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Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed

 
OP know something's big c
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08/11/2007 10:37 PM
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Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
It's just like the days before the 9/11 attacks: al Qaeda camps suddenly gone "quiet" and "empty" in Afghanistan.

[link to billroggio.com]

Pakistan: Concern over nukes as al Qaeda camps empty

Red agencies/ districts controlled by the Taliban; purple is defacto control; yellow is under threat.

US intelligence investigates Pakistan's nuclear security and the military’s loyalty to Musharraf as the Northwest Frontier Province spins further out of control

As the security situation in the Northwest Frontier Province continues to deteriorate and President Pervez Musharraf's political stock continues to drop, the US military intelligence community is "urgently assessing how secure Pakistan's nuclear weapons would be in the event President Gen. Pervez Musharraf were replaced." Meanwhile, the Taliban and al Qaeda have dispersed operatives from the training camps in the Northwest Frontier Province and are preparing to fight on their own terms.

With the Pakistani government facing a robust Taliban insurgency in the Northwest Frontier Province, a significant al Qaeda presence inside the country and a violent cadre of homegrown Islamist extremists, the security of Pakistan’s nuclear arsenal has taken on an elevated importance. The US intelligence community believes it has a handle on the location of Pakistan’s nuclear warhead, but there are questions over who controls the launch codes in the event of Musharraf’s passing.

The US is also looking past the issue of the security of Pakistan's nuclear arsenal. The loyalty of the conventional Pakistani military to President Musharraf is in question, according to CNN. "Musharraf controls the loyalty of the commanders and senior officials in charge of the nuclear program, but those loyalties could shift at any point," CNN reported on August 10. "There is also a growing understanding according to the U.S. analysis that Musharraf's control over the military remains limited to certain top commanders and units, raising worries about whether he can maintain control over the long term."

On the same day of the release of news on concerns over the security of Pakistan's nuclear arsenal and the loyalty of the Pakistani military, the Asia Times' Syed Saleem Shahzad reported al Qaeda and Taliban camps in North and South Waziristan have emptied, the Taliban and al Qaeda are expanding into the settled districts of the Northwest Frontier Province, and are reorganizing in both Afghanistan and Pakistan for a major fight.

The Fourth Rail interviewed a senior US military intelligence official and a US military officer, both of whom are familiar with the situation in the Northwest Frontier Province and wish to remain anonymous. The sources confirmed Mr. Shahzad's information concerning the al Qaeda and Taliban camps in North Waziristan and the Taliban’s reorganization is accurate. Both sources are particularly concerned about the implications of the emptying of the camps.

Mr. Shahzad reported there were 29 al Qaeda and Taliban camps in North and South Waziristan, and all but one "have been dismantled, apart from one run by hardline Islamist Mullah Abdul Khaliq." [Note: on October 4, 2006, The Fourth Rail reported "there are over 20 al Qaeda and Taliban run training camps currently in operation in North and South Waziristan."] While The Fourth Rail sources verify the camps' existence, they noted the camps have not been dismantled and the infrastructure is still in place. "The physical infrastructure (camps and the like) still exist, they haven't been dismantled. They've just been abandoned or are being operated by skeleton crews," the senior military intelligence source said, while noting "the Khaliq camp is only churning out Taliban, not al Qaeda."

The al Qaeda and Taliban personnel abandoned the 28 camps after "the US had presented Islamabad with a dossier detailing the location of the bases as advance information on likely US targets," Mr. Shahzad reported. "All other leading Taliban commanders, including Sirajuddin Haqqani, Gul Bahadur, Baitullah Mehsud and Haji Omar, have disappeared,” said Mr. Shahzad.

"Similarly, the top echelons of the Arab community that was holed up in North Waziristan has also gone," reported Mr. Shahzad. Pakistan's military and intelligence agencies are believed to have leaked information to the Taliban and al Qaeda in the past, and appears to have done so again.

