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SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)

 
AstroshillModerator
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09/27/2019 05:01 PM

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SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
[link to twitter.com (secure)]
The monstrosity that is the Starship MK1 prototype is coming together. The top half has just been craned down onto the lower half. A month ago an earlier prototype known as Starhopper (aka the flying water tower) successfully completed a 150 meter vertical take off and vertical landing using SpaceX's new methane-powered full-flow staged combustion Raptor engines.


These engines are more efficient than the Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy's Merlin engines, and because these run on methane, the fuel for these engines can be farmed on Mars using the Sabatier reaction to convert atmospheric CO2 and hydrogen into methane and water.

Starship is the second stage of SpaceX's next rocket, the BFR. Both the first stage (known as Falcon Super Heavy) as well as the second stage will use their new Raptor engines to lift as much as 220,000 lbs to orbit. Whereas only the first stage of the Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy are reusable, the entire BFR rocket will be reusable once it is fully operational. Additionally, the second stage "Starship" will be designed for in-orbit refueling by unmanned tanker versions of the Starship put into orbit by successive BFR launches, meaning it can deliver the full 220,000 pound payload to trajectories that take it to the moon or Mars after first refueling in earth orbit.

Starship has undergone some major design changes since it was first announced, and more will likely be made before it's finished. SpaceX does their development by building and testing their designs in multiple iterations. The current and final version of the Falcon 9 rocket is a huge upgrade from the first version of the Falcon 9, and it took them many tries and years of development before it was capable of successfully landing to be reused. In the end it paid off, becoming the most commercially successful rocket in use today. Starship and Falcon Super Heavy are designed to surpass it in every way, both in terms of payload capacity and price to launch per pound of payload.

ULA, a joint venture between Boeing and Lockheed, are phasing out their Atlas and Delta rockets to replace it with a partially reusable rocket known as Vulcan. The first stage engines of that rocket are being built by Blue Origin which itself is designing a reusable heavy lift rocket known as New Glenn, designed to be a "Falcon 9 killer" of sorts. Reusable rockets are coming of age.
This, I believe, is a large part of the reason for SpaceX's urgency to make their own top-selling rocket obsolete. BFR would be able to haul more to orbit than New Glenn or Vulcan, and would be the world's only fully reusable rocket. It would likely keep SpaceX on top of the commercial launch market and make them a force to be reckoned with in government and military launches if they can also incorporate vertical payload integration.

Tomorrow evening Elon Musk will give a presentation at Boca Chica updating the current status of Starship's development. The prototype in his above tweet is at that site, and a second prototype is also being built in Cocoa, Florida ( [link to www.clickorlando.com (secure)] ). These prototypes will conduct progressively higher altitude sub-orbital tests before an orbital test flight will be conducted. I'll post the link to the presentation once it's available.

*Live webcast here:

Time is set for 8pm eastern tonight, 00:00 UT.

Last Edited by Astromut on 09/28/2019 10:01 AM
astrobanner2
Anonymous Coward
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09/27/2019 05:09 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Stop trying to fool us, we know that he is building a 2-dimensional kite to prove that the world isn't flat.

Astroshill Indeed!
Anonymous Coward
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09/27/2019 05:11 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
call me when they come up with a space-time bending ship, glorified bottle rockets are boring
javierruizleon

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09/27/2019 05:22 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
A scene form movie "Event Horizon" where Wormhole is explained


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Neil WeakLegs
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09/27/2019 05:31 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
You are correct to call it a "monstrosity". It's repackaged and slightly improved 1920's Robert Goddard technology.
Anonymous Coward
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09/27/2019 05:39 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Very cool retro look that rocket has, reminds me of that Tintin moon rocket
SevenThunders

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09/27/2019 05:46 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Very cool, but kind of sad knowing they've had antigravity propulsion since the late 1950s. If Musk's team started using exotic propulsion of that sort, they would put him out of business.
With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible
AstroshillModerator  (OP)
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09/27/2019 05:58 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
You are correct to call it a "monstrosity". It's repackaged and slightly improved 1920's Robert Goddard technology.
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


