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The Gun Thread

 
The Original Mind
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02/23/2018 05:06 PM
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The Gun Thread
There's a lot of us on GLP who don't own guns, or who want/need advice concerning guns.

There's a lot of people of GLP who can offer help and advice.

Now is the time to consider buying a gun AND learning how to use it.

This thread is for people to discuss all firearms, and to ask for help and advice.

As I learn more about guns, I'll update this post.

-----

ADVICE

1) ALWAYS treat a firearm like it's loaded.

2) Jeff Cooper's Four Rules:
i. All guns are always loaded.
ii. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
iii. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.
iv. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

3) Know what your goal is. Home defense? Sports or target practice? Collecting? Until you have answered that question, don't buy a firearm.

-----

LINKS

Join the NRA (National Rifle Association): [link to membership.nra.org (secure)]

Join the GOA (Gun Owners of America): [link to gunowners.org (secure)]

Last Edited by The Original Mind on 02/23/2018 09:21 PM
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 05:07 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
First question. I've seen people recommending a 308 bolt action rifle for training. Why that gun? How can I tell a good 308 from a bad 308?
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
jake

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02/23/2018 05:13 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses

accurate up from 300 to 600 yards.

Last Edited by Slowly awakening on 02/23/2018 05:16 PM
Evil controls the ignorant... Climate change is a hoax so is the vax you have been fear-porned into compliance!

Definition Satan from the bible: Satan (Rev 12:7) exercising his subtle (indirect) impact on heathen governments (powers) – i.e. accomplishing his hellish agenda from "behind the scenes."
Southern Man
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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses
 Quoting: jake


I would not recommend a 308 as a starter rifle. How about a Ruger 22 to start with and get the hang of shooting and aiming.
jake

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02/23/2018 05:17 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses
 Quoting: jake


I would not recommend a 308 as a starter rifle. How about a Ruger 22 to start with and get the hang of shooting and aiming.
 Quoting: Southern Man 1685967


much cheaper to shoot and learn on
Evil controls the ignorant... Climate change is a hoax so is the vax you have been fear-porned into compliance!

Definition Satan from the bible: Satan (Rev 12:7) exercising his subtle (indirect) impact on heathen governments (powers) – i.e. accomplishing his hellish agenda from "behind the scenes."
Back_To_The_Shadows

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02/23/2018 05:18 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Get a .338 Lapua Magnum. Very accurate.
Make pain a friend and you will have a friend for life. ~ Robert R. McCammon

“Make friends with pain, and you will never be alone.~Ken Chlouber
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2018 05:18 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Wait for Lester to show up, he'll answer all your questions.
jake

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02/23/2018 05:18 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Get a .338 Lapua Magnum. Very accurate.
 Quoting: Back_To_The_Shadows


M-98 with 3 different barrels

coolest gun i have ever owned
Evil controls the ignorant... Climate change is a hoax so is the vax you have been fear-porned into compliance!

Definition Satan from the bible: Satan (Rev 12:7) exercising his subtle (indirect) impact on heathen governments (powers) – i.e. accomplishing his hellish agenda from "behind the scenes."
jake

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02/23/2018 05:20 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Get a .338 Lapua Magnum. Very accurate.
 Quoting: Back_To_The_Shadows


M-98 with 3 different barrels

coolest gun i have ever owned
 Quoting: jake


Very expensive to shoot



Last Edited by Slowly awakening on 02/23/2018 05:21 PM
Evil controls the ignorant... Climate change is a hoax so is the vax you have been fear-porned into compliance!

Definition Satan from the bible: Satan (Rev 12:7) exercising his subtle (indirect) impact on heathen governments (powers) – i.e. accomplishing his hellish agenda from "behind the scenes."
Larry D. Croc

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02/23/2018 05:23 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
First question. I've seen people recommending a 308 bolt action rifle for training. Why that gun? How can I tell a good 308 from a bad 308?
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Ruger makes a good product. So does Tikka. So does Sako.

