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Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!

 
Outis
User ID: 83935765
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09/22/2022 02:13 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Copperegla, there really are many levels in this book. From the human, or hobbit existence, to the semi-divine, or even divine.
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


Definitely. The dualities in particular are striking.

Gollum is to Frodo
as
Boromir is to Aragorn
as
Saruman is to Gandalf
as
Melkor is to Manwe
as
Sauron is to Aule

In each duality, the destruction of the dark side proves the valor of the light. This is the duality of kpr ("deny/atone").
 Quoting: Copperegla


Duality, Modality, Totality. Initials, DMT. Never tried it myself, but your pineal gland produces it naturally, at birth and at death, and in between if you are adept.

Light will win, even though the dark seems to be winning.

yoda
Copperegla

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09/22/2022 02:40 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Outis, is there a biblical character you think might match Bilbo?

Companion of dwarves (j-ws), even knows the head dwarf.

Went to certain death inside the Lonely Mountain but came out alive holding the greatest treasure of the dwarves, and also another treasure (Sauron's ring), while a son of man (Bard of Dale) slayed the dragon that would have surely devoured Bilbo.

Bilbo's relatives presumed he was dead, until he showed up alive. Sauron and company learn of Bilbo and desire to find and kill him, but Bilbo left his home for Rivendell.

Author of "There and Back Again".
Matthew 7:2 & 7:12 are a prophecy specific to you, "By the judgment that you judge, you will be judged. And by the measure that you measure, you will be measured.... Whatever you want a person to do to you, do also to them, for this is the law and the prophets."
Weisshaupt

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09/22/2022 02:42 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Search for the "Tolkien cut" of the Hobbit films - edited the 3 movies down to 4 hours that are far more faithful to the book.
Outis
User ID: 83935765
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09/22/2022 02:47 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Outis, is there a biblical character you think might match Bilbo?

Companion of dwarves (j-ws), even knows the head dwarf.

Went to certain death inside the Lonely Mountain but came out alive holding the greatest treasure of the dwarves, and also another treasure (Sauron's ring), while a son of man (Bard of Dale) slayed the dragon that would have surely devoured Bilbo.

Bilbo's relatives presumed he was dead, until he showed up alive. Sauron and company learn of Bilbo and desire to find and kill him, but Bilbo left his home for Rivendell.

Author of "There and Back Again".
 Quoting: Copperegla


I don't know. To me, Bilbo seems like a sort of Everyman, chosen to go on an adventure through the mediation of a wizard. Sort of like Job, perhaps, though he didn't receive sore boils from The Satan.
Nickel sized hail

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09/22/2022 02:47 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Prop up your hairy foots, load your pipe with the best old Toby you can find, pour a half pint and enjoy your day!!!!
Here’s a Happy Birthday toast to Bilbo and Frodo and all you that share this day!
And me! ohyeah smile_kiss dasbier
 Quoting: Fossy


Thanks for the reminder!! I've been laying around the shire and smoking my pipe. It's really strong smoke so I almost forgot it was hobbit day.
Outis
User ID: 83935765
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09/22/2022 03:01 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Prop up your hairy foots, load your pipe with the best old Toby you can find, pour a half pint and enjoy your day!!!!
Here’s a Happy Birthday toast to Bilbo and Frodo and all you that share this day!
And me! ohyeah smile_kiss dasbier
 Quoting: Fossy


Thanks for the reminder!! I've been laying around the shire and smoking my pipe. It's really strong smoke so I almost forgot it was hobbit day.
 Quoting: Nickel sized hail


Epic thread; welcome! There is much more here than just a discussion of Tolkien. Check out Copperegla...

Carry on, light will conquer darkness, just like in that great book.
Copperegla

User ID: 1229765
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09/22/2022 03:07 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Outis, is there a biblical character you think might match Bilbo?

Companion of dwarves (j-ws), even knows the head dwarf.

Went to certain death inside the Lonely Mountain but came out alive holding the greatest treasure of the dwarves, and also another treasure (Sauron's ring), while a son of man (Bard of Dale) slayed the dragon that would have surely devoured Bilbo.

Bilbo's relatives presumed he was dead, until he showed up alive. Sauron and company learn of Bilbo and desire to find and kill him, but Bilbo left his home for Rivendell.

Author of "There and Back Again".
 Quoting: Copperegla


I don't know. To me, Bilbo seems like a sort of Everyman, chosen to go on an adventure through the mediation of a wizard. Sort of like Job, perhaps, though he didn't receive sore boils from The Satan.
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


My theory is that Bilbo is like Lazarus.

