10 More Amazing Proofs For The Pre tribulation Rapture

A straw man argument is a construct of man. I was just pointing out how fallacious it is. It has nothing to do with the Gospel, and everything to do with false arguments of men.

You seem to be confused. Pretribulationists believe Yahshua & Paul when they said to watch and wait for Yahshua's soon return. That is not a straw man. You are attempting to deflect here I think.

There is a crown waiting for those who love Yahshua's coming, as I've shown. There is no need to deny that further.

Pretribulationism has nothing to do with idolatry or pontification. You are mistaken. It is a part of the Dispensation Theology, and is a belief in the timing of the return of Yahshua for the resurrection & rapture of the Church-Age saints.

No one said Pretribulationism has anything to do with salvation. That is a straw man argument of your creation. There are many doctrines in the bible. Is it idolatrous to defend any or even all of them? No, it is rightly dividing the Word and contending for that part of the faith. If someone attacks 'baptism' and you defend it, does that make you an idolater? No, of course not.

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That's right. We shouldn't think more highly of ourselves. We are all sinners. Some lost, but others saved by grace.

Thank the Lord for His sacrifice and grace for us. We are nothing, and Yahweh is no respecter of men.

Salvation is open to everyone who will repent and have faith in Yahshua and what He did for us.

And rewards and treasures are available in heaven for any believer who lives a faithful Christian life and follows the commandments of Yahshua. If you do good works after salvation, you too will be storing up treasures in heaven. In fact, we are commanded to do so:

"But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:"- Matthew 6:20

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You don't have to be a Pretribulationist to receive some crowns in heaven.

Preachers, martyrs, overcomers and lovers of Christ will receive crowns too.

Thanks for the correction.

I should then clarify: The first two-thirds of Amos 9 (1-10) talks about the destruction of Israel.

Then the last third of Amos 9 (11-15) speaks of Israel's restoration at least 1,878 or more years later.

And verse 10 which you quoted was talking about the earlier destruction of Israel, not the latter restoration of Israel.

Yahweh was talking about those who attempted to prevent or deny His judgment against Israel. It had nothing to do with condemning future rapture believers. That's a stretch of anyone's imagination.

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Oh, so works DO matter, but not for salvation?

So, are we graded on a curve then? Will those with Crowns have authority over the lessor saved?

What a fascinating idea, that there are some people who will receive rewards for good works yet works are not needed for salvation.

I would love someone to explain that.

Everyone works at a factory.

All are employees and draw a wage.

Some are bludgers who stay at the bottom of the ladder becauze...they are bludgers.

Some work hard and get promoted.

But ALL are still in the SAME factory.

Fuck...even a retarded child could figure that out.

Dickheads.

Gibberish, Nonsense, not knowing the scriptures, you destroy the truth...

What Restoration?

The Apostles after spending 40 days with Yeshua after the resurrection, where He taught them about the Kingdom

We get One question, they asked in that time.

Act 1:6

When they therefore were come together, they asked of Him, saying, Adonai, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

It hadn't happened, that is Why they Asked.

So

nothing has been imagined except your answer, and seeing that the majority hold to the doctrine that they will be taken before the wicked in amerika... He warns what will happen to them...they lack faith,

Which is another plain contradiction to the teachings of YESHUA, at the end of the age, that the tares will be taken first, before the wheat are gathered into His barn.

There is no stretch, this is a Warning...

There is One Second Coming...And it is After the Great Tribulation

Thankfully, HE did warn, for those who have ears to hear


Heb 9:28

So Messiah was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Yep, basically.. that's it.

It's a question of the heart.

It's a question of our Will.

Some Will Not.

To Israel that repents and calls for Him.

Why do you tell me not to look for Jesus Christ now?

This crap is still being discussed?

What's wrong with you pre-tribbers? Did you get dropped on your heads as babies or something? One of, if not the absolute dumbest man-made doctrines ever to be twisted out of cherry-picking Bible verses. Complete hogwash, and you dumb sheep that believe it are just being misled and you can't even see it.

Beautiful synchronicity.