It's a commonly available cartridge that's pretty accurate and pretty powerful at the ranges you'd likely be shooting.
"Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell, where they already have it." Ronald Reagan

The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan
Larry D. Croc

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02/23/2018 05:24 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses

accurate up from 300 to 600 yards.
 Quoting: jake


.308 is a cartridge, it's not "the same sniper rifle" anyone uses.
"Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell, where they already have it." Ronald Reagan

The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 05:24 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses
 Quoting: jake


I would not recommend a 308 as a starter rifle. How about a Ruger 22 to start with and get the hang of shooting and aiming.
 Quoting: Southern Man 1685967


much cheaper to shoot and learn on
 Quoting: jake


The 308 or 22?
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 05:28 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
First question. I've seen people recommending a 308 bolt action rifle for training. Why that gun? How can I tell a good 308 from a bad 308?
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Ruger makes a good product. So does Tikka. So does Sako.

It's a commonly available cartridge that's pretty accurate and pretty powerful at the ranges you'd likely be shooting.
 Quoting: Larry D. Croc


Could you explain the difference between a cartridge and the alternative?

I'd be shooting initially at a local sportsmans club.
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
Larry D. Croc

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02/23/2018 05:29 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
The Ruger 10/22 is a good all around plinker. It'll get you used to firearms in terms of handling them, safety, etc.

Given that it has essentially no felt recoil you'll find a major difference when you step up to a center-fire cartridge. The .22lr, which the 10/22 uses, is a rimfire cartridge.

And if you do go with a .22lr, which I think everyone should have as a matter of course, I'd encourage the use of standard velocity rounds. You'll get people here raging about "hi velocity rounds, man, yeah, that's the ticket!" It's not "the ticket. You'll get much better accuracy with a standard velocity round. There's not anyone shooting .22lr for accuracy that uses anything like a "CCI Stinger" or whatever they call 'em these days.
"Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell, where they already have it." Ronald Reagan

The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan
Larry D. Croc

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02/23/2018 05:34 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
First question. I've seen people recommending a 308 bolt action rifle for training. Why that gun? How can I tell a good 308 from a bad 308?
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Ruger makes a good product. So does Tikka. So does Sako.

It's a commonly available cartridge that's pretty accurate and pretty powerful at the ranges you'd likely be shooting.
 Quoting: Larry D. Croc


Could you explain the difference between a cartridge and the alternative?

I'd be shooting initially at a local sportsmans club.
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Cartridges are the combination of primer, powder, typically a brass cartridge, and a bullet of some weight and profile.

Smaller bullet sizes, say a .223 or 5.56mm which is commonly used in the AR platform, has lower recoil, higher velocities, and a lower ballistic coefficient than the .308 which would have a heavier bullet in most cases, a larger brass casing, more powder, and a slower initial velocity.

The .223 is more of a wounding round (yes it can be lethal but it's adoption by the military was based on a desire to wound more of the enemy than outright kill them. Troops can carry more ammunition with the .223 due to it's smaller size and lighter weight), while the .308 is going to do more damage (and likely be more lethal at longer ranges).
"Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell, where they already have it." Ronald Reagan

The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." Ronald Reagan
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 08:09 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Case in point for gun safety.

Was just over at my wife's grandparents' house. Turns out he has a 10/22, so I fired a few shots. Nice gun.

Anyway, he was showing off a couple of pistols he has, a 380 and a 9mm.

For some God-only-knows reason, he chambered a round into the 9, ejected it, forgot the loaded magazine was still in, and pulled the trigger. Gun goes off right there in his room, me standing beside him, my daughter in the other room.

Thankfully no one was hurt.

Don't do that.

UPDATE: The bullet hit a 1-inch water pipe. The basement is flooding. I'm heading over to help carry up buckets of water.

Last Edited by The Original Mind on 02/23/2018 10:36 PM
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
Where Eagles Dare
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02/23/2018 08:15 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
What is your desired endstate? Home defense? Sporting/target shooting? Collecting?

Until you've established a desired endstate, you don't need a firearm.
Isaiah 40:31 - But they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

“They’ve got us surrounded again, the poor bastards.” - U.S. Army Paratrooper at Bastogne
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2018 08:31 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
I am partial to the SKS (especially the Russian variety) as a great rifle for someone who is new, wants to be armed and proficient, but is not necessarily a gun aficionado.

Firstly because its a complete unit. The integral box magazine, 10 rounds (5 legally in Canada) means you don't need to stock up on expensive magazines and the mag is never dropped and lost. With a small amount of practice you would be amazed at how fast you can reload with stripper clips. It also has an integral bayonet if you like that kind of thing, if not it can easily be removed.

