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Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved

 
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 08:51 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
And......... what are all these links suppose to mean? What doctrine are you trying to promote? Where are you going with all these links? What am I suppose to find out?.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Thread: Bible Study - The Kingdom of God / The Kingdom of Heaven
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


And when did I request a Bible study or even a thread about Bible study? I study my Bible with my BIBLE in front; not a thread. I don't study crap on the internet. I already know every necessary about the rapture. Got it from the Bible and the Holy Ghost.
 Quoting: B4Birth


99% of the verses I post are from the KJV.

Where does the Bible say that Father God's mansions are planets?

You THINK you have the Holy Spirit?

Lot's of folks CLAIM to have the Holy Spirit.

Benny Hinn - Kenneth Copeland and others. Do they REALLY?

Many folks claim to have the Holy Spirit but more than likely don't.

Proof of this is simple.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who pray to "the trinity". It's not Biblical. Jesus said to pray to the Father.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus is Father God Himself. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus IS the Holy Spirit. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Father God is a "demiurge". It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus will return on a space ship. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who speak in "tongues", but yet no one knows what they are saying, which Paul warned about.

See what I mean?
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 08:54 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
You act like an antichrist. Because you attack Christ and His children. That is what an antichrist is and there are many of them.

You attack a person for presenting scripture. You call it UTTER NONSENSE, state the scripture PROVES them WRONG and then PRESENT NO SCRIPTURE!

A YOUTUBE VIDEO IS NOT THE BIBLE!

You do not present a Christian spirit; you present an antichrist spirit.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Who's a real antichrist - that he teaches false doctrines as truth.

You teach a pre-trib rapture that IS NOT supported by scripture.

You teach that the mansions in heaven are planets.

NOT Biblical.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 08:55 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
There certainly are but there still is no scriptural proof that we are taken to another planet.
 Quoting: Achduke7


What is the name of the place they were taken to?
Also is there any scriptural proof that we are NOT taken to another planet?
 Quoting: B4Birth


There still is no scriptural proof that we are taken to another planet.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


Again I will present scripture:

Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

You are either an ANTICHRIST or you have a serious reading comprehension problem. The scripture is plain. Sadly most Christians overlook it and it is NOT traditionally taught. I challenge every person to use reading comprehension skills.
 Quoting: B4Birth

WHERE does those verses say "PLANETS"?????

IDIOT demon.

yoda sockpuppet bonghit beavis crazyjak blahblah5
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 08:59 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.

Know therefore and understand,
That from the going forth of the command
To restore and build Jerusalem
Until Messiah the Prince,
There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks;
The street shall be built again, and the wall,
Even in troublesome times.

And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;
And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.

Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate.


Daniel 9:24-27
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 79034390


THOSE verses describe the time between the EXILE to Babylon UNTIL Jesus birth and appearance on earth.

Proof?

The Messiah WILL NOT be CUT OFF in the End Times.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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06/15/2020 08:59 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
You thunk you use God to beat others to approve you.
B4Birth

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06/15/2020 09:47 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
And......... what are all these links suppose to mean? What doctrine are you trying to promote? Where are you going with all these links? What am I suppose to find out?.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Thread: Bible Study - The Kingdom of God / The Kingdom of Heaven
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


And when did I request a Bible study or even a thread about Bible study? I study my Bible with my BIBLE in front; not a thread. I don't study crap on the internet. I already know every necessary about the rapture. Got it from the Bible and the Holy Ghost.
 Quoting: B4Birth


99% of the verses I post are from the KJV.

Where does the Bible say that Father God's mansions are planets?

You THINK you have the Holy Spirit?

Lot's of folks CLAIM to have the Holy Spirit.

Benny Hinn - Kenneth Copeland and others. Do they REALLY?

Many folks claim to have the Holy Spirit but more than likely don't.

Proof of this is simple.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who pray to "the trinity". It's not Biblical. Jesus said to pray to the Father.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus is Father God Himself. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus IS the Holy Spirit. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Father God is a "demiurge". It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus will return on a space ship. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who speak in "tongues", but yet no one knows what they are saying, which Paul warned about.

See what I mean?
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


As I said you are an ANTICHRIST. Tearing down Christians and I believe you are antichrist on purpose. And as far as who has the HOLY GHOST read this:

Act_2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Act_4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.

