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Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study

 
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 04:13 AM
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Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.

The study which promoted the fear mongering of asymptomatic transmission came from flawed study from the 4 Germans infected by a so called "asymptomatic carrier", a business woman from China. The fact was, those who wrote the study never met the business woman, so their "fact" was based on the info from the 4 patients. That's highly unscientific similar to a he said she said rape case with no hard evidence. But others (RKI and the Health and Food Safety Authority of the state of Bavaria) did talk to the Shanghai woman and [from the link below] "it turned out she did have symptoms while in Germany. According to people familiar with the call, she felt tired, suffered from muscle pain, and took paracetamol, a fever-lowering medication.". So, SHE'S ALREADY SYMPTOMATIC!!!


[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
Study claiming new coronavirus can be transmitted by people without symptoms was flawed
Sungaze_At_Dawn

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02/06/2020 04:20 AM

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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Then how are so many getting sick so fast in China?
The Devil tries to convince everyone he doesn't exist.
The state tries to convince everyone they cannot resist.
Do not go quietly into the good night. Rage Rage against the dying light!
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 04:48 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Then how are so many getting sick so fast in China?
 Quoting: Sungaze_At_Dawn


Yeah...millions of people.getting it and we see the proof with out own eyes but one stupid cunt with a "study" shows up and says its "flawed" and somebow expects us to forget everything we have seen and heard so far just cause some.fuckhead said so.

Do they pay 3.50 to corona deniers as well?
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02/06/2020 04:50 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
:wojakmask::50points:
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 04:51 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Get FUCKED OP YA NWO COCKHEAD SHILL CUNT.


Berlin Charité and the Institute for Microbiology of the German Armed Forces confirm transmission of the #coronavirus with very mild symptoms and replication of the virus in the digestive tract of affected patients independently of the lungs.

[link to twitter.com (secure)]
 Quoting: LostRabbit


Translated with deepl:

Joint press release of the Charité, the Munich Schwabing Clinic and the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces

05 February 2020

Novel coronavirus: Detection of infectious viruses in the nasopharynx in persons with weak symptoms

Investigations of the Munich case group provide new insights into the transmissibility of the virus



Studies by Charité - Universitätsmedizin Berlin, the Institute for Microbiology of the German Armed Forces and the Munich Schwabing Clinic have shown that some of the patients with coronavirus infection currently being treated at the Munich Schwabing Clinic show infectious viral infections in their nasopharynx, even with mild symptoms, independently of the lungs. The research groups conclude that even infected patients with mild symptoms can transmit the virus.

The Institute of Virology of the Charité and the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces have been supporting the diagnosis of this new viral infection since the first German 2019 nCoV case occurred. As part of control examinations, both laboratories regularly and independently check the virus excretions of the patients cared for at the Munich Schwabing Clinic. During these examinations, it was found in several cases that infectious virus from the nasopharynx can be cultured in cell cultures of only slightly symptomatic patients. The symptoms of the patients examined resembled more a harmless cold than a serious pneumonia. At the same time, both laboratories found indications that the novel coronavirus reproduces in the nasopharynx and digestive tract of the affected patients independently of the lungs.

These observations are clear indications that the virus is already transmissible in mild or incipient cold symptoms (sore throat, signs of an acute sinus infection, mild general feeling of illness without fever).

The investigations were conducted by Prof. Dr. Christian Drosten, Director of the Institute of Virology at the Campus Charité Mitte, Colonel Dr. Roman Wölfel from the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces and Prof. Dr. Clemens Wendtner from the Munich Schwabing Clinic. The results were communicated to the Robert Koch Institute and the Standing Working Group of Competence and Treatment Centres for Diseases caused by Highly Pathogenic Agents (STAKOB). The publication of the data in a professional journal is in preparation.
 Quoting: LostRabbit


bump
 Quoting: LostRabbit
Cynical RealistModerator
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02/06/2020 05:03 AM

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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.

