Godlike Productions - Discussion Forum
Users Online Now: 998 (Who's On?)Visitors Today: 100,992
Pageviews Today: 253,752Threads Today: 109Posts Today: 2,182
05:59 AM


Rate this Thread

Absolute BS Crap Reasonable Nice Amazing
 

Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts

 
Layne Staley

User ID: 73777239
United States
04/07/2021 03:53 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
5 stars OP

God bless
Fuck coronavirus!

ITS TIME TO WAKE THE FUCK UP
SummerInAz

User ID: 80114107
United States
04/07/2021 04:04 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
First let me speak a bit about the Cannon itself. I have, in my own very humble and limited way, been exploring it for almost 20 years now, and I have even translated a very small amount of the material into English for the first time ever, to my limited knowledge. I am devoted to the Cannon as a stainless repository of Dharma and related wisdom.

The Taisho Tripitaka is the most comprehensive cannon of Mahayana Buddhist holy texts, or Sutras, plus commentaries and other related writings, mostly in classical Chinese and pre-modern Japanese. Compiled in the early 20th century, it is enormous: the total collection contains 5,320 individual texts, some allegedly going back as far as roughly 25 centuries.

To give you an idea of the size and "flavor" of sacred Buddhist texts, here is one row of such texts from a famous Buddhist temple repository in Korea:

https://imgur.com/otZ1XPM


The texts in the above collection have been preserved for centuries through a complex architectural schema that channels in the wind and uses a special earthen floor to modulate conditions for preservation. In recent times they tried to move the above collection into a "safer, more modern" building, but many of the texts immediately began to decay, so they moved them back to the original treasury. It remains a great mystery of architecture, design, and engineering as to how exactly the ancient building was constructed to preserve the texts.


And below a shot from a collection in Tibet:

https://imgur.com/Sbzyvzv


Thank you for sharing. Please share more of your translations.
For those of you who wish to check out the original and can read Classical Chinese and other ancient languages, the entire corpus has been digitized and is online here:

[link to 21dzk.l.u-tokyo.ac.jp (secure)]

Here is a 36-page "map" of the Corpus with English titles (PDF file):
[link to www.onmarkproductions.com (secure)]


Of the 5,320 texts in the collection, I estimate that only roughly 500-600 have ever been translated into Western languages.

The Bukkyo Dendo Kyokai, an institution in Tokyo, was established in the early 1980s by a wealthy Buddhist with the aim of translating the entire Corpus into English. In the last 40 years they have done a magnificent job with some of the more famous texts, but it seems doubtful that even working each day, they will meet their original goal of finishing the project by 2200 AD. However, endowed with a vast sum of money, if all goes well, they will keep going however many centuries it takes.


Now, if you will forgive that lengthy introduction, let's look at the specifically Christian texts in my next post.
 Quoting: Ordovician
Maybe I Did !!

User ID: 78067012
United States
04/07/2021 04:18 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
*****

Thank you OP, for a very informative and inspiring thread.

This is exactly what used to be the "norm" on GLP... years ago when I first started living here... and I did spend a huge amount of time on this site. LOL It was like my home.

It's refreshing to finally read and LEARN something that matters to my spirit.

5*'s for your great work !!

red_heart
Maybe I Did !!
Lily o' the Valley

User ID: 79908654
04/07/2021 04:38 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
What an illuminating topic! Thank you for your efforts, both in translating and in sharing what you have come across.

Blessings to you, for you kindness and humility.

rose
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Agent 99

User ID: 77082640
United States
04/07/2021 06:07 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Foundations of a Nestorian church has been found in Kyoto dated to around 1000CE.
 Quoting: JSB


Those Magi were travelling around for a long time.

The importance of the gifts they brought weren't the frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but the vessels of knowledge.