ALL true Christians are filled with the Holy Ghost even if they never speak with other tongues. Why are you not?
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 09:53 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
As I said you are an ANTICHRIST. Tearing down Christians and I believe you are antichrist on purpose. And as far as who has the HOLY GHOST read this:

Act_2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Act_4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.

ALL true Christians are filled with the Holy Ghost even if they never speak with other tongues. Why are you not?
 Quoting: B4Birth


"Tearing down Christians"?

NOPE. Destroying your FALSE doctrines.

The Apostles and disciples in the upper room on Pentecost were a SPECIAL gift given by the Father.

Christians these days do NOT get the same thing.

You certainly didn't.

Paul tells us that each person's "gifts" are different.

He also said TEST the SPIRITS.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who pray to "the trinity". It's not Biblical. Jesus said to pray to the Father.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus is Father God Himself. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus IS the Holy Spirit. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Father God is a "demiurge". It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say Jesus will return on a space ship. It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who speak in "tongues", but yet no one knows what they are saying, which Paul warned about.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say the mansions in Father God's house are "planets". It's not Biblical.

There are folks who claim to have the Holy Spirit who say that there is a "Pre-Tribulaion Rapture". It's not Biblical.


Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 06/15/2020 10:06 PM
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
B4Birth

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06/15/2020 11:29 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
You act like an antichrist. Because you attack Christ and His children. That is what an antichrist is and there are many of them.

You attack a person for presenting scripture. You call it UTTER NONSENSE, state the scripture PROVES them WRONG and then PRESENT NO SCRIPTURE!

A YOUTUBE VIDEO IS NOT THE BIBLE!

You do not present a Christian spirit; you present an antichrist spirit.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Who's a real antichrist - that he teaches false doctrines as truth.

You teach a pre-trib rapture that IS NOT supported by scripture.

You teach that the mansions in heaven are planets.

NOT Biblical.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


Every time I give you Information I give you a scripture reference (which you don't do). Please show me the scripture references that refute the two things you have mentioned that I have said? Remember it must REFUTE what I have said. I DARE you to do it! AND to help you I will not say another thing to you until you have posted those verses that refute me.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/15/2020 11:54 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
Every time I give you Information I give you a scripture reference (which you don't do). Please show me the scripture references that refute the two things you have mentioned that I have said? Remember it must REFUTE what I have said. I DARE you to do it! AND to help you I will not say another thing to you until you have posted those verses that refute me.
 Quoting: B4Birth

You're so-called "scriptural references" have NOTHING to do with the false garbage doctrines you are teaching.

Show me where the Bible says there is a pre-trib rapture.

SHOW me where the Bible says the mansions in the Father's house are "planets".

SHOW ME where the Bible says that New Jerusalem isn't a REAL city, 1500 square miles in size, with 12 gates and a river living water running through it.

You can't. ALL you do is TWIST interpretation to FIT your NON-Biblical doctrines.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
B4Birth

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06/16/2020 01:57 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
You act like an antichrist. Because you attack Christ and His children. That is what an antichrist is and there are many of them.

You attack a person for presenting scripture. You call it UTTER NONSENSE, state the scripture PROVES them WRONG and then PRESENT NO SCRIPTURE!

A YOUTUBE VIDEO IS NOT THE BIBLE!

You do not present a Christian spirit; you present an antichrist spirit.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Who's a real antichrist - that he teaches false doctrines as truth.

You teach a pre-trib rapture that IS NOT supported by scripture.

You teach that the mansions in heaven are planets.

NOT Biblical.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


Every time I give you Information I give you a scripture reference (which you don't do). Please show me the scripture references that refute the two things you have mentioned that I have said? Remember it must REFUTE what I have said. I DARE you to do it! AND to help you I will not say another thing to you until you have posted those verses that refute me.
 Quoting: B4Birth

WAITING FOR VERSES THAT REFUTE!
Anonymous Coward
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06/16/2020 08:41 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
You act like an antichrist. Because you attack Christ and His children. That is what an antichrist is and there are many of them.

You attack a person for presenting scripture. You call it UTTER NONSENSE, state the scripture PROVES them WRONG and then PRESENT NO SCRIPTURE!

A YOUTUBE VIDEO IS NOT THE BIBLE!

You do not present a Christian spirit; you present an antichrist spirit.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Who's a real antichrist - that he teaches false doctrines as truth.

You teach a pre-trib rapture that IS NOT supported by scripture.

You teach that the mansions in heaven are planets.