So salvation is about working for a Boss and politics, profit and being better than the next guy to get ahead and more rewards from the man upstairs.

Commercial salvation. Got it.

So only pretribbers look for Christ now?

Thats a bold statement and a small step to "chosen people" status for pre trib idol worshippers. It is not difficult for some to see pretribbers as the people who discount the role of faith in Jesus and now focus on obscure and unproven "doctrine" to put themselves above others who do not accept their contrived views.

It does not seem to fit with the Gospel.

So only pretribbers look for Christ now?

Thats a bold statement and a small step to "chosen people" status for pre trib idol worshippers. It is not difficult for some to see pretribbers as the people who discount the role of faith in Jesus and now focus on obscure and unproven "doctrine" to put themselves above others who do not accept their contrived views.

It does not seem to fit with the Gospel.

I thought it novel too when I first discovered it. But yet it is there in the bible. And it has nothing to do with our salvation.

Apparently, works do matter when it comes to receiving rewards at the Bema Judgment Seat of Christ in heaven. It will determine what rewards you get.

I don't know about any curve. We will not keep the crowns, but instead will give them to our Savior Yahshua. Only He is worthy of any crowns.

I don't see anyone being any more, or any less saved than any others in heaven.

Yahshua has commanded us to do good works in His name. We are to love one another, feed the hungry, help the poor & widows & orphans, etc. It seems faithful service to Him will be rewarded in heaven. Remember the parable of the talents?

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[link to www.gotquestions.org]

The master went away to a far off land for awhile and left money to his servants to invest for him. And when he returned he rewarded those servants who had done good works for him while he was away. The good servants were rewarded according to their good works.

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Streets are gold there.

So its not money they work for.

Its station.

Only Pretribulationists are watching and waiting for the imminent return of their Savior. All others do not believe this will happen.

Next on the prophetic calendar for all other rapture positions is the revelation of the Antichrist, who MUST come before the Second Advent/Second Coming.

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It's about believing Jesus Christ

because your heart is set for God


or not believing Jesus Christ

because your heart is set against God.


It is Your Will

and Your Will will be done.

For or Against.

Amen brother.

Thread: Pre-Trib Rapture

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As it was in the days of Noah

The wicked were removed, and Noah remained on the earth

As it was during the days of Lot

He Escaped Judgment, and the wicked were destroyed

As Written

Proverbs 10:30

The righteous shall never be removed: but the wicked shall not inhabit the earth.

We who are alive and remain, will be changed when He returns, caught up to meet Him, and His feet will set upon the Mount of Olives, We will not be removed.

the one taken, is taken to destruction.

The one left behind, Is Righteous, was not removed


Mat 13:41

The Son of man shall send forth His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

Last Edited by Ebed~232 on 05/30/2016 01:11 AM

Do YOU look for Jesus Christ now?

Rapture=144,000 which are the church of Philadelphia grafted into Israel (Romans 11, Galatians 2+3) that doesn't mean they're all "Christians" just those that are acting according to the church of Philadelphia and have the GOLD seal of the living GOD (Holy Spirit GOLD).

This "pre-tribulation" actually relates to whoever the "angel from the east" is; the baptism of Christ (fiery trial) is a process like in JOB. The 7 seals are the seven troubles/calamities with the Holy Spirit (Job 5:19). The mount sion in Revelation is in the kingdom of Heaven; not on earth.

Christ coming to get you means something else, that's with the Holy Spirit inside of you. He drags you back to heaven when a certain number has been met (i.e. 144,000 as per revelation). This is why you don't wait around for Jesus to come and save you in the flesh, because it requires work on your part with the Holy Spirit. The judgment on earth of the one like like a son of man is that angel from the east and the 144,000 with Christ inside them. People have to understand what John 17 means regarding oneness; it is Christ but it won't look like the image you have of him (actually Jesus probably didn't look like that image to begin with).

I do.

What I fail to see is what difference it makes to my "station" in the Kingdom of His Father.

I also fail to see how people who do not accept pre-tribulation rapture are somehow deceived or lessor in the Fathers eyes.