That's a bit like calling the Concord a repackaged Wright flyer. I'm sorry but you were dead wrong. Other than being a liquid fuel rocket oh, it shares almost nothing in common with the original Goddard prototype. This is cutting-edge technology it stands to be potentially the world's first fully reusable orbital rocket. This could open up the solar system in ways we haven't even fully grasped yet.
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09/27/2019 05:59 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Very cool, but kind of sad knowing they've had antigravity propulsion since the late 1950s. If Musk's team started using exotic propulsion of that sort, they would put him out of business.
 Quoting: SevenThunders


Yeah sorry but I don't believe that. I also very much believe in sticking to the facts and not making wild speculative statements as if they were facts.
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09/27/2019 06:02 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Very cool retro look that rocket has, reminds me of that Tintin moon rocket
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75329892


In fact, Elon Musk has admitted the influence of tintin on the design. I suppose that's one of the benefits of being the guy who designed it. If you ever go to the Rocket Garden at the Kennedy Space Center Visitor Center you can generally tell which Rockets were designed by Wernher von Braun because he had this philosophy that it was not a real rocket unless it had fins. I think he would approve of this design as well.
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09/27/2019 06:06 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
call me when they come up with a space-time bending ship, glorified bottle rockets are boring
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77962075


^ This. ^

Or one that can get past the firmament.
Anonimous Coward

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09/27/2019 06:06 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
is the tesla on mars yet ?
Anonymous Coward
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09/27/2019 06:09 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
The Earth is flat and nothing goes to space.

Neil WeakLegs
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09/27/2019 06:12 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Very cool, but kind of sad knowing they've had antigravity propulsion since the late 1950s. If Musk's team started using exotic propulsion of that sort, they would put him out of business.
 Quoting: SevenThunders


You will notice that it is not within the interest of the petroleum-based monopolies to promote the use of such technologies.

You will also notice that agencies like NASA soak up the smartest engineers and scientists, then give them "busy work" so that they spend their entire career designing a better fuel pump, a reusable rocket, etc.

In that way, they think that they are accomplishing something great as they make a minor improvement, such as slightly better nozzle on an engine.

Meanwhile, the Military Industrial Complex can work on the real technology under cover, as the people who would normally be questioning them are occupied with the "busy work".

What did Neil Armstrong mean when he said "There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of the truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."
AstroshillModerator  (OP)
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09/27/2019 06:15 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
The Earth is flat and nothing goes to space.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78038460


Wrong.

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09/27/2019 06:16 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
What did Neil Armstrong mean when he said "There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of the truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


When you discover something in science you are removing one of truth's protective layers.
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NervousAndJerky

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09/27/2019 06:20 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
After the first return landing I said here that Tintin would be proud. I didn't know he was influence by him.
I find it interesting that the work yard where SpacexX is building the proof of concept for there Starship looks like a run of the mill... work yard. Like a oil rig site or a regular construction site. I would think when they get down to building the actual ship or ships, it will take on a clean room approach. Just thinking out loud, carryon.

Last Edited by NervousAndJerky on 09/27/2019 06:21 PM
Perspective is everything.

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Neil WeakLegs
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09/27/2019 06:39 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
What did Neil Armstrong mean when he said "There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of the truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


When you discover something in science you are removing one of truth's protective layers.
 Quoting: Astroshill


Fair enough, but then he says "There are many places to go beyond belief." How does he know that these places exist and that they are beyond the belief of the audience?
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09/27/2019 06:45 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Wow
AstroshillModerator  (OP)
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09/27/2019 06:46 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
What did Neil Armstrong mean when he said "There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of the truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


When you discover something in science you are removing one of truth's protective layers.
 Quoting: Astroshill


Fair enough, but then he says "There are many places to go beyond belief." How does he know that these places exist and that they are beyond the belief of the audience?
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


It's one thing to believe something, it's another to investigate it and find the truth.
astrobanner2
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09/27/2019 06:47 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
A scene form movie "Event Horizon" where Wormhole is explained


[link to youtu.be (secure)]
 Quoting: javierruizleon


Cool
Anonymous Coward
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09/27/2019 07:03 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Hmmm... Now how come Apollo landing/taking off on the Moon didn't look anything like that?