NOT Biblical.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


Every time I give you Information I give you a scripture reference (which you don't do). Please show me the scripture references that refute the two things you have mentioned that I have said? Remember it must REFUTE what I have said. I DARE you to do it! AND to help you I will not say another thing to you until you have posted those verses that refute me.
 Quoting: B4Birth

WAITING FOR VERSES THAT REFUTE!
 Quoting: B4Birth


Show me where the Bible says there is a pre-trib rapture.

SHOW me where the Bible says the mansions in the Father's house are "planets".

SHOW ME where the Bible says that New Jerusalem isn't a REAL city, 1500 square miles in size, with 12 gates and a river living water running through it.

You can't.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/16/2020 10:30 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
WAITING FOR VERSES THAT REFUTE!
 Quoting: B4Birth


Show me where the Bible says there is a pre-trib rapture.

SHOW me where the Bible says the mansions in the Father's house are "planets".

SHOW ME where the Bible says that New Jerusalem isn't a REAL city, 1500 square miles in size, with 12 gates and a river living water running through it.

You can't.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/17/2020 12:53 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
New Jerusalem is 1500 miles square.

LOT'S of room for MANSIONS.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


Hmm 1500 MILES SQ..... sounds like a nice little planet to me. When this comes down from the heavens I can see it being merged with the New Earth. And is this New Jerusalem you are speaking of located in the heavens? Is it just dangling in the air? Or does it have a firmament around it? Does it have trees and vegetation? Are there animals there? Is it in the heavens or the HEAVEN OF HEAVENS? Is this city just tumbling through space? Because we are going to be taken there to live after the pre-trib rapture.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Bullshit. You have NO scriptural PROOF.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 63319725


Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Now that I have given you the scripture, do you have any scriptural PROOF that what I said is not true?
 Quoting: B4Birth


"1500 miles is a nice little planet"????

The size is equivalent to about 1/2 of the United States. Look it up - it's easy to find.

New Jerusalen descends from heaven TO the new earth - whether it's an entirely new planet or a rejuvenated current earth.

The Tribulation and wrath of the Seven Seals, Seven Trumpets and the Seven Vials ALL happen on earth.

One of the events of Jesus' return is when he stands on the Mount of Olives.

Just because Jesus resurrects the "dead in Christ" - NOWHERE does the Bible state that they are "TAKEN" somewhere else other than earth.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/17/2020 12:56 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
For you folks that don't know, the false teaching that "God's
mansions are actually planets" comes from an obscure Sunday
school teacher in Virginia a couple of decades ago. There is
little information about him other than he had a Phd from the
University of Richmond.

another do 1doh1
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
B4Birth

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06/17/2020 05:34 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
There are many things about the pre-tribulation rapture that are not in the Bible. The Bible is too small of a book to contain ALL information about what Jesus did and EVERYTHING that is going to happen. Notice this verse:

Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

With everything that is NOT said in the Bible, how would you KNOW that something said is not true? It is REAL easy! The Bible does not ever REFUTE itself! You can test what people say just by checking the Bible to see if it refutes the Word. Sometimes it is simply that the word we use today is true but not a word that is even in the Bible. Examples are words like automobile,rocket, computer, cell phone etc. This thread is about the rapture but the word rapture is NOT in the Bible. The word PLANET is also not in the Bible but we know planets exist. True believers are blessed with a gift on the inside that helps them when reading the Bible. You will only need this one gift and you can understand everything in the Bible. This gift is called the HOLY GHOST, HOLY SPIRIT, or SPIRIT OF TRUTH.

Now lets take note of what Jesus said about this special gift that EVERY true believer has:

Joh 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

That's an amazing scripture that many Christians know nothing about. A lot of so called Bible study people will tell you what is not in the Bible without considering these verses. Your only concern should be to make sure what you have learned is truly from the Holy Ghost. You do this by making sure the words do not REFUTE THE BIBLE?

So many will proclaim that something is not in the Bible but are TOO LAZY to see if it refutes the Bible. Your words should never go against the Bible. If you can't find refuting verses then you should pray and ask the Holy Ghost to open your understanding, instead of carrying on continuous DEBATE. You run the risk of speaking against the Holy Ghost or becoming an antichrist.

I have mentioned that in John 14:2-3 that Jesus is talking about PLANETS.

Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.


Now if a person is not understanding this, after searching scripture for a refuting verse and not find one, they should SURRENDER to the Holy Ghost. A mansion is a large place for habitation. A planet is a large place for habitation. Why fight the Holy Ghost?

