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credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior

 
tomorrow
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User ID: 591566
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01/28/2009 01:00 PM
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credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Ok, this crosses the line! If you shop where other people do, and THEY don't pay their bills, YOUR credit is affected!

[link to abcnews.go.com]

"Other customers who have used their card at establishments where you recently shopped have a poor repayment history with American Express."

This is wrong and offensive on so many levels.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:03 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
this is why i say that these mega-corporations and banks are socialist
they act just like any other socialist organization does
Own a home?
User ID: 602295
United States
01/28/2009 01:05 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
I would say its bad for the housing market.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:07 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
it's enforced segregation
where the poor are left to rot in substandard conditions
and the rich live across the tracks
in the garden like utopia
this is what we had escaped from
and now they are trying to enforce it's return
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602849
United States
01/28/2009 01:08 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
That's some fucked up shit! Glad I've never gone down the credit road... Watch out people!
S.

User ID: 572425
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01/28/2009 01:12 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Yes, and when they lower your credit score after reducing your credit line due to the behavior of those who do not pay their bills and shop at Wally World, then they have put you in the same category as those who don't pay their bills, even if YOU DO!

It is insane!

The world has turned into Bizzaro World!
No matter how many cookies you consult, you will find that love is our greatest fortune. ~ Leigh Standley
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:14 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
maybe they are trying to drive walmart out of business?
wozza.xing
User ID: 555093
United States
01/28/2009 01:16 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
customer profiling advancement, personality/sociology algorithms base on simple neural networks are really quite simple and powerful. There are loads of them in the next Microsoft OS7. Even most supermarkets use them now. They wont even deny it, if you ask their managers, they say "for sure, we'd be crazy not too!"
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
United States
01/28/2009 01:22 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
customer profiling advancement, personality/sociology algorithms base on simple neural networks are really quite simple and powerful. There are loads of them in the next Microsoft OS7. Even most supermarkets use them now. They wont even deny it, if you ask their managers, they say "for sure, we'd be crazy not too!"
 Quoting: wozza.xing 555093


Grocery stores I can understand, but to take actions that will affect MY credit rating based on my neighbors or other lazy slobs who shop at certain places and then fail to pay their bill is WRONG!

The corporate shaft knows no bounds.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:24 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
customer profiling advancement, personality/sociology algorithms base on simple neural networks are really quite simple and powerful. There are loads of them in the next Microsoft OS7. Even most supermarkets use them now. They wont even deny it, if you ask their managers, they say "for sure, we'd be crazy not too!"
 Quoting: wozza.xing 555093

well, it may be time to use old fashioned flea markets and farmer's markets
if we don't enable them
they'll be left in the cold
personally, i wouldn't enable this type of utilitarian business by spending my money there
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 566686
United States
01/28/2009 01:28 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Learn to live within your means. If you can't pay for it up front, you probably shouldn't be buying it. With the exception of a house or vehicle.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:28 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Learn to live within your means. If you can't pay for it up front, you probably shouldn't be buying it. With the exception of a house or vehicle.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 566686

and why should we support companies which mistreat others?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 276706
United Kingdom
01/28/2009 01:40 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
I don't know what you are complaining about OP. There is a very very simple soloution.... Don't have a credit card. If you don't have money then don't buy on credit. Sheesh.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602367
United States
01/28/2009 01:41 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
I don't know what you are complaining about OP. There is a very very simple soloution.... Don't have a credit card. If you don't have money then don't buy on credit. Sheesh.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 276706

and don't support companies which practice social engineering with the profits you give them
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 276706
United Kingdom
01/28/2009 01:45 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
You all act as if credit is your right. Do you know what a credit card is? Its simple begging and borrowing for money.