Last Edited by Agent 99 on 04/07/2021 06:09 AM
Lex Talionis-Neanderthal

User ID: 80038011
United States
04/07/2021 07:21 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Thank you OP.
Reading through this thread leaves me both fascinated and humbled at the same time.
You present some truly amazing information in a way that leaves me on the edge of my seat as I read it.
And the wealth of knowledge contributed by the many other posters to this thread is truly awe-inspiring.
This is truly an uplifting thread.
"Unapologetically American"
"Unapologetically white"
"Unapologetically male"
"Unapologetically straightl"
"Unapologetically Pro-Life"
“I am considered the enemy by the criminal progressive leftist ideology.”
“I am their worst fucking nightmare.”
humbird

User ID: 73158440
United States
04/07/2021 07:44 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
thank you OP!! five stars!!!
Aside from the small band of Forteans scattered around the world, nobody seems to notice all aspects of this phantasmagoria.(John A. Keel)
ronwyattchuckmissler

User ID: 79692266
United States
04/07/2021 09:25 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Jesus was a Buddhist. Most of his teachings were taken from Eastern Religions.
 Quoting: Harry Dresden

.
... huh! ... that would surprise Mary who was a virgin descent of abraham, issac, jacob ...
.
 Quoting: neanderthal wisconsin


The Psalms all read very much like Eastern Religions, almost Confucianism with morals.
 Quoting: Agent 99



Forgive me, but that is patently false... the Psalms all speak to a personal relationship with God, both beseaching and accepting of His will.

The passion, despair, beauty, predictiveness and hope portrayed in the Psalms are unsurpassed.

Psalm 22: first person narative of Christ on the cross, written hundreds of years before Jesus Christ was born
ron wyatt chuck missler
Alien Seb Fiend

User ID: 68742623
Canada
04/07/2021 09:37 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
The Luminous religion. Hmm.

Matthew 6:22

The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

Of course, that is talking about the third eye.


Very interesting, OP. I never knew that any Christian sect had established itself in China.
 Quoting: thinking...


Hmm interesting passage.. Alan Watts says something very similar in this short talk set to music:

jlee2027

User ID: 33981429
United States
04/07/2021 09:40 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Buddhism came from the Bible...it's a warped and poor imitation of Christianity
jlee2027

User ID: 33981429
United States
04/07/2021 09:41 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Jesus was a Buddhist. Most of his teachings were taken from Eastern Religions.
 Quoting: Harry Dresden


False. The Eastern Religions came from the Old Testament.
Alien Seb Fiend

User ID: 68742623
Canada
04/07/2021 09:52 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Buddhism came from the Bible...it's a warped and poor imitation of Christianity
 Quoting: jlee2027


Jesus was a Buddhist. Most of his teachings were taken from Eastern Religions.
 Quoting: Harry Dresden


False. The Eastern Religions came from the Old Testament.
 Quoting: jlee2027


Buddhism is a re-wording, refocusing of Hinduism, stripped of the religious components, in the same way that Christianity is the Israel religion reworded and refocused for "gentiles".

Hinduism comes from the Vedas, near what is now Pakistan, some 3000ish years ago, not the Torah, but it's conceivable that both of these came from some original source hundreds of thousands of years ago, then slowly mutated in the telling over the ages.

There used to be multiple gods in the middle-eastern religion, including a wife for God!

Regardless, it's only academic where these things came from, what is more important is how you make use of the spiritual path that speaks to your heart, and how much it helps you evolve as an individual. Focusing on things like "my religion is better than your religion!" only serves to cover your Heart with the Disease of the mind, the fruit of the tree of knowledge, that is to say, "over-thinking, over-analyzing".

Last Edited by Alien Seb Fiend on 04/07/2021 09:54 AM
Catnahalf
Deplorables assemble

User ID: 71790446
United States
04/07/2021 10:17 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
bump
Agent 99

User ID: 77082640
United States
04/07/2021 10:20 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Jesus was a Buddhist. Most of his teachings were taken from Eastern Religions.
 Quoting: Harry Dresden

.
... huh! ... that would surprise Mary who was a virgin descent of abraham, issac, jacob ...
.
 Quoting: neanderthal wisconsin


The Psalms all read very much like Eastern Religions, almost Confucianism with morals.
 Quoting: Agent 99



Forgive me, but that is patently false... the Psalms all speak to a personal relationship with God, both beseaching and accepting of His will.

