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{BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided

 
Witness_
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01/13/2010 04:51 PM
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{BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
[link to www.newscientist.com]

A major Antarctic glacier has passed its tipping point, according to a new modelling study. After losing increasing amounts of ice over the past decades, it is poised to collapse in a catastrophe that could raise global sea levels by 24 centimetres.

Pine Island glacier (PIG) is one of many at the fringes of the West Antarctic ice sheet. In 2004, satellite observations showed that it had started to thin, and that ice was flowing into the Amundsen Sea 25 per cent faster than it had 30 years before.

Now, the first study to model changes in the ice sheet in three dimensions shows that PIG has probably passed a critical "tipping point" and is irreversibly on track to lose 50 per cent of its ice in as little as 100 years, significantly raising global sea levels.

The team that carried out the study admits their model can represent only a simplified version of the physics that govern changes in glaciers, but say that if anything, the model is optimistic and PIG will disappear faster than it projects.

Richard Katz of the University of Oxford and colleagues developed the model to explore whether the retreat of the "grounding line" the undersea junction at which a floating ice shelf becomes an ice sheet grounded on the sea bed could cause ice sheets to collapse.
Warm seas

Climate change is warming the Amundsen Sea, which is at the southern margin of the Pacific Ocean. As rising sea levels push the warm water beneath the ice shelves, it melts them from below, pushing the grounding line higher up the continental shelf.

By raising sea levels, and therefore the grounding line, in their model, Katz's team were able to find the point of no return beyond which the glacier would be unable to recover. That's because the Antarctic sea bed has a small lip in it: it rises slowly up the continental shelf, then makes a slight dip before rising again to the shoreline. The researchers found that as long as the grounding line is on the outer rise of the sea bed, before the lip, small changes in climate lead to correspondingly small changes in the glacier's ice volume.

But as soon as the grounding line moves over the lip and starts to move down into the dip in the sea bed, the situation changes critically. "Once the grounding line passes the crest, a small change in the climate causes a rapid and irreversible loss of ice," says Katz.
Past the point of no return

According to Katz's model, the grounding line probably passed over the crest in 1996 and is now poised to enter a period of accelerated shrinking.

The model suggests that within 100 years, PIG's grounding line could have retreated over 200 kilometres. "Before the retreating grounding line comes to a rest at some unknown point on the inner slope, PIG will have lost 50 per cent of its ice, contributing 24 centimetres to global sea levels," says Richard Hindmarsh of the British Antarctic Survey, who did not participate in the study.

This assumes that the grounding line does eventually stabilise, after much of PIG is gone. In reality, PIG could disappear entirely, says Hindmarsh. "If Thwaite's glacier, which sits alongside PIG, also retreats, PIG's grounding line could retreat even further back to a second crest, causing sea levels to rise by 52 centimetres." The model suggests Thwaite's glacier has also passed its tipping point.

Observations already show that the model severely underestimates the rate at which PIG's grounding line is retreating, says Katz. "Ours is a simple model of an ice sheet that neglects some important physics," says Katz. "The take-home message is that we should be concerned about tipping points in West Antarctica and we should do a lot more work to investigate," he says.

Last Edited by Witness_ on 01/13/2010 04:52 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
bsflag
Anonymous Coward
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
BS!


Why?


Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:56 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 862312



No. It's called the Archimedes Principle aka bouyancy.
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:56 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Well the way I see it is this.

If its a massive glacier on land melting its normal. If its a massive glacier floating in the sea and its melting it will have no effect whasoever.

1.Ice in a glass add water let it melt
then
2.Add water to glass then add ice let it melt

what happens on each occasion?
Anonymous Coward
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Does melting an ice cube held out frozen to the side of the glass just above water level raise the water level of the glass?!

Yes.
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:56 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Does melting an ice cube held out frozen to the side of the glass just above water level raise the water level of the glass?!

Yes.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 863767


The inside, but just above water level.
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:57 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
BS!


Why?


Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 862312



Is this glacier on land?

Oh and don't sweat it we're in the mini ice age now so problem solved.
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:57 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 862312


ummmm....

no?
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01/13/2010 04:58 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Witless should be telling us that global warming caused the Haitian earthquake.
Anonymous Coward
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01/13/2010 04:59 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
The ice at the south pole is not in the sea or drifting on it .. it is on land so melting will influence sea levels.

But far worse and this is something to think about.

The mass of ice at the south pole, if melted may disturbe the weight distribution of the earth and this may influence the plane of rotation.
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01/13/2010 05:02 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
BS!


Why?


Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 862312


PIG is only 10% of the WAIS
Rev. Spiralgazer

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01/13/2010 05:03 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Found a vid of the OP



"Imagination is more important than knowledge" - Albert Einstein

revstargazer (at) hotmail.com
Anonymous Coward
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
The ice at the south pole is not in the sea or drifting on it .. it is on land so melting will influence sea levels.

But far worse and this is something to think about.

The mass of ice at the south pole, if melted may disturbe the weight distribution of the earth and this may influence the plane of rotation.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 331367

Dang, you are right. Got confused north pole south pole...


Ok, OP. You have a point.