I was having lunch with a bunch of friends and one by one they were boasting about having Gold cards and platinum cards etc. They asked me and i said "I don't have any. I am not poor. I don't beg. I don't need to borrow money off anyone. I don't need to borrow from loan sharks and then pay them back with hight interest". Those idiots were actually boasting about which one of them had a better credit not realising that the loan sharks simply give them the gold card because they are the most idiot of them all, because they spend and borrow more.
Your scociety got it all wrong. What a laugh.
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
United States
01/28/2009 01:54 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
I don't know what you are complaining about OP. There is a very very simple soloution.... Don't have a credit card. If you don't have money then don't buy on credit. Sheesh.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 276706


I have ethics, that's why I think its wrong. I was raised to believe that people should be responsible for their actions. This makes me responsible for other people's actions. We do not have control over the actions of others, only ourselves.

If I want to have a credit card, I will. It is none of your business. That stupid and short sighted response does not address the fact that these companies are predators. They can chew up and spit out the slugs, but I am not one and do not deserve it.

There is no theoretical or legitimate basis for credit card companies doing this. NONE whatsoever.

An individual's credit score should be based on that particular individual's behavior. Not that of a neighbor or someone who shops at the same place. That isn't even guilt by association. It's assassination by association and can cause MATERIAL HARM to a person for no legitimate reason.
Is45

User ID: 582310
United States
01/28/2009 01:54 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Someone had posted on another forum
that this had happened to him... his cc
was canceled not because of anything
he did, but because he had used it at
the same places deadbeats frequented.

wtf


Can we get a copy of the blacklist ??


~
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Beyond, There Be Dragons
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Is45

User ID: 582310
United States
01/28/2009 01:56 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
maybe they are trying to drive walmart out of business?

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 602367



American Express just had a promotion with Wal-Mart...
if you used your AMX card twice at Wal-Mart for at
least $40 each between certain dates, AMX would credit
your account $20... I'm still waiting for my $20 credit.



~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beyond, There Be Dragons
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Philly Girl
User ID: 541429
United States
01/28/2009 01:57 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
I don't know what you are complaining about OP. There is a very very simple soloution.... Don't have a credit card. If you don't have money then don't buy on credit. Sheesh.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 276706

So, at the very least you're telling the OP - that shouldn't strive to eventually own a modest home because of his neighbors? Have you read what he was saying?

Also many jobs use your credit rating now to make hiring decisions, also many car insurance companies base their fees on credit ratings, same thing with many hospitals - treatment for non-life threatening situations (meaning you aren't going to die THAT moment) is based on that score as well. If you don't have insurance, and you don't have a stellar rating, you may be sitting in that emergency room waiting for them to cast your broken leg, for quite awhile.

I had to get a credit card and build my credit to bring down my car insurance rates (even though I had a spotless driving record for DECADES), I worked hard, paid my bills on time (actually didn't use it as credit - paid it off each month), brought my credit score up to what is even now considered a good rating, bu since I just became unemployed that rating will drop,, making it harder for me to get a new job in this already hard time - though someone who has claimed bankruptcy and has had their debts wiped out (not paid) get better ratings and therefore have a better chance of getting that job, or that apartment, or that medical treatment.

So I guess since you never used any credit at all you think this "Housing/Credit" fueled Depression won't affect you and that this is right? What meds are you on?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 593488
United States
01/28/2009 01:59 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
FUBAR
Philly Girl
User ID: 541429
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01/28/2009 01:59 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
This will also make it more difficult for the average person to start a new business or company. Imagine where we'd be right now if people like Bill Gates and Steve Jobs were denied business credit because their neighbors didn't pay their bills in a timely fashion.