I recently requested someone to show refuting scripture for my statement which they have YET TO DO and I know that they will NEVER find a refuting verse. You see I get my information through the guidance and leading of the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost cannot lie.

THE WORD PLANET IS NOT IN THE BIBLE BUT NEITHER IS THE WORD RAPTURE.

Last Edited by B4Birth on 06/17/2020 05:37 PM
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/17/2020 10:14 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
There are many things about the pre-tribulation rapture that are not in the Bible.

The Bible is too small of a book to contain ALL information about what Jesus did and EVERYTHING that is going to happen. Notice this verse:

Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.
 Quoting: B4Birth


"NOT in the Bible"??? WHERE are they then?

There IS NOT a pre-trib rapture. Scripture PROVES that to be FALSE.

UTTER NONSENSE

Now lets take note of what Jesus said about this special gift that EVERY true believer has:

Joh 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Jesus was telling the APOSTLES that THEY had MORE to learn.

That's why John, Peter, James and Paul ALL wrote Epistles.

I have mentioned that in John 14:2-3 that Jesus is talking about PLANETS.

Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
 Quoting: B4Birth


NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE. NO He isn't.

And YOU CANNOT PROVE it.

THE WORD PLANET IS NOT IN THE BIBLE BUT NEITHER IS THE WORD RAPTURE.
 Quoting: B4Birth

"Rapture" was invented by John Nelson Darby.

"Worlds" are planets - but NOT mansions.

Hebrews 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 06/17/2020 10:15 PM
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Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/17/2020 10:19 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
With everything that is NOT said in the Bible, how would you KNOW that something said is not true? It is REAL easy! The Bible does not ever REFUTE itself! You can test what people say just by checking the Bible to see if it refutes the Word. Sometimes it is simply that the word we use today is true but not a word that is even in the Bible. Examples are words like automobile,rocket, computer, cell phone etc. This thread is about the rapture but the word rapture is NOT in the Bible. The word PLANET is also not in the Bible but we know planets exist. True believers are blessed with a gift on the inside that helps them when reading the Bible. You will only need this one gift and you can understand everything in the Bible. This gift is called the HOLY GHOST, HOLY SPIRIT, or SPIRIT OF TRUTH.
 Quoting: B4Birth


Satan has been deceiving people for millenia by pretending to be a "spirit" that speaks to you.

How about folks who kill their children because "God told them to"????

Deceiving spirit - NOT God.

Satan does the SAME thing with folks concerning the
"understanding" of the Bible.

another do 1doh1
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/21/2020 04:42 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
I hope the rapture is today.
I'm ready.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 71518620


bridec Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
 Quoting: Judethz


Funny that you should post Luke 21:28 because before that is the tribulation.

Luk 21:12 "But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons, and you will be brought before kings and rulers for My name's sake.

Achduke
Johnny
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06/22/2020 09:19 AM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
My god, when will people see that this event is never going to happen?! just more fear mongering by some Christians which they cannot agree what the bible says, and its like someone had an acid trip when writing revelation. Revelation is a convoluted heap of mess. Sigh!
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/23/2020 12:39 AM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
Scriptural PROOF that there IS NOT A PRE-TRIB rapture.

Jesus said....


Matthew 24

21 For then shall be great tribulation,
such as was not since the beginning of the world
to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened,
there should no flesh be saved:

but for the elect's sake


those days shall be shortened.


This short passage PROVES that Believers - "the elect" - will STILL BE ON EARTH during the Tribulation.

CASE CLOSED.

I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/24/2020 08:59 AM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
NONSENSE.
Jesus "collects" the elect from BOTH earth and heaven when He returns.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 24323689


nordicspear Yeah I know that, I just forgot to add the Elect from heaven, which of course includes the Raptured.
 Quoting: Judethz


Why would he need to collect any pre-trib raptured people if they are already with him in heaven? The reason is there are none. They are not raptured/caught up until he comes to collect them.
Achduke
Johnny
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06/24/2020 09:46 AM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
The Bible is work of fiction. my god, wake the hell up!
Achduke7  (OP)

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
NONSENSE.
Jesus "collects" the elect from BOTH earth and heaven when He returns.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 24323689


nordicspear Yeah I know that, I just forgot to add the Elect from heaven, which of course includes the Raptured.
 Quoting: Judethz


Why would he need to collect any pre-trib raptured people if they are already with him in heaven? The reason is there are none. They are not raptured/caught up until he comes to collect them.
 Quoting: Achduke7


german2 What are you hitting on me for? AC3689 is the one who used the word "collects" and I was replying to him. All you are doing is trying to annoy me with stupid little word games. But then on the other hand if all your best arguments are mud I suppose that that is all that you have left.
 Quoting: Judethz


It is not word games. You are including anyone that may be pretrib raptured and added onto what the AC already wrote. The whole premise of Matthew 24:29 - is that the Son of God comes and collects his elect after the tribulation as in not pretrib. This collection of the elect is the caught up or the rapture.

