After the Tribulation: Revisited - NO Pre-Trib Rapture - KJV Bible Study Christian Theology

Rapture sure sounds more pleasant than a guillotine. Buy I’m afraid it’s not biblical or historical for true followers of the word. The 5th seal saints are waiting.

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Pre-Trib Rapture? How Does the Last Trump Happen BEFORE that? - Bible Sutdy

It doesn't.

Pre-Trib Rapture Tards have you focusing on the 'event' instead of looking at the 'when' that it happens.

Let's look at 1 Thessalonians 4.

1. In vers 16 Paul says 'the trump of God'...

1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

2. Which 'trump'? The LAST Trump. That's NOT before the Tribulation

1 Corinthians 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

3. In verses 15 and 17 Paul says 'alive and remain'...

1 Thessalonians 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

4. 'Remain' from what? What event(s) would kill a LOT of people and leave those 'who remain'? The Tribulation!

The 'last trump' will be the END of the Tribulation. This is why Jesus said...Immediately* after the tribulation

Matthew 24

29 Immediately* after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the ***clans*** of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other*.


Mark 13

24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,


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5. All the verses below empathize being strong 'to the end'.

The phrase "to the end" occurs 8 times in 8 verses in the New Testament in the KJV.

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Matthew 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

Romans 1:11 For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;

Romans 4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

2 Corinthians 1:13 For we write none other things unto you, than what ye read or acknowledge; and I trust ye shall acknowledge even to the end;


1 Thessalonians 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

1 Peter 1:13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

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The phrase "unto the end" occurs 9 times in 9 verses in the New Testament in the KJV.

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Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Matthew 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Mark 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

1 Corinthians 1:8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 3:6 But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.

Hebrews 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

Hebrews 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:

Revelation 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

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Luke 21:35 WHO are the recipients of the snare???

The tares are removed first.

Matthew 13

39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Pre-Trib Tards claim that Paul never taught about Christians going through Tribulation. What do you call this?

Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

Romans 2:9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Hebrews first, and also of the Gentiles;

Romans 5:3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

Romans 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

Romans 12:12 Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;

2 Corinthians 1:4 Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.

2 Corinthians 7:4 Great is my boldness of speech toward you, great is my glorying of you: I am filled with comfort, I am exceeding joyful in all our tribulation.

1 Thessalonians 3:4 For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know.

2 Thessalonians 1:6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

The 'scene' of the "tribulation saints" in Revelation 20 is AFTER Satan has been cast into the pit for a thousand years.

That is NOT BEFORE the End Times Tribulation

Revelation 20:4

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Revelation 20:2-7 KJV

2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him,
that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them:
and I saw the souls of them that were

beheaded for the witness of Jesus,
and for the word of God,
and which had not worshipped the beast,
neither his image,
neither had received his mark
upon their foreheads, or in their hands;

and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

"Proof that the Tribulation is NOT Gods Wrath"

6th Seal is the 'dividing line' between Tribulation and Wrath.

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This happens before the Rapture.
We'ere not even close to it happening.

2 Thessalonians 2

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Matthew 24 King James Version

1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.

2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

25 Behold, I have told you before.

26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tri-***clans***-bes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

...

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

...

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

...

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Says WHO?

NO scripture states such. Only 'pre-trib' rhetoric.

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'day of Christ' = 'day of the Lord'

Paul uses BOTH phrases.

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The phrase "day of Christ" occurs 3 times in 3 verses in the KJV.

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Philippians 1:10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ;

Philippians 2:16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.

2 Thessalonians 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

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The phrase "day of the Lord" occurs 25 times in 23 verses in the KJV.

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1 Corinthians 5:5 KJV
To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

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2 Corinthians 1:14 KJV
As also ye have acknowledged us in part, that we are your rejoicing, even as ye also are our's in the day of the Lord Jesus.

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Look at the 2 verses above ^^^^^^^^^

'day of the Lord Jesus'

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Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 07/26/2022 03:32 PM

This verse matches Matthew 24 and Revelation.

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the LORD will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 07/26/2022 03:33 PM

The pre-trib rapture is based on this passage by Paul.

1 Thessalonians 4

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

.........

Key phrase.