I also fail to see how this entire "I get more blessings in the Kingdom because of all these goods works" fits.

It reeks of indulgences where people who are so good have so much righteousness, they not only get to dictate what doctrines are more important than others, they can judge others for not believing the same things they believe.

The Saints have always suffered at the hands of those who would come against them. It has always been that way, yet, now you tell me that before we are tested just as others have been tested, we will be swept away in the clouds so we escape the test of our faith?

How is the tribulation too much of a test for us?

How is it any worse than being fed to lions, dipped in wax and burned alive or thousands of other fates of those who came before?

But YOU claim because of your belief in the pre trib, you will get to escape the test AND be rewarded for your belief while others will tested and then be saved?

Come on, that does not make any sense at all. That is simply not justice nor mercy.

God let others who believed be tortured and tormented in unspeakable ways, but because you are pretribber, you get a pass AND more rewards in Heaven?

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In your opinion, what is God's Purpose in the Great Tribulation?

Eze 34:12

As a shepherd seeketh out his flock in the day that he is among his sheep that are scattered; so will I seek out My sheep, and will deliver them out of all places where they have been scattered in the cloudy and dark day.


Dan 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Jer 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble, but he shall be saved out of it.



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Exodus 19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto Myself.

Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.


Ezekiel 20:35 And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you Face to face.


Luke 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man


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Ecc 3:15 That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and GOD requireth that which is past.

Isaiah 4:5 And YAHUWAH will create upon every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and upon her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night: for upon all the glory shall be a Chuppah

Mic 7:15 According to the days of thy coming out of the land of egypt I will show unto him marvellous things.


Jer 23:7 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith YHWH, that they shall no more say, YHWH liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt;


8 But, YHWH liveth, which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land.


During the Great Tribulation, Jacobs Trouble, He is delivered

unfortunately for christians that deny their heritage, the Promise of Jacob being delivered is not for them.

Ephesians 2:11-12, Galatians 3:29 ~ Isaiah 41:8

where is that gentile gate into the New Jerusalem? By which the Righteous shall enter the city

There isn't one.

Last Edited by Ebed~232 on 05/30/2016 01:56 AM

Enoch was a sort of type for the Pre-Trib rapture. He was raptured to heaven, and then the Great Flood came.

Also, Noah and his family were saved up and out of the Great Flood. Yahweh did not make them tread water or hold onto logs for the duration of they Flood. Instead, they were save out of it.

When Lot and most of his family were saved, they were taken out of the city of Sodom before it was destroyed. They were not made to sit there and endure the destruction of their city around them.

If we get raptured at the 2nd Coming, we will be taken away- up into the air to be with our Messiah. Then after that we will return back to earth to be with Him in Jerusalem. So even then we would be taken away, if only temporarily.

But we need to take a look at Proverbs 10:30 more closely:

"The righteous shall never be removed: but the wicked shall not inhabit the earth."- Proverbs 10:30

This word "removed" needs some further examination. The original Hebrew phonetic here is 'mot.' The KJV Strong's Hebrew number is 4131. [link to biblehub.com] And it means "to totter, shake, slip." And if you look at different English bible translations of this verse and word, you get: "uprooted, disturbed, moved, shaken, & overthrown." You see, it does not mean a physical moving away, such as in a rapture. It means something totally different. So therefore it should not be used to try to deny the rapture.

[link to biblehub.com]

The Old Testament prophets had no direct knowledge of the rapture anyway since the Church was a mystery to them that was not revealed until Yahshua came at the First Advent.

"8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ; 9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ: 10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God, 11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord"- Ephesians 3:8-11

"26 that is, the mystery which has been hidden from the past ages and generations, but has now been manifested to His saints, 27 to whom God willed to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory."- Colossians 1:26-27

Matthew 13:41 speaks of the Wheat & Tares judgment. This will indeed happen at the end of the Tribulation. The unbelieving 'weeds' will be burned up by fire in the pit. But the Tribulation Saints that kept the faith until the end will be allowed to live on into the new Millennial Kingdom of Christ.


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