The emptying of the camps is a cause for great concern in the military and intelligence communities. "We don't know where they went to or who was in the camps," the military officer told The Fourth Rail. "They are well trained, these aren't your entry level jihadis. They are dangerous."

"This is one of the reasons that we are worried about a major CONUS [Continental United States] attack," the senior military intelligence source told The Fourth Rail, noting the recent influx of news of terror cells attempting to penetrate the US. "If they evacuated their bases, they almost certainly did so out of fear of more than just the Pakistani army."

More at [link to billroggio.com]

dynamite hiding
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 10:38 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
damned
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
Sudel_Tek

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08/11/2007 10:38 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
This is huge, and needs a pin. Very good find.

How credible is this website however?

8/11 - Nothing occurred, just fear.

Numerology experts: Whats the most likely date!?
The blackening of roses will send you to the edges of the land/
The emerald tablets of Thoth the Atlantean/
The hands of the mighty Lion of Judah/
Will throw you through the triangular portals of Bermuda/
Exploring the Hologramic aspects of consciousness/
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 10:43 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
Based solely on logistical considerations, it would place an expected counter attack on by 8/17.
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 10:45 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
"It's just like the days before the 9/11 attacks: al Qaeda camps suddenly gone "quiet" and "empty" in Afghanistan."

— this did not happen.
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 10:48 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
"It's just like the days before the 9/11 attacks: al Qaeda camps suddenly gone "quiet" and "empty" in Afghanistan."

— this did not happen.
 Quoting: Push/Pull 280145



Yes, it did. AQ left many known locations about 2 weeks before the attack.
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
jules
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08/11/2007 10:52 PM
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no, by 8/23 at the latest
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 10:53 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

U.S. President George W. Bush responded by saying: "We know he's guilty. Turn him over", and British Prime Minister Tony Blair warned the Taliban regime: "Surrender bin Laden, or surrender power".

Soon thereafter the United States and its allies invaded Afghanistan, and together with the Afghan Northern Alliance removed the Taliban government in the war in Afghanistan.

U.S. troops in Afghanistan

As a result of the United States using its special forces and providing air support for the Northern Alliance ground forces, both Taliban and al-Qaeda training camps were destroyed, and much of the operating structure of al-Qaeda is believed to have been disrupted. After being driven from their key positions in the Tora Bora area of Afghanistan, many al-Qaeda fighters tried to regroup in the rugged Gardez region of the nation.

Again, under the cover of intense aerial bombardment, U.S. infantry and local Afghan forces attacked, shattering the al-Qaeda position and killing or capturing many of the militants. By early 2002, al-Qaeda had been dealt a serious blow to its operational capacity, and the Afghan invasion appeared an initial success.

Nevertheless, a significant Taliban insurgency remains in Afghanistan, and al-Qaeda's top two leaders, bin Laden and al-Zawahiri, evaded capture.
jules
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08/11/2007 10:53 PM
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they will attack us by then
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 10:54 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
The Taliban remained, but AQ dispersed in 2001.
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:01 PM
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Big sale at Target stores. jihad2

jihad
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 11:03 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
Oh where, oh where have Taliban gone?
28 of 29 militant bases ID'd by U.S. intelligence 'dismantled' after information given to Pakistan

Posted: August 11, 2007
7:00 p.m. Eastern


© 2007 WorldNetDaily.com


Information regarding the location of 29 Taliban bases, ID'd by U.S. intelligence and shared with Pakistan, has lost its targeting value for Islamabad's promised offensive against the militant group with the apparent evacuation of 28 of the training camps along the country's northern border with Afghanistan.

The U.S. presented Pakistan with a dossier meticulously detailing the bases' locations in the tribal areas of North Waziristan and South Waziristan, but, according to a report by Asia Times, the camps 'have simply fallen off the radar.' Neither the North Atlantic Treaty Organization-led coalition in Afghanistan nor Pakistan intelligence have detected any movement in the camps since early this month.