Second is that its a complete tank. Simpler even than an AK and just as durable and noob proof. It is also a milled receiver instead of stamped like the typical AK. The sights are idiot proof as well.

Third is that it is a 30 cal, so can be used for deer legally wherever a rifle season exists.

Fourth is cost: ammo is nearly as cheap as .556 and just about as available. Stripper clips are cheaper still. The rifle itself here in Canada can still be found in the $200 range and maybe double that in the US (still cheap).

Would I choose an SKS as a dedicated first line battle rifle? No, of course not. But on a strict budget, or where restricted by law, or as a secondary weapon to arm friends and family - its hard to beat.
Vicious Deplorable dollop
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02/23/2018 08:32 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
There's a lot of us on GLP who don't own guns, or who want/need advice concerning guns.

There's a lot of people of GLP who can offer help and advice.

Now is the time to consider buying a gun AND learning how to use it.

This thread is for people to discuss all firearms, and to ask for help and advice.

As I learn more about guns, I'll update this post.

-----

Links

Join the NRA (National Rifle Association): [link to membership.nra.org (secure)]

Join the GOA (Gun Owners of America): [link to gunowners.org (secure)]
 Quoting: The Original Mind


clappa Good thread.

Memorize these and live them.
Jeff Cooper's Four Rules:
1. All guns are always loaded.
2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.
4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

Start on a .22 LR rifle and a .22 LR pistol. Put a red dot on each and have more fun.

Rifle choices... Ruger 10/22, Remington 597, Marlin Model 795

Pistol choices... Smith & Wesson Victory, Browning Buckmark, Ruger MK IV

Red Dot choices... Burris Fastfire 3 or Fastfire 2 - in 3 or 4 moa.

Last Edited by Vicious Deplorable dollop on 02/23/2018 08:44 PM
Kamala Harris is not a Natural Born Citizen. She's illegally running.

Used by the Founders...
Book I of The Law of Nations, Chapter XIX, § 212 (Joseph Chitty numbering) – “Citizens and natives”
reads: 'The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to
its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in
the country, of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by
the children of the citizens
, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all
their rights.' 1758 Emerich de Vattel

Oh' What the Hell, do I look like I want to die in some nursing home one day...
America must have 4 new Constitutional Amendments...
1. Drug Tests and Mental Evaluations on all politicians and judges randomly five times per year.
2. Term Limits for Federal politicians and judges.
3. Mental and health standards for Supreme Court Justices and retirement age set.
4. A 'Star Chamber' of elected Natural Born Citizens (no attorney's) to ivestigate, try, and prosecute the politicians and government employee's as they see fit.

Mandatory death penalty by public hanging is the merciful sentence for pedos and their associates.

Democrats are a WMD, literally.

Let Justice Be Done Though The Heavens Fall.
Pilgrim001

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02/23/2018 08:53 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses
 Quoting: jake


I would not recommend a 308 as a starter rifle. How about a Ruger 22 to start with and get the hang of shooting and aiming.
 Quoting: Southern Man 1685967


This. A Ruger 10-22. If you like, there are 25 and 30 rd mags available to fit it. One of the most popular guns made and lots of aftermarket stuff to fit. It's a great gun and will serve you well. Remember that Placement means a LOT in self-defense. A well placed 22 in the aggressors eye will fuck up his day.
Communism is for LOSERS
Communism is SLAVERY

Fuck Joe Biden
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2018 08:58 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
If your new to guns and maybe have weak hands for whatever reason, take a look at the new M&P Shield 380 Easy. Its very easy to rack the slide and has a regular safety as well as a grip safety. Very little recoil as well.
Pilgrim001

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02/23/2018 09:01 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
Case in point for gun safety.

Was just over at my wife's grandparents' house. Turns out he has a 10/22, so I fired a few shots. Nice gun.

Anyway, he was showing off a couple of pistols he has, a 380 and a 9mm.

For some God-only-knows reason, he chambered a round into the 9, ejected it, forgot the loaded clip was still in, and pulled the trigger. Gun goes off right there in his room, me standing beside him, my daughter in the other room.

Thankfully no one was hurt.

Don't do that.

UPDATE: The bullet hit a 1-inch water pipe. The basement is flooding. I'm heading over to help carry up buckets of water.
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Always, Always, Always treat every gun like it's loaded. Even if you have to check it a dozen times. It's lucky Gramps didn't kill someone. Luck doesn't always appear.