The passion, despair, beauty, predictiveness and hope portrayed in the Psalms are unsurpassed.

Psalm 22: first person narative of Christ on the cross, written hundreds of years before Jesus Christ was born
 Quoting: ronwyattchuckmissler


Where exactly was that written?
Just curious.

Last Edited by Agent 99 on 04/07/2021 10:28 AM
Alien Seb Fiend

User ID: 68742623
Canada
04/07/2021 10:24 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Where exactly was that written?
 Quoting: Agent 99


According to the folk who wrote it, it's about "a royal figure, usually King David or Queen Esther," and according to the Christians, Jesus was quoting the first line. He would have, of course, known these things by heart, having studied them extensively in his youth.

Last Edited by Alien Seb Fiend on 04/07/2021 10:25 AM
Agent 99

User ID: 77082640
United States
04/07/2021 10:33 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Where exactly was that written?
 Quoting: Agent 99


According to the folk who wrote it, it's about "a royal figure, usually King David or Queen Esther," and according to the Christians, Jesus was quoting the first line. He would have, of course, known these things by heart, having studied them extensively in his youth.
 Quoting: Alien Seb Fiend


150 psalms were selected from a wider set, that's my point. So it wasn't one scribe sitting under an olive tree in Israel writing the Psalms.

The collection comes from all over the Silk Route. That's all. The poetic nature shows the eclectic collection.
simplify

User ID: 75394427
Canada
04/07/2021 11:09 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Wonderful thread & lovely to see such respectful comments. Reminds me of way back when this forum started.

Blessings OP & gratitude for your diligent research & sharing.
"It is no measure of health to be well

adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

J. Krishnamurti.
Ordovician  (OP)

User ID: 80159447
Japan
04/07/2021 11:30 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
I'm really pleased and thankful for all the positive responses and the pins. You people are great; I'm glad I took the chance to post this stuff here.

The presence of Nestorian Christians in China is undisputed. No scholar of any credibility would call this into question.

What is a little more controversial is the question of whether the Nestorians ever made it to Japan, and if so, how widespread their influence was. There is some evidence suggesting this and that, but its spotty and not as solid as tthe evidence from China.

A longtime US resident of Japan (and somebody I've bumped into from time to time over the years, although I don't know him too well) is Reverend Ken Joseph. He's a big believer that Nestorians were in early Japan, and he lays out his argument in a book called "Lost Identity," which you can read much if not most of at the link below (pdf file):

[link to www.onmarkproductions.com (secure)]

here's a brief overview of this book written by Japan scholar Mark Schumacher:

Under Prince Regent Shotoku and Empress Suiko in the seventh century, the Hata clan from central Asia were
granted full liberty under the provisions of Shotoku's famous 17-Article Constitution. Some Japanese researchers say that the first bearers of Christianity to Japan were Hata people from modern-day Kazakhstan, who came to Japan from the Silk Road cities of Constantinople, Egypt and Persia starting around 200 A.D. The next wave of Christian immigrants, they say, were the Keikyo people from the (Nestorian) Assyrian Church of the East, who began coming to Japan from the fifth century onwards. In the days of Shotoku Taishi, the Nestorian church grounds at Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja (in Kyoto, Japan) had their own "Well of Israel" attached to a David's Shrine, and on the well-spring stood a Sacred Tripod symbolizing the Trinity from which a limpid stream flowed. Visitors to Uzumasa today can still see a tripod, build in the style of a triangular torii, which reportedly marks the exact spot where the original tripod of the Nestorians once stood.