The study which promoted the fear mongering of asymptomatic transmission came from flawed study from the 4 Germans infected by a so called "asymptomatic carrier", a business woman from China. The fact was, those who wrote the study never met the business woman, so their "fact" was based on the info from the 4 patients. That's highly unscientific similar to a he said she said rape case with no hard evidence. But others (RKI and the Health and Food Safety Authority of the state of Bavaria) did talk to the Shanghai woman and [from the link below] "it turned out she did have symptoms while in Germany. According to people familiar with the call, she felt tired, suffered from muscle pain, and took paracetamol, a fever-lowering medication.". So, SHE'S ALREADY SYMPTOMATIC!!!


[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
Study claiming new coronavirus can be transmitted by people without symptoms was flawed
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


And within that document there is this....

The fact that the paper got it wrong doesn’t mean transmission from asymptomatic people doesn’t occur. Fauci, for one, still believes it does. "This evening I telephoned one of my colleagues in China who is a highly respected infectious diseases scientist and health official," he says. "He said that he is convinced that there is asymptomatic infection
IF YOU HAVE A FEVER DO NOT LOWER IT WITH MEDS.... A FEVER IS AN IMMUNE SYSTEM RESPONSE TO A PATHOGEN (VIRUS, BACTERIA ETC..) IT MEANS YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM IS WORKING PROPERLY....DONT USE DRUGS TO LOWER YOUR TEMP.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 05:25 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Get FUCKED OP YA NWO COCKHEAD SHILL CUNT.


Berlin Charité and the Institute for Microbiology of the German Armed Forces confirm transmission of the #coronavirus with very mild symptoms and replication of the virus in the digestive tract of affected patients independently of the lungs.

[link to twitter.com (secure)]
 Quoting: LostRabbit


Translated with deepl:

Joint press release of the Charité, the Munich Schwabing Clinic and the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces

05 February 2020

Novel coronavirus: Detection of infectious viruses in the nasopharynx in persons with weak symptoms

Investigations of the Munich case group provide new insights into the transmissibility of the virus



Studies by Charité - Universitätsmedizin Berlin, the Institute for Microbiology of the German Armed Forces and the Munich Schwabing Clinic have shown that some of the patients with coronavirus infection currently being treated at the Munich Schwabing Clinic show infectious viral infections in their nasopharynx, even with mild symptoms, independently of the lungs. The research groups conclude that even infected patients with mild symptoms can transmit the virus.

The Institute of Virology of the Charité and the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces have been supporting the diagnosis of this new viral infection since the first German 2019 nCoV case occurred. As part of control examinations, both laboratories regularly and independently check the virus excretions of the patients cared for at the Munich Schwabing Clinic. During these examinations, it was found in several cases that infectious virus from the nasopharynx can be cultured in cell cultures of only slightly symptomatic patients. The symptoms of the patients examined resembled more a harmless cold than a serious pneumonia. At the same time, both laboratories found indications that the novel coronavirus reproduces in the nasopharynx and digestive tract of the affected patients independently of the lungs.

These observations are clear indications that the virus is already transmissible in mild or incipient cold symptoms (sore throat, signs of an acute sinus infection, mild general feeling of illness without fever).

The investigations were conducted by Prof. Dr. Christian Drosten, Director of the Institute of Virology at the Campus Charité Mitte, Colonel Dr. Roman Wölfel from the Institute of Microbiology of the German Armed Forces and Prof. Dr. Clemens Wendtner from the Munich Schwabing Clinic. The results were communicated to the Robert Koch Institute and the Standing Working Group of Competence and Treatment Centres for Diseases caused by Highly Pathogenic Agents (STAKOB). The publication of the data in a professional journal is in preparation.
 Quoting: LostRabbit


bump
 Quoting: LostRabbit

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55632164

"Weak/mild symptons" means Symptomatic. true or false?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 05:31 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.

The study which promoted the fear mongering of asymptomatic transmission came from flawed study from the 4 Germans infected by a so called "asymptomatic carrier", a business woman from China. The fact was, those who wrote the study never met the business woman, so their "fact" was based on the info from the 4 patients. That's highly unscientific similar to a he said she said rape case with no hard evidence. But others (RKI and the Health and Food Safety Authority of the state of Bavaria) did talk to the Shanghai woman and [from the link below] "it turned out she did have symptoms while in Germany. According to people familiar with the call, she felt tired, suffered from muscle pain, and took paracetamol, a fever-lowering medication.". So, SHE'S ALREADY SYMPTOMATIC!!!