On-the-ground intelligence from both sides of the national border indicate all camps but one, operated by a hardline Islamist mullah, have been dismantled and all Taliban commanders, as well as leaders of Arab insurgent groups in the country, have disappeared.

more
[link to www.wnd.com]
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 11:04 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
Oh where, oh where have Taliban gone?
28 of 29 militant bases ID'd by U.S. intelligence 'dismantled' after information given to Pakistan

Posted: August 11, 2007
7:00 p.m. Eastern


© 2007 WorldNetDaily.com


Information regarding the location of 29 Taliban bases, ID'd by U.S. intelligence and shared with Pakistan, has lost its targeting value for Islamabad's promised offensive against the militant group with the apparent evacuation of 28 of the training camps along the country's northern border with Afghanistan.

The U.S. presented Pakistan with a dossier meticulously detailing the bases' locations in the tribal areas of North Waziristan and South Waziristan, but, according to a report by Asia Times, the camps 'have simply fallen off the radar.' Neither the North Atlantic Treaty Organization-led coalition in Afghanistan nor Pakistan intelligence have detected any movement in the camps since early this month.

On-the-ground intelligence from both sides of the national border indicate all camps but one, operated by a hardline Islamist mullah, have been dismantled and all Taliban commanders, as well as leaders of Arab insurgent groups in the country, have disappeared.

more
[link to www.wnd.com]
 Quoting: Push/Pull 280145



It is possibly this simple. I fear it is not.
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:05 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
THERE IS TALIBAN AND AL-QAEDA TRAINING CAMPS EXISTING NOW AND THE SATELLITES CAN SEE THEM, THE BOMBERS CAN FLY OVER THEM AND THEY ARE NOT YET BOMBED OUT OF EXISTENCE?

I THINK NOT.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/11/2007 11:06 PM
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"It's just like the days before the 9/11 attacks: al Qaeda camps suddenly gone "quiet" and "empty" in Afghanistan."

— this did not happen.
 Quoting: Push/Pull 280145


Yes, it did happened, dude! It has been reported so many times after the 9/11 attacks in the news but intelligence agencies picked up reported disappearance of top Al Qaeda leaders from the camps in Afghanistan prior to the assassination of Mossaud (sp?)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/11/2007 11:06 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
damned
 Quoting: D. Bunker ™


I'm assuming you pinned this. Thanks for the pin.
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 11:08 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
[link to www.dailytimes.com.pk]

Gunships pound militant hideouts

MIRANSHAH: Helicopter gunships pounded militant hideouts in northern Pakistan as the military scoured mountains on Friday for 16 missing soldiers believed kidnapped by Taliban rebels.

The army said at least 10 Al Qaeda and Taliban fighters were killed in the air attack on Thursday. The operation also involved ground forces in North Waziristan region.

“The miscreants killed in Thursday’s strike were local militants allied to Taliban and Al Qaeda,” a security official told AFP. ISPR Director General Major General Waheed Arshad said security forces were focused on squeezing out the militants, who include local and foreign fighters. “There is no planned operation going on in North Waziristan but we are responding with greater force against militant attacks on security forces now,” he said.

“In previous months there were several attempts made by miscreants against security forces and we would show patience but it is not the case now.”

Arshad said the military was hunting for 16 paramilitary soldiers who went missing on Thursday morning in South Waziristan.

Arshad said the stepped-up action in the border areas was not in reaction to pressure from Washington. “We know Al Qaeda is present in the region, there are Taliban elements and their local supporters and we are acting against them in our own national interest.”