(and yes, I know there is practically no atmosphere, and lower gravity, and lower thrust involved)
Neil WeakLegs
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09/27/2019 07:05 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
What did Neil Armstrong mean when he said "There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of the truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


When you discover something in science you are removing one of truth's protective layers.
 Quoting: Astroshill


Fair enough, but then he says "There are many places to go beyond belief." How does he know that these places exist and that they are beyond the belief of the audience?
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


It's one thing to believe something, it's another to investigate it and find the truth.
 Quoting: Astroshill


(Note: The quote I provided above contains an extra word. It should be "one of truth's" without the word "the" before truth.)

He was not talking about general investigation. Armstrong was very specific.

"There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."

He was saying that there are (not might be) many places to go and the breakthrough is available to those who can remove one (that is one specific) protective layer.

He was saying there is one specific layer or obstacle in the way of the truth, but if that one obstacle is removed, then there will be many places to go. This obstacle presently stands in the way of going to these places, and these places are not insignificant, but are "beyond belief" to someone who is hindered by one specific obstacle.
Robo
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09/27/2019 07:23 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Thankyou astro,got a time for the cocoa elon talk.will you stream it?
i want to watch it live if possible.
I love the retro look,elons got style!
sunwatcher

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09/27/2019 07:46 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
I wonder why nasa & iss does not use algae to make O2 instead of eletrolisis... [link to www.ecologicstudio.com]
I'm becoming an expert in identifying bikes'n'boats thanks to GLP
~BigBlock~

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09/27/2019 08:30 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
The Earth is flat and nothing goes to space.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78038460


Your EKG is flat ....pity.
Man is forever solving the most perplexing problems as he ventures ever further into the unknown. But where are the outer limits of his ingenuity? Will he ever encounter a problem, a Gordian Knot, which he cannot ultimately cut?

--GLPPower--
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09/27/2019 08:32 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Thankyou astro,got a time for the cocoa elon talk.will you stream it?
i want to watch it live if possible.
I love the retro look,elons got style!
 Quoting: Robo 1350463


The talk is being held at Boca Chica, I don't know an exact time but I've heard 6~7 pm central time being tossed around.
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09/27/2019 08:34 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
...


When you discover something in science you are removing one of truth's protective layers.
 Quoting: Astroshill


Fair enough, but then he says "There are many places to go beyond belief." How does he know that these places exist and that they are beyond the belief of the audience?
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510


It's one thing to believe something, it's another to investigate it and find the truth.
 Quoting: Astroshill


(Note: The quote I provided above contains an extra word. It should be "one of truth's" without the word "the" before truth.)

He was not talking about general investigation. Armstrong was very specific.

"There are great ideas undiscovered, breakthroughs available to those who can remove one of truth's protective layers. There are many places to go beyond belief."

He was saying that there are (not might be) many places to go and the breakthrough is available to those who can remove one (that is one specific) protective layer.
 Quoting: Neil WeakLegs 77675510

That's not how I read it. I read it as a message to school kids (which it was) about how you can make breakthrough discoveries if you remove one of truth's protective layers, in other words, find hidden truth that wasn't known before. That's what science does.
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~BigBlock~

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09/27/2019 08:36 PM
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Am I mistaken or does that engine use thrust vectoring?
Man is forever solving the most perplexing problems as he ventures ever further into the unknown. But where are the outer limits of his ingenuity? Will he ever encounter a problem, a Gordian Knot, which he cannot ultimately cut?

--GLPPower--
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09/27/2019 08:37 PM

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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Hmmm... Now how come Apollo landing/taking off on the Moon didn't look anything like that?

(and yes, I know there is practically no atmosphere, and lower gravity, and lower thrust involved)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 47752129

No atmosphere, lower gravity, lower thrust. Also it burned Aerozine 50 which burns clear in a vacuum. The Delta II upper stage used the same fuel, and also burned clear:
[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]
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Re: SpaceX's Next Rocket is Coming Together (Literally)
Am I mistaken or does that engine use thrust vectoring?
 Quoting: ~BigBlock~


Yes, it does.
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