[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
Study claiming new coronavirus can be transmitted by people without symptoms was flawed
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


And within that document there is this....

The fact that the paper got it wrong doesn’t mean transmission from asymptomatic people doesn’t occur. Fauci, for one, still believes it does. "This evening I telephoned one of my colleagues in China who is a highly respected infectious diseases scientist and health official," he says. "He said that he is convinced that there is asymptomatic infection
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

"Fauci still BELIEVE it does" --> BELIEF (and IS CONVINCED) is not fact based science. You've got to offer the hard data to defend your belief/hypothesis.

Beside, when many of you claim to not believe any info coming out of China, how come you selectively choose to believe this phone talk and claim is factual?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 05:38 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Then how are so many getting sick so fast in China?
 Quoting: Sungaze_At_Dawn


Yeah...millions of people.getting it and we see the proof with out own eyes but one stupid cunt with a "study" shows up and says its "flawed" and somebow expects us to forget everything we have seen and heard so far just cause some.fuckhead said so.

Do they pay 3.50 to corona deniers as well?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55632164

I bet everyone also see the "proof" that the shape of earth in the horizon is flat. But that doesn't mean the earth is flat.

From logic, "so many getting sick so fast" doesn't prove "asymtomatic transmision is true". It means the virus might be quite virulent.
Cynical RealistModerator
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02/06/2020 05:39 AM

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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.

The study which promoted the fear mongering of asymptomatic transmission came from flawed study from the 4 Germans infected by a so called "asymptomatic carrier", a business woman from China. The fact was, those who wrote the study never met the business woman, so their "fact" was based on the info from the 4 patients. That's highly unscientific similar to a he said she said rape case with no hard evidence. But others (RKI and the Health and Food Safety Authority of the state of Bavaria) did talk to the Shanghai woman and [from the link below] "it turned out she did have symptoms while in Germany. According to people familiar with the call, she felt tired, suffered from muscle pain, and took paracetamol, a fever-lowering medication.". So, SHE'S ALREADY SYMPTOMATIC!!!


[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
Study claiming new coronavirus can be transmitted by people without symptoms was flawed
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


And within that document there is this....

The fact that the paper got it wrong doesn’t mean transmission from asymptomatic people doesn’t occur. Fauci, for one, still believes it does. "This evening I telephoned one of my colleagues in China who is a highly respected infectious diseases scientist and health official," he says. "He said that he is convinced that there is asymptomatic infection
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

"Fauci still BELIEVE it does" --> BELIEF (and IS CONVINCED) is not fact based science. You've got to offer the hard data to defend your belief/hypothesis.

Beside, when many of you claim to not believe any info coming out of China, how come you selectively choose to believe this phone talk and claim is factual?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847

Hey got to give it to you CCP propagandists.... you certainly keep going.

There is BOTH evidence AND enough hypothesis to convince any doubter..... There is a little problem going around... Not only killing people but altering world economics.

I think under the circumstances erring on the side of cation and scepticism, by going with the WORST case scenario is more likley to save my life than a debate whether the semantics of a PARTIALY flawed study fits within YOUR CCP propaganda BS.
IF YOU HAVE A FEVER DO NOT LOWER IT WITH MEDS.... A FEVER IS AN IMMUNE SYSTEM RESPONSE TO A PATHOGEN (VIRUS, BACTERIA ETC..) IT MEANS YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM IS WORKING PROPERLY....DONT USE DRUGS TO LOWER YOUR TEMP.
KonspiracyKitty

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02/06/2020 05:48 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


You are aware that there is lots of precedence for asymptomatic transmission of viruses, right?

It sounds like you're arguing against the entire premise of asymptomatic transmission in general. But it's a very well known phenomenon.
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 06:02 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Then how are so many getting sick so fast in China?
 Quoting: Sungaze_At_Dawn


because it is not a virus

wuhan was gassed for the protests last July
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 06:17 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.

