hope for our own happiness, and something that inspires people to want to persue improvement of human life (but not due to a threat of harm). Right now, in virtually all aspects of society some threat is used as a motivating force for discovery, hope of happiness, an inspiration for change. For example, in my understanding, new developments in medicine and energy are born out of threats. Disease or threats of contagion are great motivators in medicine (not to mention financial implications, but that's another discussion). Likewise, in the energy fields developments are usually born out of limitation of resources or some implied threat of inaccessibility. What if, discovery and motivation came not of necessity (or threat of harm), but out of the human instinct to explore and better themselves? That is the sort of thing I am expecting will unite us. Maybe it is simply the hope that such a thing is possible will be the key. |
Suutari
User ID: 64574944 United States 02/07/2015 04:17 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yes. That is why I utilized it as a example that we can all rather agree, is a common threat. So can cancer be your friend then, one gathers thats what you are infering. I suppose if one was subject to schadenfreude and took enjoyment in having a perceived enemy 'get cancer', then I suppose it could be seen that way. In a twisted sense. Enjoyment ?? Isn't that off topic ? Suutari |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67806333 United States 02/07/2015 04:24 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yes. That is why I utilized it as a example that we can all rather agree, is a common threat. So can cancer be your friend then, one gathers thats what you are infering. I suppose if one was subject to schadenfreude and took enjoyment in having a perceived enemy 'get cancer', then I suppose it could be seen that way. In a twisted sense. I'm going to jump in here and share my thoughts on this. Metaphorically speaking, cancer is an enemy to the health of whomever is affected by it (because it does harm). Although, cancer (as far as I know) has no motivations or feelings. It is merely an affliction named cancer by humans. I agree with the idea that cancer (metaphorically speaking)is an enemy to human health, but not a actual adversary in the human sense. That's my opinon though. |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:28 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The desire for survival (or that of others)has been a great motivating force throughout know history. It seems to be the easiest to understand aspect of human society, or at least the most commonly recognized one. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67806333 I don't believe humanity will ever be completely united under threat of survival, as I've seen too often the reactions to such threats and history and my own life. Unity will have to come from another commonality, in my opinion, one not born of fear or threat of harm. True. What is more common than our Humanity? Our planet perhaps. I like that. Any thought on what that may or might be? Well, as we are human, I don't believe that the unifying force which could unite us all will be separate from our commonality as humans. In my thought meanderings, I believe it will have to do with the fact that we share this common ground (and what it means to be human). I expect, that the uniting force will have something to do with human discovery, hope for our own happiness, and something that inspires people to want to persue improvement of human life (but not due to a threat of harm). Right now, in virtually all aspects of society some threat is used as a motivating force for discovery, hope of happiness, an inspiration for change. For example, in my understanding, new developments in medicine and energy are born out of threats. Disease or threats of contagion are great motivators in medicine (not to mention financial implications, but that's another discussion). Likewise, in the energy fields developments are usually born out of limitation of resources or some implied threat of inaccessibility. What if, discovery and motivation came not of necessity (or threat of harm), but out of the human instinct to explore and better themselves? That is the sort of thing I am expecting will unite us. Maybe it is simply the hope that such a thing is possible will be the key. Well said... Threats do motivate action. Without threat, would motivation exist? Threat of hunger. Threat of sickness. Threat of harm or death. I often consider the 'first fences' and why they were built. To both keep in and keep out. It seems the simple concept of a 'fence' permeates Mankind. Difficulties strengthen the Mind as labor does the body... ~Seneca |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:32 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | We call it 'Fighting Cancer' because those who are battling cancer, are doing that very thing. Along with the health care professionals and familial and friend support. Cancer has been on my mind due to the threat of said, forcing me to finally break one of my own bad habits. One I both loved and hated. Day 9. Difficulties strengthen the Mind as labor does the body... ~Seneca |
Necromancer User ID: 17824549 United States 02/07/2015 04:34 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:35 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:35 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67801204 United States 02/07/2015 04:37 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | ... Quoting: Seer777 What would cause such proof to your liking? For example, how Americans united with each other after 9/11. How old divisive religious, racial, and political lines dissolves and we became unite against what was perceived as a 'common threat'. However ever true or false that threat was, is beside the point. 'Common Threat'. That phrase holds much. Time and experience aid in the proofing of a friendship. From my standpoint, friendships are not made quickly or lightly. The example you give, for me is one of mutual alliance. Alliances can be formed (and often are)at the drop of a hat, for pursuit of similar goals or ideas. This, in my opinion, does not imply friendship at its base level- merely alliance and some similar interests. Good points. Perhaps the ambiguity between a 'friend' and an 'ally'. Perhaps that is why Americans fell back into dividing themselves. The Common Threat was found to be 'not very credible' and such that, the mutual threat dissolved the 'uniting', the event first birthed. People in general share certain commonalities (the desire to live, to persue what makes life enjoyable, and to not be harmed). Unity under the "Common Threat" was born of that reason-commonality. Maybe it would be easier to explain it with a hypothetical situation. Imagine an apartment complex full of people, each with their own families, ideals, creeds, etc. Many of these people are familiar with each other. Some are even friends and enemies. All of the occupants of this complex share one thing in common, they live in the same apartment complex. One day, a gang attacks the complex. The complex is on fire shooting and cries of despair and confusion can be heard inside the complex and on the streets. The members of the complex each go about trying to save their home, some even helping neighbors, some running out to safety and to seek help. All of the apartment dwellers shared commonality, but in this instance they were under common threat and reacted to that common threat. --- that's a good example I think "the enemy of my enemy is my friend", something made me think of this too, don't what or why though. I doubt it was something I was reading, and I don't watch tv so... |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67801204 United States 02/07/2015 04:38 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67806333 United States 02/07/2015 04:44 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The desire for survival (or that of others)has been a great motivating force throughout know history. It seems to be the easiest to understand aspect of human society, or at least the most commonly recognized one. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 67806333 I don't believe humanity will ever be completely united under threat of survival, as I've seen too often the reactions to such threats and history and my own life. Unity will have to come from another commonality, in my opinion, one not born of fear or threat of harm. True. What is more common than our Humanity? Our planet perhaps. I like that. Any thought on what that may or might be? Well, as we are human, I don't believe that the unifying force which could unite us all will be separate from our commonality as humans. In my thought meanderings, I believe it will have to do with the fact that we share this common ground (and what it means to be human). I expect, that the uniting force will have something to do with human discovery, hope for our own happiness, and something that inspires people to want to persue improvement of human life (but not due to a threat of harm). Right now, in virtually all aspects of society some threat is used as a motivating force for discovery, hope of happiness, an inspiration for change. For example, in my understanding, new developments in medicine and energy are born out of threats. Disease or threats of contagion are great motivators in medicine (not to mention financial implications, but that's another discussion). Likewise, in the energy fields developments are usually born out of limitation of resources or some implied threat of inaccessibility. What if, discovery and motivation came not of necessity (or threat of harm), but out of the human instinct to explore and better themselves? That is the sort of thing I am expecting will unite us. Maybe it is simply the hope that such a thing is possible will be the key. Well said... Threats do motivate action. Without threat, would motivation exist? Threat of hunger. Threat of sickness. Threat of harm or death. I often consider the 'first fences' and why they were built. To both keep in and keep out. It seems the simple concept of a 'fence' permeates Mankind. Not all motivation and inspiration comes from threat or negativity. Creativity is a fair example of this aspect of humanity. Personally, I enjoy painting and creating simple artwork. I receive no benefit aside from expressing my ideas and enjoying results. I am not motivated to create artwork due to necessity or threat of harm. As far as fences go, aside from the obvious reasons to have them (containment, limitation, security), I believe that the idea of barrier or measurement is a reflection of the human experience. As a human, in my understanding, there are barriers all around us. For example, our bodies, minds and experiences are separate from others. While in some cases the barrier is abstract, it is still understood as a separation in the case of individuality. Now, having said that, it does not mean there are not commonalities or some understood collective between individuals. In other words, we are all individuals, yet, we are all human. Fences are part of expressing that individuality (or barrier)between us. |
Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 04:45 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Suutari
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 67801204 United States 02/07/2015 05:02 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Could it also be considered then that, The enemy of my friend is my enemy... Be just another way of looking at it? Yeah, it sounds like another way of looking at it I think If my friend has an enemy, and it is a problem and he/she asks for help, then i suppose it is now also my problem? |
g.r.i.t.s.
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 67806333 United States 02/07/2015 05:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67801204 United States 02/07/2015 05:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Could it also be considered then that, The enemy of my friend is my enemy... Be just another way of looking at it? Thats alot of enemies. I suppose it depends who you're friends are and how many enemies they have. But I have had friends with friends who I got along with, or never even known. And they have had 'enemies'(really people they didn't get along with) who I knew and would wonder how that whole feud began in the first place. It gets complex in a hurry |
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Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 05:09 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Could it also be considered then that, The enemy of my friend is my enemy... Be just another way of looking at it? Yeah, it sounds like another way of looking at it I think If my friend has an enemy, and it is a problem and he/she asks for help, then i suppose it is now also my problem? It seems to work that way in many aspects of society and personal and interpersonal relationships. Even if the 'enemy' be just a group defined thought form. Like say, opposing teams. Fans of Team A group themselves as do fans of Team B. If your friend likes Team A, then you are more likely to also like Team A, often due location, and in that hold a common force you oppose. Bit of a rough example. Hope that makes sense. Gang wars of the 90's Bloods/Crips come to call as well. Us vs. Them essentially. Last Edited by Seer777 on 02/07/2015 05:12 PM Difficulties strengthen the Mind as labor does the body... ~Seneca |
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Searchalot
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Seer777
(OP) Ride the wings of the mind User ID: 64388290 United States 02/07/2015 05:11 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 67801204 United States 02/07/2015 05:15 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Could it also be considered then that, The enemy of my friend is my enemy... Be just another way of looking at it? Yeah, it sounds like another way of looking at it I think If my friend has an enemy, and it is a problem and he/she asks for help, then i suppose it is now also my problem? It seems to work that way in many aspects of society and personal and interpersonal relationships. Even if the 'enemy' be just a group defined thought form. Like say, opposing teams. Fans of Team A group themselves as do fans of Team B. If your friend likes Team A, then you are more likely to also like Team A, often due propriety, and in that hold a common force you oppose. Bit of a rough example. Hope that makes sense. Gang wars of the 90's Bloods/Crips come to call as well. Us vs. Them essentially. That's a good example Team A vs B, or Bloods and Crips you could be killed(and many have been) for wearing red in a Crip neighborhood even if you weren't a Blood and vise versa. It just doesn't make sense. Even if he was a Blood, he didn't even know the guy most likely. They could have been best friends in another place and time |
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Suutari
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 67806333 United States 02/07/2015 05:19 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yes. But you often find yourself in the middle. Which is a very uncomfortable place to find oneself. To some degree, however, in situations like this (being friends with and enemy of a friend) it is up to you to make clear to all parties your intentions. Communication is key. From my experiences with situations such as this, the friends of mine who were enemies to each other, were made to understand that each of our relationships were separate. As they were my friends, they keep the matters of their adversaries to themselves. There have actually been a few times in these cases where the status of enemy was dropped between the adversarial parties, due to the friendship as well. |
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