Personally, I find much of this sort of evidence to be less convincing than Rev. Joseph makes it out to be. "Legends say," "people claim," "a cross-like marking was found..." and so on. There are a zillion potential explanations for such tales and phenomena. Still, I don't doubt its possible that Nestorians were here, and his book (read with an open mind) makes for a great "what if". Make of his theories what you will.


Thanks for reading friends. I'll try to keep this thread alive from time to time.
Asuralikeproduction

User ID: 77344770
United States
04/07/2021 11:44 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Buddhism came from the Bible...it's a warped and poor imitation of Christianity
 Quoting: jlee2027


Buddhism is a re-wording, refocusing of Hinduism, stripped of the religious components, in the same way that Christianity is the Israel religion reworded and refocused for "gentiles".

Hinduism comes from the Vedas, near what is now Pakistan, some 3000ish years ago, not the Torah, but it's conceivable that both of these came from some original source hundreds of thousands of years ago, then slowly mutated in the telling over the ages....
 Quoting: Alien Seb Fiend


‘Hinduism’ may have actually come from a pre-Shakyamuni Buddha. See: Vipashyin, Kanakamuni, Kashyapa, Sikhin, Krakucchanda, etc.

Also, the oldest dated Yoga texts may be Buddhist and seem to predate Patanjali’s Yoga texts, FWIW.

Last Edited by Asuralikeproduction on 04/07/2021 11:50 AM
Agent 99

User ID: 77082640
United States
04/07/2021 12:16 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
I'm really pleased and thankful for all the positive responses and the pins. You people are great; I'm glad I took the chance to post this stuff here.

The presence of Nestorian Christians in China is undisputed. No scholar of any credibility would call this into question.

What is a little more controversial is the question of whether the Nestorians ever made it to Japan, and if so, how widespread their influence was. There is some evidence suggesting this and that, but its spotty and not as solid as tthe evidence from China.

A longtime US resident of Japan (and somebody I've bumped into from time to time over the years, although I don't know him too well) is Reverend Ken Joseph. He's a big believer that Nestorians were in early Japan, and he lays out his argument in a book called "Lost Identity," which you can read much if not most of at the link below (pdf file):

[link to www.onmarkproductions.com (secure)]

here's a brief overview of this book written by Japan scholar Mark Schumacher:

Under Prince Regent Shotoku and Empress Suiko in the seventh century, the Hata clan from central Asia were
granted full liberty under the provisions of Shotoku's famous 17-Article Constitution. Some Japanese researchers say that the first bearers of Christianity to Japan were Hata people from modern-day Kazakhstan, who came to Japan from the Silk Road cities of Constantinople, Egypt and Persia starting around 200 A.D. The next wave of Christian immigrants, they say, were the Keikyo people from the (Nestorian) Assyrian Church of the East, who began coming to Japan from the fifth century onwards. In the days of Shotoku Taishi, the Nestorian church grounds at Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja (in Kyoto, Japan) had their own "Well of Israel" attached to a David's Shrine, and on the well-spring stood a Sacred Tripod symbolizing the Trinity from which a limpid stream flowed. Visitors to Uzumasa today can still see a tripod, build in the style of a triangular torii, which reportedly marks the exact spot where the original tripod of the Nestorians once stood.


Personally, I find much of this sort of evidence to be less convincing than Rev. Joseph makes it out to be. "Legends say," "people claim," "a cross-like marking was found..." and so on. There are a zillion potential explanations for such tales and phenomena. Still, I don't doubt its possible that Nestorians were here, and his book (read with an open mind) makes for a great "what if". Make of his theories what you will.


Thanks for reading friends. I'll try to keep this thread alive from time to time.
 Quoting: Ordovician


Can you tell me more about the Nestorian church grounds at Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja (in Kyoto, Japan) had their own "Well of Israel"...
Alien Seb Fiend

User ID: 68742623
Canada
04/07/2021 12:20 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
‘Hinduism’ may have actually come from a pre-Shakyamuni Buddha. See: Vipashyin, Kanakamuni, Kashyapa, Sikhin, Krakucchanda, etc.