You really need to step back from the painting and view it in it's entirety.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602842
United States
01/28/2009 02:03 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
We have a choice usualy about using credit.What burns me is what insurance gets away with.They charge you more if you are the wrong age,gender,live in the wrong neighborhood,or even charge you based on credit history.Credit history is often wrong BTW.I can understand them doing this to a point,but if you are going to charge someone more than they should be entitled to get most of the money refunded if they have shown to be responsible from their driving history otherwise they are just stealing and the government is forcing us to do business with people that steal..As for the credit agencies I know from personal experience they are not held accountable.They never kept any record of my history except when Blue Cross did not pay a medical bill after making the cancellation of the insurance retroactive.They also did not send my credit report after I was turned down for credit.They instead requested more proff of address than I could provide because all my utilities were included with rent.They should work with consumers to ensure that they have accurate redords but they never did so there reports are not a very good way to judge risk.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 276706
United Kingdom
01/28/2009 02:08 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
If I want to have a credit card, I will. It is none of your business. That stupid and short sighted response does not address the fact that these companies are predators. They can chew up and spit out the slugs, but I am not one and do not deserve it.

 Quoting: tomorrow

It is exactly because you all went along with this system that you are in this mess today. You act as if this whole thing was forced upon you to start with. If you get in with the wrong crowd then you must not complain when you end up in trouble.
Take this example:
When likes of Walmart came along everyone abbandoned the small shop keeper and shopped in Walmart because they were a few cents cheaper. Then the small guy went out of business. Within 2 years Walmart will be doing a similar thing as the credit card company is doing now. Will you then moan and groan about what Walmart should do?
Who is to blame in all this saga?
If majority of us stopped using credit cards and took in a little bit of pressure and still stood by it, everything will change. We will go back to the natural life we had before these sharks came along.
You really act as if you and likes of you are not responsible for the country you live in.
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
United States
01/28/2009 02:09 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Thanks Philly Girl! These days one has to have at least one credit card or nobody will take you seriously. It makes it more difficult to get a car loan, etc. and eventually a mortgage.

I had my first when I was 16. It had a $100 limit at a local department store and a $25 monthly minimum payment. Later, I worked for that company in their credit division and then in bad debt (NEVER as a collector). It was the experience of a lifetime.

If I did not have a good credit history, I never would have been able to get a very, very modest mortgage for a small condo that is within my means.

p.s. not all posters are male. When in doubt s/he works.

LOL! back to bashing the creditors.
just say so
User ID: 430839
Spain
01/28/2009 02:11 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
don't you like our humor?
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
United States
01/28/2009 02:14 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
If I want to have a credit card, I will. It is none of your business. That stupid and short sighted response does not address the fact that these companies are predators. They can chew up and spit out the slugs, but I am not one and do not deserve it.


It is exactly because you all went along with this system that you are in this mess today. You act as if this whole thing was forced upon you to start with. If you get in with the wrong crowd then you must not complain when you end up in trouble.
Take this example:
When likes of Walmart came along everyone abbandoned the small shop keeper and shopped in Walmart because they were a few cents cheaper. Then the small guy went out of business. Within 2 years Walmart will be doing a similar thing as the credit card company is doing now. Will you then moan and groan about what Walmart should do?
Who is to blame in all this saga?
If majority of us stopped using credit cards and took in a little bit of pressure and still stood by it, everything will change. We will go back to the natural life we had before these sharks came along.
You really act as if you and likes of you are not responsible for the country you live in.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 276706



Ok, you are being quite presumptuous and pompous. I am not "in trouble" and you know nothing about me. I posted that story because I think what they are doing is ethically and morally wrong. A point that you seem to have intentionally ignored.

I do not shop at walmart, never have, never will. They are also predators.

I spend as much $ locally as I can. Last time I checked, mom and pop took credit as well. I don't eat or shop at chains, except Target and for groceries.

Who is to blame? American Express, Citibank, Bank of America, you name it. If they issue credit, they bear a certain amount of burden for pushing credit onto people that they KNOW will not and cannot pay it back. The debtors are also responsible for being shallow, greedy and living beyond their means.