Matthew 24:29, Mark 13:24 and Luke 21:25 are all the same event that happens after the tribulation and Christ sends his angels to gather the elect.

Luke 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring; 26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. 27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
Achduke
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06/24/2020 10:37 AM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
The Bible is work of fiction. my god, wake the hell up!
 Quoting: Johnny 5763088


scratching
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/24/2020 07:54 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved

John 1-1
IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word himself was with Aloha, and Aloha was the Word himself.
John 1-2
This was in the beginning with Aloha.
John 1-3
Every thing by his hand was made; and without him also was not one thing made that was made.

................................

Yes, He is the Son of God, wholly man and wholly God.

Remember that Isaiah prophesied in 7:14 that his name would be Immanuel meaning "God with us".

Saying all of that we will have to ask once in Heaven. He is the Son of God and He and the Father are one.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward

"God with us" doesn't make Jesus "God".
It means the Father SENT Him DIRECTLY from Himself.

You ignore ALL the evidence.

Jesus CLEARLY said "the Father is God - MY God" in John 20:17.

Jesus' deity and divinity are as "the SON OF God".

-------------------------------------------

Jeremiah 10:10 But the LORD (YHWH) is the true God, he is the living God, and an everlasting king: at his wrath the earth shall tremble, and the nations shall not be able to abide his indignation.

John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 Thessalonians 1:9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

--------------------------------------------

1. Jesus prays to the Father. Does God pray to God?
...Father God doesn't pray to anyone.

2. Jesus gives thanks to the Father.
...The Father doens't give thanks to anyone.

3. Jesus states that He learned from the Father.
...Father God NEVER had to learn.

4. Jesus states that the Father TOLD Him what to say.
...NO ONE tells the Father what to say.

5. Jesus states that the Father is GREATER than He is.
...NO ONE is greater than Father God.

6. Jesus states that "only the Father is good".

7. Jesus states that only the Father knows WHEN Jesus will return.
...The Father's WILL is what is to be done - by HIS time table.

8. Jesus states that He sits at the Father's right hand - "the right hand of power".
...The Father is the source of all power and authority.

9. Jesus states that the Father SENT Him.
...Father God doesn't get "sent" by anyone.

10. Jesus states that He was WITH the Father before the world was created.

11. Jesus states that He was GIVEN power / authority over heaven and earth.
...Was Father God ever "given" power?
 Quoting: dschis1000



Acts 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him

Acts 10:38 is plain.

Who: God
What:Anointed
Who: Jesus
What: Anointed with the Holy Spirit
Who: God was with him.
Achduke
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06/24/2020 10:08 PM
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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
bump
Servant-of-the-LORD

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06/24/2020 10:34 PM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved

John 1-1
IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word himself was with Aloha, and Aloha was the Word himself.
John 1-2
This was in the beginning with Aloha.
John 1-3
Every thing by his hand was made; and without him also was not one thing made that was made.

................................

Yes, He is the Son of God, wholly man and wholly God.

Remember that Isaiah prophesied in 7:14 that his name would be Immanuel meaning "God with us".

Saying all of that we will have to ask once in Heaven. He is the Son of God and He and the Father are one.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward

"God with us" doesn't make Jesus "God".
It means the Father SENT Him DIRECTLY from Himself.

You ignore ALL the evidence.

Jesus CLEARLY said "the Father is God - MY God" in John 20:17.

Jesus' deity and divinity are as "the SON OF God".

-------------------------------------------

Jeremiah 10:10 But the LORD (YHWH) is the true God, he is the living God, and an everlasting king: at his wrath the earth shall tremble, and the nations shall not be able to abide his indignation.

