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The case for Jesus was vegetarian

 
Satya Revelations

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07/12/2021 02:33 PM

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The case for Jesus was vegetarian
The dispute over vegetarianism in the early church shows that the leadership of the Jerusalem church was vegetarian. The later history of J.wish Christianity indicates that Je.ish Christianity was vegetarian and preserved this tradition of defending animals. Yahshua’s’ attack on the animal sacrifice business demonstrates that Yahshua himself shared these views.

The very earliest layer of historical evidence about Christianity, the letters of Paul, indicate that vegetarianism was a hot topic in the early church. Before the destruction of the temple, before the gospels were written, and before theological assumptions colored later Christian histories, Paul is clearly enmeshed in a huge controversy over vegetarianism. The outlines of this controversy are found in Romans 14, I Corinthians 8–10, and Galatians 2.

In Romans and I Corinthians, Paul indicates that his opponents are vegetarians. Paul maintains that it is perfectly all right to eat meat, but also counsels diplomacy in dealing with the vegetarians.
Paul suggests not offending the picky eaters in the early movement.

Nothing is unclean of itself, but it is unclean for anyone who thinks it is unclean . . . Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make others fall by what he eats; it is right not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything makes your brother stumble (Romans 14:14, 20–21).


In this phrase “makes your brother stumble,” we can see the whole problem. It is eating meat and drinking wine which makes these vegetarians stumble, because they are offended by it. Paul says we can safely ignore these vegetarians . . .

Eat anything sold in the meat-market without raising questions of conscience. (I Corinthians 10:25)
. . . but, on the other hand, we should take care not to offend them:

I [Paul] will never eat meat, lest I cause my brother to fall. (I Corinthians 8:13)
These early Christian vegetarians were offended by the thought that other believers might sacrifice animals or eat meat. Not only are they vegetarians, they believe that vegetarianism should be required of all followers of Yahshua. It is not a question of personal preference, but a question of conscience.
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:34 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
So who are these trouble-making vegetarians who must not be offended? They were the leaders of the early church. In Galatians 2, Paul’s opponents are clearly spelled out: James the brother of Yahshua, Peter, and John. The dispute itself is not as clearly spelled out, all we know is that until “certain men from James” came to Antioch, that Peter ate at the “table of gentiles” (Galatians 2:12). We do know, though, that James’ view carried the day, at least at the time. Peter stops eating at the table of gentiles. “Even Barnabas was carried away,” Paul ruefully admits (Galatians 2:13).

James the brother of Yahshua, the first leader of the Jerusalem church after Yahshua’s’ departure, was universally acknowledged to be a strict vegetarian, and in fact was raised as a vegetarian (Eusebius, Ecclesiastical History 2.23.5–6). Why would Yahshua’s’ family raise James as a vegetarian, but not Yahshua? The natural conclusion is that Yahshua’s’ parents raised Yahshua and James as vegetarians and that this was part of the original gospel message.

This dispute in Galatians is not about kosher regulations in the modern sense, as if someone had pork at the table, or someone were mixing meat and milk. Rather, Paul is concerned with James’ much more radical idea of what is kosher; it is meat and wine, by themselves, that make a meal unclean (Romans 14:20–21).

Later J.wish Christianity, especially the Je.ish Christian Ebionites of the second, third, and fourth centuries, inherited the traditions of James and the Jerusalem church. They would not eat meat, or eat with anyone who was not baptized and had therefore given up meat — for them, all believers were vegetarians and had renounced violence. These later J.wish Christians were described by such early Christian writers as Irenaeus, Hippolytus, and Epiphanius, and also in two lengthy documents which are mostly Je.ish Christian in origin, the Homilies and Recognitions.

To eat “dead flesh” is to eat at the table of demons (Homilies 7.4, 7.8), and in the Homilies and Recognitions, followers of Jesus are counseled to avoid eating at the table of demons. Indeed, they should not even eat with anyone who has eaten at “the table of demons” and has not subsequently been baptized. That’s why, according to Je.ish Christianity, Peter refused to eat with unbelievers or “gentiles” (Recognitions 1.19, 2.3, 2.71–72, 7.29, 7.34; Homilies 1.22, 13.4).
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:35 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Yahshua was H.b.rew, and in the beginning all followers of Yahshua were H.b.rews, but by the second century Je.ish Christianity is condemned as a heresy. When the rest of the New Testament is written, though, Paul’s anti-vegetarian viewpoint is triumphant and is written into the Christian literature. There is no restriction on food; Mark says parenthetically that Yahshua “declared all foods clean” (7:19). Yahshua now distributes fish to the five thousand, and even eats fish after the resurrection (Luke 24:43).
However, some evidence of Yahshua’s’ compassion for animals has survived in the gospels:

Are not five sparrows sold for two pennies? And not one of them is forgotten before God. (Luke 12:6)
What man of you, if he has one sheep and it falls into a pit on the sabbath, will not lay hold of it and lift it out? (Matthew 12:11)


The Je.ish Christian Ebionites were loyal to the Je.ish law (as interpreted by Yahshua), they despised Paul, they rejected animal sacrifice, and they were vegetarians. They have, in short, inherited the traditions of the vegetarians in the early church described by Paul. The vegetarian opponents of Paul were also loyal to the law, despised Paul, rejected animal sacrifice, and were vegetarian.