In a separate incident on Friday, gunship helicopters bombed a suspected militant hideout at Boya, west of Miranshah, but there were no immediate reports of casualties, a local security official said. Suspected militants also exchanged gunfire with security forces on Friday in Miranshah after militants attacked a security check post, the officials said, with no immediate reports of casualties. afp
D. Bunker ™

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08/11/2007 11:09 PM
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I'm assuming you pinned this. Thanks for the pin.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 275968


You are welcome and this is very important.
:savetata:


Favorite Quote - "I just fucking love outer space, it has all those planets and stars and shit." - Mister Obvious 2009
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:11 PM
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sep 17th 2007
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 11:12 PM
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Aug 11, 2007

Taliban a step ahead of US assault
By Syed Saleem Shahzad

KARACHI - The ongoing three-day peace jirga (council) involving hundreds of tribal leaders from Pakistan and Afghanistan is aimed at identifying and rooting out Taliban and al-Qaeda militancy on both sides of the border.

This was to be followed up with military strikes at militant bases in Pakistan, either by the Pakistani armed forces in conjunction with the United States, or even by US forces alone.
_________________________________________________________>
The trouble is, the bases the US had meticulously identified no longer exist.
__________________________________________________________>
The naive, rustic but battle-hardened Taliban still want a fight, but it will be fought on the Taliban's chosen battlegrounds.

Twenty-nine bases in the tribal areas of North Waziristan and South Waziristan on the border with Afghanistan that were used to train militants have simply fallen off the radar.

The US had presented Islamabad with a dossier detailing the location of the bases as advance information on likely US targets. But Asia Times Online has learned that since early this month, neither the North Atlantic Treaty Organization-led coalition in Afghanistan nor Pakistan intelligence has detected any movement in the camps.

Human intelligence on both sides suggests the bases have been dismantled, apart from one run by hardline Islamist Mullah Abdul Khaliq. All other leading Taliban commanders, including Sirajuddin Haqqani, Gul Bahadur, Baitullah Mehsud and Haji Omar, have disappeared. Similarly, the top echelons of the Arab community that was holed up in North Waziristan has also gone.

more where "the new battlefield" is
[link to www.atimes.com]
ferrisWheel
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08/11/2007 11:13 PM
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from brother thomas' blog at jtol

–April 9, 2007– “For the past few days, “Pakistan” has come into to my mind, as if something unexpected/big were about to happen there . . . . It seems to be something related to war . . . and may be a trigger for other things that aren’t currently really on the radar . … .” April 9, 2007

–April 29th 2007– “For about the past week again Pakistan has been coming into my mind as a very possible trigger point for a snowballing effect in the middle east–problems there coming out of left field . . . a new unexpected hot spot destabilizing the region–pushing it over the breaking point . . . . perhaps then Afghanistan goes into fullscale uproar and then there is an alliance between Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran, and Syria-all coming together with contiguous borders (if Iraq also falls to that group).

This is just speculation re how it might go; though the clear ominous sense re trouble brewing in Pakistan–right before it actually did–came from premonition and continues to. Just something to note and watch . . . .”

–June 22, 2007– “MUCH chicanery which will commence will be, obviously unreported–worse than now, which is pretty bad (for instance, since my heads-up a couple weeks ago about Pakistan, do you know that it is very unstable, much rioting with the Musharif regime close to being ousted and replaced by hard-line Islamists? all the worry about a nuclear Iran may suddenly be moot if already nuclear Pakistan “falls” and a militant Islamic coup ensues . . . . But this trouble is not being reported at all. I was alerted to it first in the spirit, and since then I’ve talked to a very nice Christian Pakistani who runs a gas station I frequent . . . and is confirming my thoughts on this . . . ”

--July 18, 2007- "Also, Pakistan, as I got the warning is indeed heating up . . . and will continue to be extremely volatile along the Afgan/Paki border. An octopus operation is set up there now as well."
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:16 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
There is no AlQaeda or camps just neocon propaganda promoting wars and death

Ralph Epperson:
RUSSIA HAS WOODEN MISSILES!

[link to video.google.com]
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:18 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
Booga booga... You mean the phony camps that the CIA set up and filmed to put on American TV to make people scared and drum up support for b0mbing the sh*t out of certain countries to secure oil fields are empty!!!!??? Say it ain't so! Oh, I'm so scared!