John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 Thessalonians 1:9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

--------------------------------------------

1. Jesus prays to the Father. Does God pray to God?
...Father God doesn't pray to anyone.

2. Jesus gives thanks to the Father.
...The Father doens't give thanks to anyone.

3. Jesus states that He learned from the Father.
...Father God NEVER had to learn.

4. Jesus states that the Father TOLD Him what to say.
...NO ONE tells the Father what to say.

5. Jesus states that the Father is GREATER than He is.
...NO ONE is greater than Father God.

6. Jesus states that "only the Father is good".

7. Jesus states that only the Father knows WHEN Jesus will return.
...The Father's WILL is what is to be done - by HIS time table.

8. Jesus states that He sits at the Father's right hand - "the right hand of power".
...The Father is the source of all power and authority.

9. Jesus states that the Father SENT Him.
...Father God doesn't get "sent" by anyone.

10. Jesus states that He was WITH the Father before the world was created.

11. Jesus states that He was GIVEN power / authority over heaven and earth.
...Was Father God ever "given" power?
 Quoting: dschis1000



Acts 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him

Acts 10:38 is plain.

Who: God
What:Anointed
Who: Jesus
What: Anointed with the Holy Spirit
Who: God was with him.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 40500820


horn2

Thread: Son of God - Jesus' Relationship To The Father - John 17 and More - Bible Study
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/30/2020 09:11 AM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
bridec...……. The Lord is not the author of confusion.………. bridea

The Gospel was written to be published throughout the world in simple straightforward language that can be understood by people from all walks of life. The Bible is quite clear that those who are alive and in right standing with the Lord will be suddenly snatched away, just before the start of the Great Tribulation/The Time of Jacob's Troubles. There are no prophecy's that need to be fulfilled before it happens, you must make yourselves right with the Lord now. 2Co 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

You have still been blessed with a little time, so don't waste it. Turn to the Lord now while you are still able and He will be quick to hear you. Remember you could get hit by a bus tomorrow, and then where would you be?

And remember read the bible as it is written, do not listen to liars who would add or take away from the words of the Lord.

KJV 1 Thess. 4 13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

 Quoting: Judethz


The elect that die during the tribulation are also dead in Christ and will be in the first resurrection as rev 20 says.
Achduke
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/30/2020 10:20 AM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
The elect that die during the tribulation are also dead in Christ and will be in the first resurrection as rev 20 says.
 Quoting: Achduke7


backa Please provide a proper quotation to back up your claim. It is not acceptable to just refer people to a chapter and expect them to take the time to try and interpret what you mean. That's a lazy and misleading way of doing things.
 Quoting: Judethz


Rev 20:4-5 covers the tribulation saints who do not take the mark and are in the first resurrection with everyone else that dies in Christ.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Achduke
Achduke7  (OP)

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06/30/2020 11:38 AM

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Re: Defending the Pre-trib rapture **** New and Improved
The elect that die during the tribulation are also dead in Christ and will be in the first resurrection as rev 20 says.
 Quoting: Achduke7


backa Please provide a proper quotation to back up your claim. It is not acceptable to just refer people to a chapter and expect them to take the time to try and interpret what you mean. That's a lazy and misleading way of doing things.
 Quoting: Judethz


Rev 20:4-5 covers the tribulation saints who do not take the mark and are in the first resurrection with everyone else that dies in Christ.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
 Quoting: Achduke7


german3 I have no problem with that, only with your wrong interpretation of it. The Rapture Saints are taken away before the Tribulation starts. The Tribulation Saints are people who for whatever reason where not right with the Lord at the time that the Rapture takes place, but who later came to a saving grace and turned to the Lord while they still had a chance. And do not forget that that the many millions who have already died in Christ are included amongst the Rapture Saints. You cannot deny that they exist but you never provide any satisfactory explanation of how they all fit into this. But the Rapture does.

KJV 1 Thess. 4 13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

 Quoting: Judethz


You are using the interpretation of a past preacher or two who lead the sheep astray. Preachers who say that Christ did not know about a pretrib rapture. If there was a pretrib rapture most assuredly Christ would have mentioned it. Christ told us about the ressurection as did Paul.

Then Paul mentions one word(harpazo) about ressurection about the 2nd coming and low and behold pretrib preachers form a whole knew doctrine how they are special and tribulation saints who follow the word of God and die for him are lesser people. Something does not add up and you fail to see the error.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.


In addition these tribulation saints rule with Christ. Where does it say again pretribbers rule with Christ?


Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.


Are the pretribbers stuck in heaven while Christ is on earth with the tribulation saints?

If there was a pretrib would Christ leave his so called pretrib bride? The answer is no because there is no pretrib. A pretrib is not logical with scripture.
Achduke





GLP