0. "we which are alive and remain"

It's clear that Paul expected to go THROUGH the Tribulation. He uses the word 'We' instead of 'those'. This is significant as it shows he was NOT epcecting to be 'taken away' BEFORE the Tribulation happened.

Those are Believers - including Elect - that weren't killed prior to Jesus' return. Remain from what? The Tribulation. These are the same that Jesus states 'he who overcomes' etc...

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 07/27/2022 11:55 PM

I HAVE Faith in Jesus.
God SENT Him to Earth.

When the Pre-Trib Rapture doesn't happen - WHAT will you tell thos folks who say you LIED? How many of them will say 'God isn't even real' or 'Jesus never existed' - it was all made up?

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 07/31/2022 01:05 AM

Bump

They are only 'contrasts' because you Pre-Tribber CLAIM so.

There are 3 'layers' of prophecy concerning the Coming of the Messiah / Second Coming.

1. Old Testament verses. These are 'basics'.

2. What Jesus says. This 'overlays' what the OT says.

3. What Revelation says. This overlays all previous prophecy.

4. Paul only has 'bits and pieces' of the entire story. Nothnig like Matthew 24 nor Revelation.

...


John 14:3 has to do with the future deaths of the Apostles / disciples. Stephen was one of them.

2 Thessalonians 2:1 - the 'gathering' - is the First Resurrection at the END of the Tribulation.

...


NO scripture differentiates the two events as being two 'seperate' events. Christ will 'come in the air' BEFORE He descends down to Earth.

...


NO verse show Christ taking the church / Believers TO Heaven.

Revelation 19 is the 'scene' in Heaven just BEFORE Jesus retruns to DO 1 Thessalonians 4 / the First Resurrection.

...


Believers don't get 'removed' pre-Trib. 1 Thessalonians 4 is AFTER the 'last trump' - and is the First Resurrection.

Malachi 4:2 is after 'the removal of the tares'.

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1 Thessalonians 4 says NOTHING about 'only Believers' - it says 'who are alive and remain'. That could very well include non-believers who hadn't been killed yet.

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So what? 2 different points on the Timeline.

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Believers aren't 'taken' anywhere - no scripture shows such.

Revelation 6 is Tribulation - NOT Wrath.

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Jesus returns to do that at the 'last trump'. Paul makes this clear. Jesus also uses the word 'trumpet'.

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Matthew 24:14 (ALL nations) is WHY there are Believers in 1 Thessalonians 4.

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

...


World is deceived to receive 'the Mark'. This is NOT the 'beginning of Tribulation'.

Satan is bound AFTER the Wrath.

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Believers meet Christ 'in the air'. NO verse says they are 'taken to Heaven'.

'Tares' are removed just before or just after.

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a. Unbelievers remain on earth.

b. Believers remain on earth (Matthew 25:34)
Believers not 'taken' ANYWHERE. NO verse states such.

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Jesus' Kingdom on Earth doesn't happen until His Second Coming. Revelation shows this as a 'new' / previously unknown feature - EXCEPT for Paul saying....

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

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Yes - Christians are taken to Heaven BEFORE Christ's Return. It's been going on for the last 2000 years.

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According to theologians - Christ's Return has been 'immenent' for 2000 years. It's not. Jesus clearly said He doesn't return until 'AFTER the Tribulation'.

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2 Thessalonians 2 - 'day of Christ' is the Second Coming.

And again - Rvelation 19 is the scene in Heave just before Christ's Second Coming.

You're version of 'truth' is a story / doctrine woven together by taking scripture out of context and making ASSumptions.

Show us where Jesus says he Returns more than once.

Show us where Jesus says He will take 'the church' to Heaven.

Show us the verse where Jesus or anyone says Believers will miss the Tribulation.

Show us the verse that says the Tribulation - which is a worldwide series of events - happens only to Israel.

You can't. Those supposed verses don't exist.

BINGO!!

you're obviously a spiritually dead soul. Seek Jesus and ask forgiveness for your satanic lies and he will forgive you.

Your false pre-trib rapture is part of the great falling away.

...

The study of scripture doesn't include making up 'stories' that support false doctrines.

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God,
a workman that needeth not to be ashamed,
rightly dividing the word of truth.