Also, the oldest dated Yoga texts may be Buddhist and seem to predate Patanjali’s Yoga texts, FWIW.
 Quoting: Asuralikeproduction


Alright, I'll rephrase.. What we call buddhism post-Shakya! I purposely avoid having any opinion about the belief based aspects of it regarding past-life stuff, or stuff related to previous world cycles, or any of that, and just focus on the technique, as that is all that is important!
Servant-of-the-LORD

User ID: 77744888
United States
04/07/2021 12:28 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Like many of you, I was taught the Jesuits brought Christianity to China in the 1500s. Turns out they were Johnnie-come-latelies.
 Quoting: Ordovician


1500's???

You should look up the "tradition" that
the Apostle Thomas went to China.

Most "scholars" will teach that Christianity
didn't start in China until about the 4-5th Century.

[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]







[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]






[link to www.youtube.com (secure)]





Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 04/07/2021 12:32 PM
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Asuralikeproduction

User ID: 77344770
United States
04/07/2021 01:04 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
‘Hinduism’ may have actually come from a pre-Shakyamuni Buddha. See: Vipashyin, Kanakamuni, Kashyapa, Sikhin, Krakucchanda, etc.

Also, the oldest dated Yoga texts may be Buddhist and seem to predate Patanjali’s Yoga texts, FWIW.
 Quoting: Asuralikeproduction


Alright, I'll rephrase.. What we call buddhism post-Shakya! I purposely avoid having any opinion about the belief based aspects of it regarding past-life stuff, or stuff related to previous world cycles, or any of that, and just focus on the technique, as that is all that is important!
 Quoting: Alien Seb Fiend


Fair enough.


There is also this for anyone interested, from a Wikipedia entry:


“Buddhism does not deny that the Vedas in their true origin were sacred although have been amended repeatedly by certain Brahmins to secure their positions in society. The Buddha declared that the Veda in its true form was declared by Kashyapa to certain rishis, who by severe penances had acquired the power to see by divine eyes.[65] In the Buddhist Vinaya Pitaka of the Mahavagga (I.245)[66] section the Buddha names these rishis, and declared that the original Veda the Vedic rishis "Atthako, Vâmako, Vâmadevo, Vessâmitto, Yamataggi, Angiraso, Bhâradvâjo, Vâsettho, Kassapo, and Bhagu"[67] but that it was altered by a few Brahmins who introduced animal sacrifices. The Vinaya Pitaka's section Anguttara Nikaya: Panchaka Nipata says that it was on this alteration of the true Veda that the Buddha refused to pay respect to the Vedas of his time.[68]
The Buddha is recorded in the Canki Sutta (Majjhima Nikaya 95) as saying to a group of Brahmins:
O Vasettha, those priests who know the scriptures are just like a line of blind men tied together where the first sees nothing, the middle man nothing, and the last sees nothing.
In the same discourse, he says:
It is not proper for a wise man who maintains truth to come to the conclusion: This alone is Truth, and everything else is false.
He is also recorded as saying:
To be attached to one thing (to a certain view) and to look down upon other things (views) as inferior - this the wise men call a fetter.”



I’m assuming that Kassapo is a transliterated Pali version of Kasyapa.

Also I’m not sure if the Vedic Kashyapa or Kasyapa Saptarishi, has any relation to the past Buddha Kasyapa.

Apparently there is also a Buddhist text or two claiming that the original Vedas were revealed by Manjusri or Manjushri.

Last Edited by Asuralikeproduction on 04/07/2021 01:35 PM
Alien Seb Fiend

User ID: 68742623
Canada
04/07/2021 01:14 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Indeed, opinionating and creating an ego based view of one's own path vs others is one heck of a mental block to freeing one's one Mind!