Dummies.
Isaac Brock died for us

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08/11/2007 11:19 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

After being driven from their key positions in the Tora Bora area of Afghanistan, many al-Qaeda fighters tried to regroup in the rugged Gardez region of the nation.


 Quoting: Push/Pull 280145

Bullshit.

Tora Bora was controlled by Abdul Haq's mujahiddeen prior to 9/11.
Abdul Haq was strongly pro-American having received their backing in the Russian war. He drove a Harley, listened to western music and was a frequent visitor to New York city.

Haq was scheduled to give a lecture to the Council on Foreign Relations in New York city on the strategic situation in Afghanistan in October 2001. It had already been widely advertised on the Internet on specialised newsites such as Strategic Forces review (Stratfor.com) that a Northern Alliance offensive to oust the Taliban was about to begin with Russian logistical support and possibly American airstrikes.

What had not been advertised was that Haq's Pushtun militia was going to launch an offensive in the south.

9/11 spoiled the plan.
The Americans invaded which immediately turned the Pushtuns in Tora Bora into the opposing camp. Afghans don't like invaders.
Abdul Haq returned to Tora Bora with suitcases of money and was immediately killed by his own people.

Tora Bora was never an Al Qaeda or Taliban stronghold till after the Americans invaded.

The underground bunker complexes in Tora Bora never existed. They were just a media story to justify testing new bunker busting bombs.
owner of an extensive collection of curios from the exotic orient
Anonymous Coward
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08/11/2007 11:21 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
We know the next 911 is coming! Too many signs and warnings!

Going to be much worse this time people...

ahhh
LookForMe
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08/11/2007 11:33 PM
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uhhhhmm..... if they are monitoring the camps, and know where they are, wouldn't they bomb them out of existence?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LookForMe
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08/11/2007 11:34 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
THERE IS TALIBAN AND AL-QAEDA TRAINING CAMPS EXISTING NOW AND THE SATELLITES CAN SEE THEM, THE BOMBERS CAN FLY OVER THEM AND THEY ARE NOT YET BOMBED OUT OF EXISTENCE?

I THINK NOT.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 237207

Ya, what he said......
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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08/11/2007 11:38 PM
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uhhhhmm..... if they are monitoring the camps, and know where they are, wouldn't they bomb them out of existence?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 Quoting: LookForMe 279820


You know we cannot bomb Pakistan without permission from Musharraf.

D'oh.
D. Bunker ™
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08/11/2007 11:38 PM
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Re: Al Qaeda & Taliban Camps Suddenly Empty; Military/Intelligence Services Disturbed
Most if not all these encampments are within the borders of Pakistan. Pakistan has chosen to not allow US overflight to attack these locations in the North. Pakistani attempts to assault them with ground troops has proven ineffective in the past.

The encampments are dispersing either due to preparation of the coming offensive by Pakistan or due to an expected retaliation as in 2001.

Time will tell.
Ruffy
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08/11/2007 11:39 PM
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Who really took down the trade centers on 9/11 is the question, making this post not credible.
Push/Pull
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08/11/2007 11:39 PM
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The trouble is, the bases the US had meticulously identified no longer exist.

Twenty-nine bases in the tribal areas of North Waziristan and South Waziristan on the border with Afghanistan that were used to train militants have simply fallen off the radar.

The US had presented Islamabad with a dossier detailing the location of the bases as advance information on likely US targets.

But Asia Times Online has learned that since early this month, neither the North Atlantic Treaty Organization-led coalition in Afghanistan nor Pakistan intelligence has detected any movement in the camps.

Human intelligence on both sides suggests the bases have been dismantled, apart from one run by hardline Islamist Mullah Abdul Khaliq. All other leading Taliban commanders, including Sirajuddin Haqqani, Gul Bahadur, Baitullah Mehsud and Haji Omar, have disappeared. Similarly, the top echelons of the Arab community that was holed up in North Waziristan has also gone.

.
KNOWN, KNOWNS (for a while)





GLP