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given
by inspiration of God,
and is profitable for doctrine,
for reproof, for correction,
for instruction in righteousness:

...

Scripture is clear.

Thread: Fear Not - Endure Until the End - Post-Trib Rapture - KJV Bible Study

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Thread: After the Tribulation: Revisited - NO Pre-Trib Rapture - KJV Bible Study Christian Theology

Thread: Pre-Trib Rapture? How Does the Last Trump Happen BEFORE that? - KJV Bible Sutdy

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...

Satanic pre trib
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Its high time we put this satanic pre trib bullshit to an end! The easiest way to study prophecy is to isolate similar " words or phrases " from the bible and focus on them. Here is a good example:

Rev 20:5 and 20:6 both use the the phrase "first resurrection"

No where else in the entire bible is "first resurrection" quoted.....

Easy enough :}

By the way when something is repeated in the bible its very important and very rare. This particular phrase has it in back to back verses. Amazing! I wonder if there are anymore in the bible. It might be the only one....

So here we see a very important phrase, so what do we do with it.

Good question? Yes I'm getting there:}

The people in the first resurrection are those who have overcome the mark of the beast and had not worshipped the
beast so, they were there when the beast was given control!

Do you see it yet? Rev 20 read it...



These christians are so blessed and holy they get to be priests of God and Christ and will reign with him in the millenium.



No matter what happpens. The bible cleary states that very few people will be left. Just look it up!

Oh, and how about this.... these blessed and holy christians coming out of the trib are certainly not portrayed like this in the Left Behind series.

So here I am willing to overcome the mark and give my life for Christ and be part of his resurrection.


Im about to link this with the most popular rapture passage in the bible. Yes you know it......1 Thes 4:16 and wrap up this debate once and for all!

1 Thes 4:15 according to THE LORD'S OWN WORDS (this phrase is only found once in the bible)we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not preceed those who have fallen aseep...in other words..the RAPTURE takes place RIGHT AFTER the FIRST RESSURECTION..its there in black white and RED!

Do you see it? The rapture occurs immediately after the resurrection. Resurrection then Rapture!!!!

Remember .... Resurrection then Rapture

This is the most important issue in the bible concerning the timing of the rapture (pre, mid ,post) an unraveling it!


Its so important that it's repeated in 1 Thes 4:16!
" and the dead in Christ rise first "

Are not the saints from Rev 20 "the dead in Christ"

Well... are they. Certainly they are. they are Gods blessed people. They go first.... First resurrection>

I Thes 4:17 "After that we who are still alive and are left will be caught up, with them to meet the Lord in the air"


Is not this the rapture??. Do you see it?


Resurrection then rapture.

Oh, please try not to tell me that there is an earlier resurrection or a "before the first resurrection"
Other wise its not the "FIRST RESSURECTION" at all..but a second..or a third.

When the Lord said "this is the first resurrection " and repeated himself moments later "Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection" He knew exactly what he meant.

There is a second resurrection after the 1000 yrs

So there you have it rapture doesnt occur until Jesus returns AFTER the trib..... get ready... were in for the ride of a lifetime...

This is not just thoery... Its the Word of God
Dont let anyone deceive you, Jesus has a lot to say about false teachers in the end. Look it up. Use a concordance its easy.

Bless all who recieve this message with open hearts, for I believed in the pre trib rapture for 20 years until the Lord showed me otherwise.

You see you can't sell a pre or mid trib rapture, but you can sell a pre trib one. Just look on your shelf you might have one.......

As a matter of fact 240 million copies were sold

You know... The Left Behind Series... the largest selling book series in history.


A million dollar lie!

Satan is laughing all the way to the BANK!

Bump

Thread: The REAL QUESTION IS....why oh WHY ARE RAPTURE TARDS PUSHING THE VAX??

Thread: Revelation 11 - The Last Trump, Resurrection, Judgement, Reward - NO Pre-Trib Rapture

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Thread: Trumpet Then Resurrection - 4 "Witness" Verses / Passages - No Pre-Trib Rapture

Thread: Pre-Trib Rapture? How Does the Last Trump Happen BEFORE that? - KJV Bible Sutdy

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Bump