Apologies. So, who volunteers for panic sex?
Witness_  (OP)

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01/14/2010 02:25 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
BS!


Why?


Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?



Is this glacier on land?

Oh and don't sweat it we're in the mini ice age now so problem solved.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 863144


Here's the clue: Antarctic
Witness_  (OP)

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01/14/2010 02:26 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
The ice at the south pole is not in the sea or drifting on it .. it is on land so melting will influence sea levels.

But far worse and this is something to think about.

The mass of ice at the south pole, if melted may disturbe the weight distribution of the earth and this may influence the plane of rotation.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 331367


They don't say whether this is in threat of sliding into the ocean. But if something that size did, tsunami on a massive scale!
Anonymous Coward
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01/14/2010 02:28 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
bsflag

New Scientist is in bed with the global warming movement
Apocalypse TrollModerator
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01/14/2010 02:30 PM

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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Pardon me, but are these "measurements" the "real" ones?

Or are they part of the elaborate grant-grab orchestrated by self-deluding scientists in an attempt to justify their phony-baloney jobs?

I want independent verification by a self-supporting organization or it is all just a bunch of bullshit.

Edit to add: Catastrophe easily avoided by the current and ongoing dropping of temps.

Last Edited by Apocalypse Troll on 01/14/2010 02:32 PM
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01/14/2010 02:34 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
I thought the Polar bears were pushing this in the ocean. They can swim 80 miles ata time.
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01/14/2010 08:25 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Pardon me, but are these "measurements" the "real" ones?

Or are they part of the elaborate grant-grab orchestrated by self-deluding scientists in an attempt to justify their phony-baloney jobs?

I want independent verification by a self-supporting organization or it is all just a bunch of bullshit.

Edit to add: Catastrophe easily avoided by the current and ongoing dropping of temps.
 Quoting: Apocalypse Troll



They only used the "value added" data in the prediction...
Anonymous Coward
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01/14/2010 08:45 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
So what. I don't care.
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01/14/2010 08:59 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
In 100 years?

Not my problem. Its your kids problem. So I just can't manage to care about 9 1/2 inches of more sea water.
Sinkhole list:
Thread: Sinkholes Updated 28 Dec 2010
find a sinkhole, add it to this thread, please.

"Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 3:15, NKJV).
Anonymous Coward
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01/14/2010 09:03 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
John Moore spoke of this and said the introduction of fresh water in the oceans will shut down the conveyor belt in the Atlantic and bring "day after tomorrow" like conditions.
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01/14/2010 09:06 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
More FCL - Fucking Climate Lies.

Its the CRU trying to get back up after getting clotheslined.

Go lie to someone who will believe you. You FCL's are all a bunch of greed mongers in bed with the NWO/Illuminati/Global Elites. Get your grants with some other lie. These won't work anymore. You're just too stupid to realize it. Start working on cold fusion again.
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01/14/2010 09:07 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
Does a melting ice cube in a longdrink raises the level in the glass?



No. It's called the Archimedes Principle aka bouyancy.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 863742

dumb ass if the ice cube is sitting on land mass yes it would!
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01/14/2010 09:13 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
For science to say something - it must make a valid prediction, testing the prediction must be repeatable, and the results must be refutable.

Climate Change quacks are no longer practicing science, but ideological purity tests.
Anonymous Coward
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01/14/2010 09:14 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
For science to say something - it must make a valid prediction, testing the prediction must be repeatable, and the results must be refutable.

Climate Change quacks are no longer practicing science, but ideological purity tests.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 519348

In 2004, satellite observations showed that it had started to thin, and that ice was flowing into the Amundsen Sea 25 per cent faster than it had 30 years before.
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01/14/2010 09:15 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
5a
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01/14/2010 09:18 PM
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
In 2004, satellite observations showed that it had started to thin, and that ice was flowing into the Amundsen Sea 25 per cent faster than it had 30 years before.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 864457


Correlation does not equal causation.
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
The Deluge: In The 12th Planet and Divine Encounters Zecharia suggested that the biblical Flood was a giant tidal wave caused by the slippage of the ice sheet off Antarctica, causing the abrupt end of the last Ice Age circa 13,000 years ago. Two recent studies corroborate both aspects of Zecharia's take on the subject: A study of ancient temperatures in the journal Nature of 26 February 2009 concludes that while warming at the end of the last Ice Age was relatively gradual in Greenland (north Atlantic), it was "rapid and abrupt" in Antarctica (south Atlantic), about 13,000 years ago.

A study of ancient sea levels published in Science of 6 February 2009 concludes that (a) Antarctica's ice sheet collapsed abruptly and (b) that due to the topography of the continent and its surrounding sea beds, the tidal wave was at least three times higher than hitherto calculated, reaching its maximal impact some 2,000 miles away. A diagram accompanying the article shows the area of maximal tidal impact in the Persian Gulf, the Mediterranean Sea and northward therefrom - the very Lands of the Bible and Mount Ararat.
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Re: {BREAKING} Major Antarctic glacier is 'past its tipping point' - catastrophe now cannot be avoided
catastrophe cannot be avoided? By god we've got to do something about that!





GLP