I am closely associated with a couple of buddhist monks, related to my employment. Such nice fellas!
just a dude

User ID: 80080280
United States
04/07/2021 01:18 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
nirvana means ???
buddha means ???
anatman means???
tathagata means???
emanuel means ???
christ means???
ahura mazda means???

in buddism, what's the vehicle for consciousness transfer from one incarnation to another ?

...
 Quoting: pilgrim2021


in the waters of hades
Ordovician  (OP)

User ID: 80159447
Japan
04/07/2021 01:18 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Can you tell me more about the Nestorian church grounds at Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja (in Kyoto, Japan) had their own "Well of Israel"...
 Quoting: Agent 99


Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja is ostensibly a Shinto Shrine and functions as one today. But the hereditary priest and his family that have run the shrine for countless generations hold a "secret" theory that it was originally a Christian church.

Whether they are making this up, or sincerely believe it but are deluded, or are 100% correct, I could not say.

Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja does have some unusual features. Firstly, it has a Torii (Shinto gate) that is decidedly different from most "normal" torii. The standard Torii has two pillars, but as you can see, this one has three.

(Scroll down a bit for some pics of the three-pillared shrine):
[link to home.s01.itscom.net]

Gabi Greves, who conducts exhaustive analyses of various shrines, states rather laconically:
Some sources state that this was a secret symbol of the underground Christians for the Holy Trinity. The [Shrine personnel] explain the three pillars represent
faith, hope and charity.


gotta admit that last part sounds pretty darn Christian...

Couldn't find much about the so-called "Well of Israel," But I did find out that this shrine is associated with the Hata Clan, who also are associated with several other nearby shrines. One of them conducts an unusual and very un-Shinto-ish ritual where participants enter some "holy purifying water" to "wash away their sins." The parallels with baptism are obvious although perhaps not utterly decisive.

Yet another Hata-Clan-Associated Shinto Shrine called Ohsake Jinja is in the same vicinity and this is what the author of "Lost Identity" writes about it:

[Visiting the Shrine, I said to the priest] "Excuse me...I've been told that about 1400 years ago, people from Assyria came to Japan bringing with them ancient Christianity and that they built a church right here. Do you know anything about that?"

I fully expected to receive a cold response and be
ushered out with, "Don't be ridiculous! There was no such thing!" But to the contrary, the priest said, "What an interesting thing you say. Actually, this shrine is closely related to the "Hata" people, and to be honest with you, it is really an unusual shrine." He continued to share with me the history of the shrine and the "strange" objects that were enshrined there, including the items that were worshipped by the Hata people....

...The priest continued, "The number 12 is used very often
here at this shrine. You give 12 offerings, and there are 12 stones, and other such things having to do with 12." I was thinking as I listened to him that the ancient Israelites set up 12 pillars because they were made up of 12 tribes,
and the number 12 appeared in numerous other contexts as well, including the number of disciples Jesus had. In fact, the number "12" in the Bible was a symbol for "redemption" and "salvation". Thus, 12 was also important to the followers of Keikyo and other eastern Christian sects.

The priest also said that even though the Ohsake Jinja
enshirined Hatano Kawakatsu as a [diety], originally, [Hatano Kawakatsu had been a human being of the Hata clan, and it was really] that which Hatano Kawakatsu had worshipped that was enshrined. So what was it that he had worshipped?"


What indeed?
MaxPower

User ID: 66876886
United Kingdom
04/07/2021 01:26 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Thread: Amazing similarity of Bible Passage and The Chinese Zodiac Story
Watch for the signs
just a dude

User ID: 80080280
United States
04/07/2021 01:30 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Can you tell me more about the Nestorian church grounds at Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja (in Kyoto, Japan) had their own "Well of Israel"...
 Quoting: Agent 99


Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja is ostensibly a Shinto Shrine and functions as one today. But the hereditary priest and his family that have run the shrine for countless generations hold a "secret" theory that it was originally a Christian church.

Whether they are making this up, or sincerely believe it but are deluded, or are 100% correct, I could not say.