Lazarus went into the mountain but was resurrected. He was probably the author of the fourth gospel (he's at least always been the runner-up choice, because of the statement in John 21 regarding the gospel author "a rumor went out among the brethren that this disciple would not die” - that only makes sense applied to Lazarus because he had already died once). Here's my write up in detail: [link to www.logicalhierarchy.com (secure)]

If Lazarus is the author of the fourth gospel, then it was Lazarus with Mary at the cross who received the Messiah's words, "Woman, behold your son. Behold your mother." This language was literally in Hebrew law the same language used to convey inheritance (last will and testament). The greatest treasure of the J-ws was their assembly/synagogue/temple/priesthood.

Yeshua appointed Lazarus the new head priest, in a sense. Or the first bishop if you prefer.

If Lazarus was being hunted by the ruling class who wanted to kill him (as the gospel states) and Lazarus fled Jerusalem, would he change his name (i.e., to John)? Did he become the bishop of Ephesus, the first church in Revelation?

These are mysteries, but the above paper provides evidence to explore the possibilities.

Last Edited by Copperegla on 09/22/2022 03:10 PM
Matthew 7:2 & 7:12 are a prophecy specific to you, "By the judgment that you judge, you will be judged. And by the measure that you measure, you will be measured.... Whatever you want a person to do to you, do also to them, for this is the law and the prophets."
An Uncarved Block

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09/22/2022 03:16 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Anyone here remember the original Hobbit cartoon movie?


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Forget the red or the blue pill. Take the Gold Elixir.

“How can there be a God, when there is nothing but God.” - Laozi


“Naturalness is called the Way. The Way has no name or form; it is just essence, just the primal spirit.” - The Secret of the Golden Flower.
Outis
User ID: 83935765
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09/22/2022 03:20 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Outis, is there a biblical character you think might match Bilbo?

Companion of dwarves (j-ws), even knows the head dwarf.

Went to certain death inside the Lonely Mountain but came out alive holding the greatest treasure of the dwarves, and also another treasure (Sauron's ring), while a son of man (Bard of Dale) slayed the dragon that would have surely devoured Bilbo.

Bilbo's relatives presumed he was dead, until he showed up alive. Sauron and company learn of Bilbo and desire to find and kill him, but Bilbo left his home for Rivendell.

Author of "There and Back Again".
 Quoting: Copperegla


I don't know. To me, Bilbo seems like a sort of Everyman, chosen to go on an adventure through the mediation of a wizard. Sort of like Job, perhaps, though he didn't receive sore boils from The Satan.
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


My theory is that Bilbo is like Lazarus.

Lazarus went into the mountain but was resurrected. He was probably the author of the fourth gospel (he's at least always been the runner-up choice, because of the statement in John 21 that the gospel author would not die - that only makes sense applied to Lazarus because he had already died once). Here's my write up in detail: [link to www.logicalhierarchy.com (secure)]

If Lazarus is the author of the fourth gospel, then it was Lazarus with Mary at the cross who received the Messiah's words, "Woman, behold your son. Behold your mother." This language was literally in Hebrew law the same language used to convey inheritance (last will and testament). The greatest treasure of the J-ws was their assembly/synagogue/temple/priesthood.

Yeshua appointed Lazarus the new head priest, in a sense. Or the first bishop if you prefer.

If Lazarus was being hunted by the ruling class who wanted to kill him (as the gospel states) and Lazarus fled Jerusalem, would he change his name (i.e., to John)? Did he become the bishop of Ephesus, the first church in Revelation?

These are mysteries, but the above paper provides evidence to explore the possibilities.
 Quoting: Copperegla


Though I like your analysis, I don't agree that Bilbo was Lazarus. He was not dead or resurrected. He was a happy,wealthy hobbit before he went on that adventure, and found (stole) "The Precious."
Copperegla

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09/22/2022 05:09 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Though I like your analysis, I don't agree that Bilbo was Lazarus. He was not dead or resurrected. He was a happy, wealthy hobbit before he went on that adventure, and found (stole) "The Precious."
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


Such a cool mystery! I love discussing middle earth and all the fun possible interpretations.

Leviticus 16:2 (priest enters the temple alone to find the "ark"); Hobbit (Bilbo enters lone mountain to find "arkenstone")

Leviticus 16:3 (bifur); Hobbit (dwarf named bifur)

Leviticus 16:14 (blood on finger); LOTR (ring on finger)

Leviticus 16:21 (aiunth); Silmarillions (ainur)

There is so much to discover and think about. Did you pick up on the duality between Sauron and Aule?