My credit rating is something like 750. What is yours? Wait, you don't have credit.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 602842
United States
01/28/2009 02:19 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
This is how it should work.First of all if the guy did not have a history of late payments than they should not have lowered his limit like they did.Secondly a person could pay a deposit based on risk.They should do this for credit and car insurance.Everone should have an opportunity to establish credit.They never did that with me,even after I paid 17 percent interest(a month) at a buy here pay here place.There are no sane guidelines .They let people go crazy buyoing shit for a lot of years and sometimes it catches up with people.it is the guy trying to establish credit that usualy gets mistreated the worst.maybe they have figured this out and are trying to find a way of correcting this.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 276706
United Kingdom
01/28/2009 02:24 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Ok, you are being quite presumptuous and pompous. I am not "in trouble" and you know nothing about me. I posted that story because I think what they are doing is ethically and morally wrong. A point that you seem to have intentionally ignored.

I do not shop at walmart, never have, never will. They are also predators.

I spend as much $ locally as I can. Last time I checked, mom and pop took credit as well. I don't eat or shop at chains, except Target and for groceries.

Who is to blame? American Express, Citibank, Bank of America, you name it. If they issue credit, they bear a certain amount of burden for pushing credit onto people that they KNOW will not and cannot pay it back. The debtors are also responsible for being shallow, greedy and living beyond their means.

My credit rating is something like 750. What is yours? Wait, you don't have credit.
 Quoting: tomorrow

Wait, I think you are taking this personally. I am not refering to you personally. When i said you, I meant you as a society that relies so much on credit card (which includes you as well).
I also think you did not understand the WalMart issue. I am refering to all the big companies and Walmart was an example. Did you not read the post?

No, I don't have credit card and have not had any problems so far. I buy on Ebay as well as on the net but always pay directly.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 276706
United Kingdom
01/28/2009 02:33 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Do any of you realise how the credit calculations work?
You will not have good credit if you pay before you are charged interest.
You will not have good credit if you spend little and pay on time.
You will not have good credit if you buy but do not pay AT ALL.

You will have excellent credit if you spend much but not be able to pay in time, thus start paying interest.
You will have excellent credit if you spend and then always fall behind in payment (accumilating more interest) but somehow always just manage to pay them their interest and still carry on spending more.

CC companies do not want someone who uses their money and then pay the money back in time. What is the point?
Heroin dealers do not want someone who buys a little coke from them for an occasional party but never gets hooked or addicted. What is the point?

You guys must understand that these companies are not there to serve you. They are loan sharks and they are there to milk you and abuse you.
So, how can you keep going back to them and then complain when they try to milk you even further.
In my book you deserve what you get.
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
United States
01/28/2009 02:53 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
Ok, you are being quite presumptuous and pompous. I am not "in trouble" and you know nothing about me. I posted that story because I think what they are doing is ethically and morally wrong. A point that you seem to have intentionally ignored.

I do not shop at walmart, never have, never will. They are also predators.

I spend as much $ locally as I can. Last time I checked, mom and pop took credit as well. I don't eat or shop at chains, except Target and for groceries.

Who is to blame? American Express, Citibank, Bank of America, you name it. If they issue credit, they bear a certain amount of burden for pushing credit onto people that they KNOW will not and cannot pay it back. The debtors are also responsible for being shallow, greedy and living beyond their means.

My credit rating is something like 750. What is yours? Wait, you don't have credit.

Wait, I think you are taking this personally. I am not refering to you personally. When i said you, I meant you as a society that relies so much on credit card (which includes you as well).
I also think you did not understand the WalMart issue. I am refering to all the big companies and Walmart was an example. Did you not read the post?

No, I don't have credit card and have not had any problems so far. I buy on Ebay as well as on the net but always pay directly.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 276706


Yes, of course I did. In the future, I would suggest using phrases like "people in general" or "the euphemistic you" rather than your choice of words: straight up "you" looks like you're picking a fight, or a shill.

Back to bashing the creditors! And the defaulters who are killing us good people!

Onward and upward.
tomorrow  (OP)

User ID: 591566
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01/28/2009 09:33 PM
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Re: credit cards now using "behavior scoring" but not necessarily YOUR behavior
bump

For the late crowd.

The link is somewhat more interesting than the thread.





GLP