The early church was highly fragmented, with numerous competing heretical groups. Why, of all the innumerable groups that followed Yahshua, should we believe the gentile Christian groups rather than the Je..sh Christian groups? Wasn’t Yahshua himself a J.w? Wouldn’t those early Christians who — like their teacher — were also J.wish, be most likely to have understood Yahshua correctly?
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:36 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
In the gospel of the Ebionites, Yahshua indignantly rejects the Passover meat, and attacks animal sacrifice, saying “I have come to destroy the sacrifices, and unless you stop sacrificing [animals], my wrath will not stop from you.” If Yahshua had compassion for animals as part of his message, then that would explain why he gave his life for this principle. According to all of the gospels, Yahshua went into the temple and disrupted the animal sacrifice business:

And Yahshua entered the temple of God and drove out all who sold and bought in the temple, and he overturned the tables of the moneychangers and the seats of those who sold pigeons. (Matthew 21:12; parallels at Mark 11:15-17, Luke 19:45-46, John 2:13-17)

John places the incident in the temple at a different time, but elaborates more fully on the event itself:
In the temple he found those who were selling oxen and sheep and pigeons, and the money-changers at their business. And making a whip of cords, he drove them all, with the sheep and oxen, out of the temple; and he poured out the coins of the money-changers and overturned their tables. And he told those who sold the pigeons, “Take these things away; you shall not make my Father’s house a house of trade.” (John 2:14–16)

The animals which are being sold are sacrificial animals, and it is these dealers in animals whom Yahshua is angry with. The primary practical effect of this confrontation was to disrupt the animal sacrifice business — chasing out the animals to be sacrificed, or those who were buying or selling them to be sacrificed. “Cleansing the temple” was an act of animal liberation. Yahshua himself quoted the prophets when he said, “If you had known what that text means, ‘I require mercy, not sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the innocent” (Matthew 12:7).
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:36 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
We know that there were vegetarians in the early church, including the leadership, who were not only vegetarian but believed that vegetarianism should be required, and were in a serious dispute over food with Paul. We know that later J.wish Christianity claimed allegiance to this Jerusalem church and rejected Paul; they were vegetarians, against animal sacrifice, and loyal to the law. Finally, we know that Yahshua was arrested and executed after a confrontation in the temple in which he disrupts the bloody animal sacrifice business. If we know anything about the historical Yahshua, we know that he was vegetarian.


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Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Anonymous Coward
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07/12/2021 02:38 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Just another made up story written by the Romans to quell civil violence in their empire. Fake religion for the gullible.
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:40 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Just another made up story written by the Romans to quell civil violence in their empire. Fake religion for the gullible.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 80509128


the need for sacrifice to endorse meat eating ?

Yes, agree completely !
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
232
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07/12/2021 02:43 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
The case for You're Ignorant.

After the resurrection, Jesus appears to His Disciples and eats fish.

Luke 24:42

And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

Those that are weak in faith eat only vegetables

Romans 14:2
For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

All things that YHWH designated as food are permissible

Leviticus 11
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:45 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
The case for You're Ignorant.

After the resurrection, Jesus appears to His Disciples and eats fish.

Luke 24:42

And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

Those that are weak in faith eat only vegetables

Romans 14:2
For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

All things that YHWH designated as food are permissible

Leviticus 11
 Quoting: 232 80519059


Did you even read what I posted? I'm making a case based on historical information...... NOT scripts.
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Remedial_Rebel

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07/12/2021 02:45 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.

Last Edited by Remedial_Rebel on 07/12/2021 02:49 PM
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 02:50 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


did you even read what I posted??????


I'm offering a case based on historical information.

NOT biblical scripts.

Kindly respond to the post's information.
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Icey

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07/12/2021 03:03 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
bsflag
I am SNOWIE. WELCOME TO THE NEW ICE AGE. TRY NOT TO STARVE.
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:08 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
bsflag
 Quoting: Icey


Based on what? Can you discuss what I posted?
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Arlie27

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07/12/2021 03:11 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus ate fish.
Anonymous Coward
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07/12/2021 03:12 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


did you even read what I posted??????


I'm offering a case based on historical information.

NOT biblical scripts.

Kindly respond to the post's information.
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


Lol
What “historical info” did you post that wasn’t scripture or gnostic hoodoo?
Red John

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07/12/2021 03:13 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
nope

Exodus 12
and
Numbers 9

command for all Israel to keep the Passover

Numbers 9
13 But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and ceases to keep the Passover, that same person shall be cut off from among his people, because he did not bring the offering of the Lord at its appointed time; that man shall bear his sin.