Sauron was 2nd in command after Melkor, just like Aule was 2nd in command (in a sense) after Manwe. Sauron was known for his handicraft (especially making the rings) and teaching the elves. Aule also was known for his handicraft and teaching the dwarves.

In an interview, Tolkien likened the ring to "the machine" in the general sense. Modern j-ws (in particular the kabbalists) liken their spiritual power to technology -- they literally call it "internal technology".

And here we are on the cusp of transhumanism, a time where Tolkien has never been more relevant. It's like Orwell or Huxley. They wrote decades ago for times such as these.
Matthew 7:2 & 7:12 are a prophecy specific to you, "By the judgment that you judge, you will be judged. And by the measure that you measure, you will be measured.... Whatever you want a person to do to you, do also to them, for this is the law and the prophets."
Fossy  (OP)
Pura Sangre Dragonborn

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09/22/2022 06:07 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Answer me this, Copperegla; who is Judas in LOTR? I'm thinking Saruman, but you probably have a better answer.

...or possibly Boromir...

 Quoting: Outis 83935765


It cannot be Saruman because he represents a fallen angel, just like Gandalf represents a good angel.

I think Boromir is correct for Judas. In the original language, Judas was called Yehuda.

Like an apostle (sent on a mission), Boromir was chosen to be in the small company of Aragorn (Yeshua). Boromir's family (Yehuda) held stewardship over Gondor (Israel). Boromir wanted to seize the ring (Judas held the purse, and sold out in the end for 30 pieces of silver), and though Boromir repented (as Judas did) he still died cruelly by wooden arrows (Judas suicide on a tree).

Faramir, the brother of Boromir (Yehuda), valiantly accepted Aragorn (Yeshua) as the rightful king of Gondor. Faramir's father Denethor (representing the greater tribe ruling Yehuda) rejected Aragorn as king. Indeed, this makes Denethor like Herod.
 Quoting: Copperegla


My fav characters in all the books are, Lord Fingolfin, Lord Faramir and Sameise Gamgee.

I am loving your commentary!!!!! hugs what a wonderful birthday present!

Last Edited by Fossy on 09/22/2022 06:09 PM
There is only one way to avoid criticism: do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing

My Skyrim fanfic... NSFW because of the sex.
[link to archiveofourown.org (secure)]
Anonymous Coward
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09/22/2022 06:24 PM
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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Answer me this, Copperegla; who is Judas in LOTR? I'm thinking Saruman, but you probably have a better answer.

...or possibly Boromir...

 Quoting: Outis 83935765


It cannot be Saruman because he represents a fallen angel, just like Gandalf represents a good angel.

I think Boromir is correct for Judas. In the original language, Judas was called Yehuda.

Like an apostle (sent on a mission), Boromir was chosen to be in the small company of Aragorn (Yeshua). Boromir's family (Yehuda) held stewardship over Gondor (Israel). Boromir wanted to seize the ring (Judas held the purse, and sold out in the end for 30 pieces of silver), and though Boromir repented (as Judas did) he still died cruelly by wooden arrows (Judas suicide on a tree).

Faramir, the brother of Boromir (Yehuda), valiantly accepted Aragorn (Yeshua) as the rightful king of Gondor. Faramir's father Denethor (representing the greater tribe ruling Yehuda) rejected Aragorn as king. Indeed, this makes Denethor like Herod.
 Quoting: Copperegla


My fav characters in all the books are, Lord Fingolfin, Lord Faramir and Sameise Gamgee.

I am loving your commentary!!!!! hugs what a wonderful birthday present!
 Quoting: Fossy


It’s your birthday? If so, happy birthday!
St Tidbits the Odd

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09/22/2022 06:55 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Copperegla, there really are many levels in this book. From the human, or hobbit existence, to the semi-divine, or even divine.
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


Definitely. The dualities in particular are striking.

Gollum is to Frodo
as
Boromir is to Aragorn
as
Saruman is to Gandalf
as
Melkor is to Manwe
as
Sauron is to Aule

In each duality, the destruction of the dark side proves the valor of the light. This is the duality of kpr ("deny/atone").
 Quoting: Copperegla


Duality, Modality, Totality. Initials, DMT. Never tried it myself, but your pineal gland produces it naturally, at birth and at death, and in between if you are adept.

Light will win, even though the dark seems to be winning.

yoda
 Quoting: Outis 83935765


bump
This is the way the world ends… not with a bang… but with a physics lesson: the lonesome sound of Schroedinger’s cat’s meow.
Kuntsler
St Tidbits the Odd

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09/22/2022 06:58 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Answer me this, Copperegla; who is Judas in LOTR? I'm thinking Saruman, but you probably have a better answer.

...or possibly Boromir...