If you want to get along with the gunnies here, never refer to the magazine as a "clip".
Communism is for LOSERS
Communism is SLAVERY

Fuck Joe Biden
Pilgrim001

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02/23/2018 09:06 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
I am partial to the SKS (especially the Russian variety) as a great rifle for someone who is new, wants to be armed and proficient, but is not necessarily a gun aficionado.

Firstly because its a complete unit. The integral box magazine, 10 rounds (5 legally in Canada) means you don't need to stock up on expensive magazines and the mag is never dropped and lost. With a small amount of practice you would be amazed at how fast you can reload with stripper clips. It also has an integral bayonet if you like that kind of thing, if not it can easily be removed.

Second is that its a complete tank. Simpler even than an AK and just as durable and noob proof. It is also a milled receiver instead of stamped like the typical AK. The sights are idiot proof as well.

Third is that it is a 30 cal, so can be used for deer legally wherever a rifle season exists.

Fourth is cost: ammo is nearly as cheap as .556 and just about as available. Stripper clips are cheaper still. The rifle itself here in Canada can still be found in the $200 range and maybe double that in the US (still cheap).

Would I choose an SKS as a dedicated first line battle rifle? No, of course not. But on a strict budget, or where restricted by law, or as a secondary weapon to arm friends and family - its hard to beat.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76240069


SKS's have a wonky firing pin that sometimes sticks and goes full auto. Replace it with a pin that has a spring.
Communism is for LOSERS
Communism is SLAVERY

Fuck Joe Biden
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 09:11 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
What is your desired endstate? Home defense? Sporting/target shooting? Collecting?

Until you've established a desired endstate, you don't need a firearm.
 Quoting: Where Eagles Dare


Great advice.

Home defense and target shooting.
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 09:12 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
Case in point for gun safety.

Was just over at my wife's grandparents' house. Turns out he has a 10/22, so I fired a few shots. Nice gun.

Anyway, he was showing off a couple of pistols he has, a 380 and a 9mm.

For some God-only-knows reason, he chambered a round into the 9, ejected it, forgot the loaded clip was still in, and pulled the trigger. Gun goes off right there in his room, me standing beside him, my daughter in the other room.

Thankfully no one was hurt.

Don't do that.

UPDATE: The bullet hit a 1-inch water pipe. The basement is flooding. I'm heading over to help carry up buckets of water.
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Always, Always, Always treat every gun like it's loaded. Even if you have to check it a dozen times. It's lucky Gramps didn't kill someone. Luck doesn't always appear.

If you want to get along with the gunnies here, never refer to the magazine as a "clip".
 Quoting: Pilgrim001


Yeah, that's solid advice.

So what's the difference between a magazine and a clip?
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
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02/23/2018 09:22 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
I used to tell people to get a 10/22 for their first rifle which is and always will be a great rifle. But just get a AR platform rifle and shoot that for a while to figure out if you want to go bigger and longer range or not. 308 is a waste of money if you ask me. A 30-06 is a much better 30 caliber rifle then the 308. The 6.5 Creedmore is the way to go for long range and minimal recoil these days. If you end up liking that thing you can always go bigger with a 338 Lapua. My favorite caliber right now is a .257 Weatherby but you need to reload that cartridge because it is very expensive to buy.
The Original Mind  (OP)

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02/23/2018 09:23 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
The Ruger 10/22 is a good all around plinker. It'll get you used to firearms in terms of handling them, safety, etc.

Given that it has essentially no felt recoil you'll find a major difference when you step up to a center-fire cartridge. The .22lr, which the 10/22 uses, is a rimfire cartridge.

And if you do go with a .22lr, which I think everyone should have as a matter of course, I'd encourage the use of standard velocity rounds. You'll get people here raging about "hi velocity rounds, man, yeah, that's the ticket!" It's not "the ticket. You'll get much better accuracy with a standard velocity round. There's not anyone shooting .22lr for accuracy that uses anything like a "CCI Stinger" or whatever they call 'em these days.
 Quoting: Larry D. Croc


First question. I've seen people recommending a 308 bolt action rifle for training. Why that gun? How can I tell a good 308 from a bad 308?
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Ruger makes a good product. So does Tikka. So does Sako.