He had to eat the meat of the Passover

that's the Mosaic Law

He came as one born under the law to fulfill it
not break it
pixie

General Failure Reading Drive A:
Who is General Failure?

There can be Only One

Team Swirl
Swirl Nation

instead of red, post in the thread, then I can respond.

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Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:14 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
nope

Exodus 12
and
Numbers 9

command for all Israel to keep the Passover

Numbers 9
13 But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and ceases to keep the Passover, that same person shall be cut off from among his people, because he did not bring the offering of the Lord at its appointed time; that man shall bear his sin.

He had to eat the meat of the Passover

that's the Mosaic Law

He came as one born under the law to fulfill it
not break it
 Quoting: Red John


That's not what he said. He broke the law continually
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:15 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


did you even read what I posted??????


I'm offering a case based on historical information.

NOT biblical scripts.

Kindly respond to the post's information.
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


Lol
What “historical info” did you post that wasn’t scripture or gnostic hoodoo?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72440120

There's more information than what's in the bible. LOTS more.
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Satya Revelations  (OP)

User ID: 78165565
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07/12/2021 03:18 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
nope

Exodus 12
and
Numbers 9

command for all Israel to keep the Passover

Numbers 9
13 But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and ceases to keep the Passover, that same person shall be cut off from among his people, because he did not bring the offering of the Lord at its appointed time; that man shall bear his sin.

He had to eat the meat of the Passover

that's the Mosaic Law

He came as one born under the law to fulfill it
not break it
 Quoting: Red John


Can you respond to my opening posts? His brother was vegetarian, why would he be a meat eater if his brother, who became leader of the first followers
Of him, was vegetarian
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Red John

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Canada
07/12/2021 03:19 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
nope

Exodus 12
and
Numbers 9

command for all Israel to keep the Passover

Numbers 9
13 But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and ceases to keep the Passover, that same person shall be cut off from among his people, because he did not bring the offering of the Lord at its appointed time; that man shall bear his sin.

He had to eat the meat of the Passover

that's the Mosaic Law

He came as one born under the law to fulfill it
not break it
 Quoting: Red John


That's not what he said. He broke the law continually
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


He did what we do when we disobey mask mandates

mask mandates are not laws and therefore are not enforceable as laws and not illegal to disobey

the traditions of the "religious" leaders were not laws
and therefore not sin to disobey and no Mosaic Laws were broken
pixie

General Failure Reading Drive A:
Who is General Failure?

There can be Only One

Team Swirl
Swirl Nation

instead of red, post in the thread, then I can respond.

[link to qz.com (secure)]
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:21 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
nope

Exodus 12
and
Numbers 9

command for all Israel to keep the Passover

Numbers 9
13 But the man who is clean and is not on a journey, and ceases to keep the Passover, that same person shall be cut off from among his people, because he did not bring the offering of the Lord at its appointed time; that man shall bear his sin.

He had to eat the meat of the Passover

that's the Mosaic Law

He came as one born under the law to fulfill it
not break it
 Quoting: Red John


That's not what he said. He broke the law continually
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


He did what we do when we disobey mask mandates

mask mandates are not laws and therefore are not enforceable as laws and not illegal to disobey

the traditions of the "religious" leaders were not laws
and therefore not sin to disobey and no Mosaic Laws were broken
 Quoting: Red John


But you don't KNOW this. You believe it, based on indoctrination
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Anonymous Coward
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07/12/2021 03:21 PM
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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
OP is the tardest of tards.
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:24 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
OP is the tardest of tards.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72663097


hf
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?
Remedial_Rebel

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07/12/2021 03:24 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


did you even read what I posted??????


I'm offering a case based on historical information.

NOT biblical scripts.

Kindly respond to the post's information.
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


Yes I read your conjectures. I'm presenting you with the facts of scripture which apparently you refuse to accept.

Last Edited by Remedial_Rebel on 07/12/2021 03:28 PM
Satya Revelations  (OP)

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07/12/2021 03:31 PM

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Re: The case for Jesus was vegetarian
Jesus served the disciples fish.

John 21:10-13

Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught. 11Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. 12Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord. 13Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


did you even read what I posted??????


I'm offering a case based on historical information.

NOT biblical scripts.

Kindly respond to the post's information.
 Quoting: Satya Revelations


Yes I read your conjectures. I'm presenting you with the facts of scripture which apparently you refuse to accept.
 Quoting: Remedial_Rebel


hf
Shakti.ji

The servants of the Most Merciful walk upon the earth easily; and when the ignorant address them harshly they say words of peace.

When the heart is pure, there is no difficulty, whatsoever. Why should one be afraid of any one if there be no evil thought in us?

Of what worth is creation ~ if it doesn’t put a sparkle in your eye ~ and a song in your heart?





GLP