 Quoting: Outis 83935765


It cannot be Saruman because he represents a fallen angel, just like Gandalf represents a good angel.

I think Boromir is correct for Judas. In the original language, Judas was called Yehuda.

Like an apostle (sent on a mission), Boromir was chosen to be in the small company of Aragorn (Yeshua). Boromir's family (Yehuda) held stewardship over Gondor (Israel). Boromir wanted to seize the ring (Judas held the purse, and sold out in the end for 30 pieces of silver), and though Boromir repented (as Judas did) he still died cruelly by wooden arrows (Judas suicide on a tree).

Faramir, the brother of Boromir (Yehuda), valiantly accepted Aragorn (Yeshua) as the rightful king of Gondor. Faramir's father Denethor (representing the greater tribe ruling Yehuda) rejected Aragorn as king. Indeed, this makes Denethor like Herod.
 Quoting: Copperegla


My fav characters in all the books are, Lord Fingolfin, Lord Faramir and Sameise Gamgee.

I am loving your commentary!!!!! hugs what a wonderful birthday present!
 Quoting: Fossy


It’s your birthday? If so, happy birthday!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77197098



This is the way the world ends… not with a bang… but with a physics lesson: the lonesome sound of Schroedinger’s cat’s meow.
Kuntsler
Marco Israel

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09/22/2022 10:10 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
[link to youtu.be (secure)]

Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared.
Fossy  (OP)
Pura Sangre Dragonborn

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09/23/2022 08:13 AM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
Answer me this, Copperegla; who is Judas in LOTR? I'm thinking Saruman, but you probably have a better answer.

...or possibly Boromir...

 Quoting: Outis 83935765


It cannot be Saruman because he represents a fallen angel, just like Gandalf represents a good angel.

I think Boromir is correct for Judas. In the original language, Judas was called Yehuda.

Like an apostle (sent on a mission), Boromir was chosen to be in the small company of Aragorn (Yeshua). Boromir's family (Yehuda) held stewardship over Gondor (Israel). Boromir wanted to seize the ring (Judas held the purse, and sold out in the end for 30 pieces of silver), and though Boromir repented (as Judas did) he still died cruelly by wooden arrows (Judas suicide on a tree).

Faramir, the brother of Boromir (Yehuda), valiantly accepted Aragorn (Yeshua) as the rightful king of Gondor. Faramir's father Denethor (representing the greater tribe ruling Yehuda) rejected Aragorn as king. Indeed, this makes Denethor like Herod.
 Quoting: Copperegla


My fav characters in all the books are, Lord Fingolfin, Lord Faramir and Sameise Gamgee.

I am loving your commentary!!!!! hugs what a wonderful birthday present!
 Quoting: Fossy


It’s your birthday? If so, happy birthday!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77197098


Thank you! hf
There is only one way to avoid criticism: do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing

My Skyrim fanfic... NSFW because of the sex.
[link to archiveofourown.org (secure)]
Fossy  (OP)
Pura Sangre Dragonborn

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09/23/2022 08:15 AM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
...


It cannot be Saruman because he represents a fallen angel, just like Gandalf represents a good angel.

I think Boromir is correct for Judas. In the original language, Judas was called Yehuda.

Like an apostle (sent on a mission), Boromir was chosen to be in the small company of Aragorn (Yeshua). Boromir's family (Yehuda) held stewardship over Gondor (Israel). Boromir wanted to seize the ring (Judas held the purse, and sold out in the end for 30 pieces of silver), and though Boromir repented (as Judas did) he still died cruelly by wooden arrows (Judas suicide on a tree).

Faramir, the brother of Boromir (Yehuda), valiantly accepted Aragorn (Yeshua) as the rightful king of Gondor. Faramir's father Denethor (representing the greater tribe ruling Yehuda) rejected Aragorn as king. Indeed, this makes Denethor like Herod.
 Quoting: Copperegla


My fav characters in all the books are, Lord Fingolfin, Lord Faramir and Sameise Gamgee.

I am loving your commentary!!!!! hugs what a wonderful birthday present!
 Quoting: Fossy


It’s your birthday? If so, happy birthday!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77197098



 Quoting: St Tidbits the Odd

I love it! Thank you! hf
There is only one way to avoid criticism: do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing

My Skyrim fanfic... NSFW because of the sex.
[link to archiveofourown.org (secure)]
Marco Israel

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09/23/2022 01:39 PM

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Re: Happy Hobbit Day Everyone!
I copied a link to the wrong video last night, but decided to let it ride.

Happy Birthday to you and defcat and anyone else that shares that birth day.

[link to youtu.be (secure)]

Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared.





GLP