The study which promoted the fear mongering of asymptomatic transmission came from flawed study from the 4 Germans infected by a so called "asymptomatic carrier", a business woman from China. The fact was, those who wrote the study never met the business woman, so their "fact" was based on the info from the 4 patients. That's highly unscientific similar to a he said she said rape case with no hard evidence. But others (RKI and the Health and Food Safety Authority of the state of Bavaria) did talk to the Shanghai woman and [from the link below] "it turned out she did have symptoms while in Germany. According to people familiar with the call, she felt tired, suffered from muscle pain, and took paracetamol, a fever-lowering medication.". So, SHE'S ALREADY SYMPTOMATIC!!!


[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
Study claiming new coronavirus can be transmitted by people without symptoms was flawed
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


And within that document there is this....

The fact that the paper got it wrong doesn’t mean transmission from asymptomatic people doesn’t occur. Fauci, for one, still believes it does. "This evening I telephoned one of my colleagues in China who is a highly respected infectious diseases scientist and health official," he says. "He said that he is convinced that there is asymptomatic infection
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

"Fauci still BELIEVE it does" --> BELIEF (and IS CONVINCED) is not fact based science. You've got to offer the hard data to defend your belief/hypothesis.

Beside, when many of you claim to not believe any info coming out of China, how come you selectively choose to believe this phone talk and claim is factual?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847

Hey got to give it to you CCP propagandists.... you certainly keep going.

There is BOTH evidence AND enough hypothesis to convince any doubter..... There is a little problem going around... Not only killing people but altering world economics.

I think under the circumstances erring on the side of cation and scepticism, by going with the WORST case scenario is more likley to save my life than a debate whether the semantics of a PARTIALY flawed study fits within YOUR CCP propaganda BS.
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

You don't live up to your id, you're not a realist. A realist is fact based, not making unproven accusation of CCP propagandist crap just because one disagrees with your world view. Using your liberally bestowed accusation of CCP propagandist, wasn't Donald Trump fit that label since he claimed Coronavirus has “a very good ending for us” and "Hopefully it won’t be as bad as some people (many of you the paranoids) think it could be"?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 06:29 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
Logic says, if you're asymptomatic, the virus must not have multiplied vigorously in you or the viruses are not there treating your body as virus factory. Therefore there's less or no likelihood for the asymptomatic transmission of virus.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


You are aware that there is lots of precedence for asymptomatic transmission of viruses, right?

It sounds like you're arguing against the entire premise of asymptomatic transmission in general. But it's a very well known phenomenon.
 Quoting: KonspiracyKitty

I think they need to collect more hard evidence that asymptomatic transmission of this specific coronavirus is a fact. A flawed study should be pointed out, don't you think so? A belief or hypothesis must be proven first instead of being paraded as fact.
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02/06/2020 06:32 AM

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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
...


And within that document there is this....

The fact that the paper got it wrong doesn’t mean transmission from asymptomatic people doesn’t occur. Fauci, for one, still believes it does. "This evening I telephoned one of my colleagues in China who is a highly respected infectious diseases scientist and health official," he says. "He said that he is convinced that there is asymptomatic infection
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

"Fauci still BELIEVE it does" --> BELIEF (and IS CONVINCED) is not fact based science. You've got to offer the hard data to defend your belief/hypothesis.

Beside, when many of you claim to not believe any info coming out of China, how come you selectively choose to believe this phone talk and claim is factual?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847

Hey got to give it to you CCP propagandists.... you certainly keep going.

There is BOTH evidence AND enough hypothesis to convince any doubter..... There is a little problem going around... Not only killing people but altering world economics.

I think under the circumstances erring on the side of cation and scepticism, by going with the WORST case scenario is more likley to save my life than a debate whether the semantics of a PARTIALY flawed study fits within YOUR CCP propaganda BS.
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

You don't live up to your id, you're not a realist. A realist is fact based, not making unproven accusation of CCP propagandist crap just because one disagrees with your world view. Using your liberally bestowed accusation of CCP propagandist, wasn't Donald Trump fit that label since he claimed Coronavirus has “a very good ending for us” and "Hopefully it won’t be as bad as some people (many of you the paranoids) think it could be"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


I disagree with you China man....... My Avater is particularly accurate I am very much a realist, I suspect its my cynicism you have issue with.... But you will get over that.