It's a commonly available cartridge that's pretty accurate and pretty powerful at the ranges you'd likely be shooting.
 Quoting: Larry D. Croc


Could you explain the difference between a cartridge and the alternative?

I'd be shooting initially at a local sportsmans club.
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Cartridges are the combination of primer, powder, typically a brass cartridge, and a bullet of some weight and profile.

Smaller bullet sizes, say a .223 or 5.56mm which is commonly used in the AR platform, has lower recoil, higher velocities, and a lower ballistic coefficient than the .308 which would have a heavier bullet in most cases, a larger brass casing, more powder, and a slower initial velocity.

The .223 is more of a wounding round (yes it can be lethal but it's adoption by the military was based on a desire to wound more of the enemy than outright kill them. Troops can carry more ammunition with the .223 due to it's smaller size and lighter weight), while the .308 is going to do more damage (and likely be more lethal at longer ranges).
 Quoting: Larry D. Croc


Thanks, that's really helpful.
Wisdom is revealed as much by the questions one asks as the answers one gives.
Vicious Deplorable dollop
You ain't seen nothing yet!

User ID: 76277675
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02/23/2018 09:24 PM

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Re: The Gun Thread
Case in point for gun safety.

Was just over at my wife's grandparents' house. Turns out he has a 10/22, so I fired a few shots. Nice gun.

Anyway, he was showing off a couple of pistols he has, a 380 and a 9mm.

For some God-only-knows reason, he chambered a round into the 9, ejected it, forgot the loaded clip was still in, and pulled the trigger. Gun goes off right there in his room, me standing beside him, my daughter in the other room.

Thankfully no one was hurt.

Don't do that.

UPDATE: The bullet hit a 1-inch water pipe. The basement is flooding. I'm heading over to help carry up buckets of water.
 Quoting: The Original Mind


Always, Always, Always treat every gun like it's loaded. Even if you have to check it a dozen times. It's lucky Gramps didn't kill someone. Luck doesn't always appear.

If you want to get along with the gunnies here, never refer to the magazine as a "clip".
 Quoting: Pilgrim001


Yeah, that's solid advice.

So what's the difference between a magazine and a clip?
 Quoting: The Original Mind





[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]
Kamala Harris is not a Natural Born Citizen. She's illegally running.

Used by the Founders...
Book I of The Law of Nations, Chapter XIX, § 212 (Joseph Chitty numbering) – “Citizens and natives”
reads: 'The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to
its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in
the country, of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by
the children of the citizens
, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all
their rights.' 1758 Emerich de Vattel

Oh' What the Hell, do I look like I want to die in some nursing home one day...
America must have 4 new Constitutional Amendments...
1. Drug Tests and Mental Evaluations on all politicians and judges randomly five times per year.
2. Term Limits for Federal politicians and judges.
3. Mental and health standards for Supreme Court Justices and retirement age set.
4. A 'Star Chamber' of elected Natural Born Citizens (no attorney's) to ivestigate, try, and prosecute the politicians and government employee's as they see fit.

Mandatory death penalty by public hanging is the merciful sentence for pedos and their associates.

Democrats are a WMD, literally.

Let Justice Be Done Though The Heavens Fall.
Anonymous Coward
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02/23/2018 09:24 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
You take the cartridges from a clip and then load them into your magazine. Military ammo comes on a clip when you're loading your M16 mags
never96

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02/23/2018 09:35 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
bumpbumpbump
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02/23/2018 09:38 PM
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Re: The Gun Thread
.308 is the same sniper rifle the FBI and ATF uses
 Quoting: jake


I would not recommend a 308 as a starter rifle. How about a Ruger 22 to start with and get the hang of shooting and aiming.
 Quoting: Southern Man 1685967


This. A Ruger 10-22. If you like, there are 25 and 30 rd mags available to fit it. One of the most popular guns made and lots of aftermarket stuff to fit. It's a great gun and will serve you well. Remember that Placement means a LOT in self-defense. A well placed 22 in the aggressors eye will fuck up his day.
 Quoting: Pilgrim001


yeah well some goon kicks your door in and comes at you in the middle of the night waking you from a sound sleep and i am here to tell you that you will not have that kind of shot placement i guarantee it will be all you can do to hit center mass and a 22 is just going to piss the attacker off





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