Uzumasa-no-Kijima Jinja does have some unusual features. Firstly, it has a Torii (Shinto gate) that is decidedly different from most "normal" torii. The standard Torii has two pillars, but as you can see, this one has three.

(Scroll down a bit for some pics of the three-pillared shrine):
[link to home.s01.itscom.net]

Gabi Greves, who conducts exhaustive analyses of various shrines, states rather laconically:
Some sources state that this was a secret symbol of the underground Christians for the Holy Trinity. The [Shrine personnel] explain the three pillars represent
faith, hope and charity.


gotta admit that last part sounds pretty darn Christian...

Couldn't find much about the so-called "Well of Israel," But I did find out that this shrine is associated with the Hata Clan, who also are associated with several other nearby shrines. One of them conducts an unusual and very un-Shinto-ish ritual where participants enter some "holy purifying water" to "wash away their sins." The parallels with baptism are obvious although perhaps not utterly decisive.

Yet another Hata-Clan-Associated Shinto Shrine called Ohsake Jinja is in the same vicinity and this is what the author of "Lost Identity" writes about it:

[Visiting the Shrine, I said to the priest] "Excuse me...I've been told that about 1400 years ago, people from Assyria came to Japan bringing with them ancient Christianity and that they built a church right here. Do you know anything about that?"

I fully expected to receive a cold response and be
ushered out with, "Don't be ridiculous! There was no such thing!" But to the contrary, the priest said, "What an interesting thing you say. Actually, this shrine is closely related to the "Hata" people, and to be honest with you, it is really an unusual shrine." He continued to share with me the history of the shrine and the "strange" objects that were enshrined there, including the items that were worshipped by the Hata people....

...The priest continued, "The number 12 is used very often
here at this shrine. You give 12 offerings, and there are 12 stones, and other such things having to do with 12." I was thinking as I listened to him that the ancient Israelites set up 12 pillars because they were made up of 12 tribes,
and the number 12 appeared in numerous other contexts as well, including the number of disciples Jesus had. In fact, the number "12" in the Bible was a symbol for "redemption" and "salvation". Thus, 12 was also important to the followers of Keikyo and other eastern Christian sects.

The priest also said that even though the Ohsake Jinja
enshirined Hatano Kawakatsu as a [diety], originally, [Hatano Kawakatsu had been a human being of the Hata clan, and it was really] that which Hatano Kawakatsu had worshipped that was enshrined. So what was it that he had worshipped?"


What indeed?
 Quoting: Ordovician


Djinn and tonic, anyone?

Good stuff OP.
Where Eagles Dare
Metal-American

User ID: 73836248
United States
04/07/2021 01:52 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Bundles of volumes are further classified into what one might call "Groups:" There is a "Zen Group" of Zen Texts, the "Agma Group" of the earliest teachings, the "Esoteric Group" of what were originally generally secret texts kept from the eyes of all but advanced Vajrayana initiates, and so on.

 Quoting: Ordovician


Can you expand on that bolded above? It specifically caught my eye, in that 'Agma' is the Devil/Satan in the Korean language.
Isaiah 40:31 - But they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

“They’ve got us surrounded again, the poor bastards.” - U.S. Army Paratrooper at Bastogne
Agent 99

User ID: 77082640
United States
04/07/2021 02:12 PM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Buried deep in the Taisho Tripitaka Buddhist Cannon, I found several ancient Christian texts
Couldn't find much about the so-called "Well of Israel," But I did find out that this shrine is associated with the Hata Clan, who also are associated with several other nearby shrines. One of them conducts an unusual and very un-Shinto-ish ritual where participants enter some "holy purifying water" to "wash away their sins." The parallels with baptism are obvious although perhaps not utterly decisive.
 Quoting: Ordovician


Thanks for that!!!

Buddha "soft pork" translation?

Last Edited by Agent 99 on 04/07/2021 02:13 PM





GLP