Im very much an evidence based person, but I also study hypothesis...It often points to evidence yet to be proven.

I have to ask... you are now turning this political...You know you are quoting Trump and all that.... What has trump got to do with me on this....??

Not only do i see indications of your OWN flawed observations.... I also see flaws in your use of the English language.

Last Edited by Cynical Realist on 02/06/2020 06:33 AM
IF YOU HAVE A FEVER DO NOT LOWER IT WITH MEDS.... A FEVER IS AN IMMUNE SYSTEM RESPONSE TO A PATHOGEN (VIRUS, BACTERIA ETC..) IT MEANS YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM IS WORKING PROPERLY....DONT USE DRUGS TO LOWER YOUR TEMP.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 07:48 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
...

"Fauci still BELIEVE it does" --> BELIEF (and IS CONVINCED) is not fact based science. You've got to offer the hard data to defend your belief/hypothesis.

Beside, when many of you claim to not believe any info coming out of China, how come you selectively choose to believe this phone talk and claim is factual?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847

Hey got to give it to you CCP propagandists.... you certainly keep going.

There is BOTH evidence AND enough hypothesis to convince any doubter..... There is a little problem going around... Not only killing people but altering world economics.

I think under the circumstances erring on the side of cation and scepticism, by going with the WORST case scenario is more likley to save my life than a debate whether the semantics of a PARTIALY flawed study fits within YOUR CCP propaganda BS.
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

You don't live up to your id, you're not a realist. A realist is fact based, not making unproven accusation of CCP propagandist crap just because one disagrees with your world view. Using your liberally bestowed accusation of CCP propagandist, wasn't Donald Trump fit that label since he claimed Coronavirus has “a very good ending for us” and "Hopefully it won’t be as bad as some people (many of you the paranoids) think it could be"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78432847


I disagree with you China man....... My Avater is particularly accurate I am very much a realist, I suspect its my cynicism you have issue with.... But you will get over that.

Im very much an evidence based person, but I also study hypothesis...It often points to evidence yet to be proven.

I have to ask... you are now turning this political...You know you are quoting Trump and all that.... What has trump got to do with me on this....??

Not only do i see indications of your OWN flawed observations.... I also see flaws in your use of the English language.
 Quoting: Cynical Realist

You should be able to understand why I quoted Trump and said if you think I'm CCP propagandist, Trump should be too, since he's telling people this is not as bad as people think, just what you think CCP propaganda would say.

Now you add another speculation "china man" into your portfolio of unproven allegations. No, you're far from "a very much evidence based person". If I use my native language, I would say, "dasar mulut comberan, bule goblok", an insult only natives can understand, google translate may not give the accurate nuance of the meaning.
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 07:57 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
IT DOES NOT MATTER if she was mildly symptomatic or what ever.

The scary this is the contact chart that show the SPEED of transmission. You are around people all the time with all kinds of "symptoms" that you are not aware of.
Anonymous Coward
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02/06/2020 08:02 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
op, I'm sorry, people who was feeling well had a huge viral load from test.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 09:50 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
op, I'm sorry, people who was feeling well had a huge viral load from test.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76493971

Link?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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02/06/2020 10:11 AM
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Re: Coronavirus transmission by an infected asymptomatic person is based on flawed study
IT DOES NOT MATTER if she was mildly symptomatic or what ever.

The scary this is the contact chart that show the SPEED of transmission. You are around people all the time with all kinds of "symptoms" that you are not aware of.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78348779

While the speed seem scary, the result of transmission seem to vary from person to person. The article above said that the 4 infected Germans only have a very mild infection. And that could be the reason for the speed of transmission, many of the infected have mild symptoms that do not force them to stay in bed or at home.

[link to www.sciencemag.org (secure)]
The German cluster does reveal another interesting aspect about the new virus, Drosten says. So far most attention has gone to patients who get seriously ill, but all four cases in Germany had a very mild infection. That may be true for many more patients, Drosten says, which may help the virus spread. “There is increasingly the sense that patients may just experience mild cold symptoms, while already shedding the virus,” he says. “Those are not symptoms that lead people to stay at home.”





GLP