| Users Online Now: 1,676 (Who's On?) | Visitors Today: 161,371 | |
| Pageviews Today: 210,530 | Threads Today: 47 | Posts Today: 781 |
| 01:37 AM | ||
| Users Online Now: 1,676 (Who's On?) | Visitors Today: 161,371 | |
| Pageviews Today: 210,530 | Threads Today: 47 | Posts Today: 781 |
| 01:37 AM | ||
UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55032886  United States03/09/2014 08:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Putin has already pussied out. Hesitation = weakness. He's got nothin', just like North Korea last year. He can't handle the invincible Western order, and he knows it. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 If Putin was the type of guy everyone says he is, he could have and would have already rolled over Crimea and taken everything. It's comical at this point to see the desperate talk now - Putin weak, Russia lost, bogged down. Very funny   your right with all these ultimatums and now even Latvia getting in on the gig Crimea should have and would have been taken over by now hell Ukraine/Poland should have by now by the way they were talking. Even though it would be interesting if Latvia did though any word on what's going on with Latvia? |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 51816967  France03/09/2014 08:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55260799  Australia03/09/2014 08:54 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 He's "taking on the US" probably in ways that's impossible for your mind to grasp. Not everything has to be done with bombs and missiles. But amuse yourself and us with your way of thinking if you like. I look at the facts. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55385025 LOL, ways that you can't explicate because you know how desperate you'd look when unfalsifiable nonsense is all you have. I mean, the whole secret-victor-in-the-shadows BS can apply to the US as well. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55385025  Egypt03/09/2014 08:55 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 ... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55385025 Over 1200 pages and you still keep repeating this - you are wrong! He hasn't gotten bogged down. He has done what he had to do - protect the people there, his bases and stop what was intended. Putin is different from what people think - which is probably his greatest advantage. you don't really think anyone pays any heed to your tripe. do you? About as much as to yours. I state my opinion and give my analysis, nothing more. You keep repeating your Tzar Putin and him restoring USSR stuff, which nobody buys at this point. If he wanted that, he could have done it already and it would be done with. not "restore the USSR", but, rather: restore the Tzarist Russian Empire. Vladimir The Great, Tsar of All The Russias . I dare you to go to Moscow and state that to his face - I would love to see him slap you with the back of his hand over your face. Not to hurt you, but to insult you for the insult. |
nerdrage88sasr
 User ID: 55210838 Australia03/09/2014 08:55 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 There is one big problem with your logic, Barack Obama! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45874141 My biggest fear is Putin makes (continues to make) Obama look the fool. Eventually, with U.S. credibility completely shot, He'll be forced to act. Let us pray this doesn't come to pass. good point AC! I never actually looked at it from his POV.. he must know what people are thinking/saying about his actions..(if not im sure he will be advised) and we all know you cant have people bad-mouth the 'sheriff'.. so he is in a difficult position...he needs to make a statement, (but gently). He needs to make Vlad an example, but without tipping things over the edge....how do you do that? remembering that as far as my understanding goes on this topic...Vlad has done nothing wrong....but called the west's bluff and bluster... what would you do if you were Obama? (thought out reponses guys/gals, not keyboard commando crap) "Luck is what happens when preparation meets Oppurtunity"-- Seneca (5BC-65AD) |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 37748947  New Zealand03/09/2014 08:56 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 LOL @ the fools still thinking there's going to be a military clash between Russia and the US. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 Another day, another step closer to a "diplomatic solution." The Western order is invincible! lol you do realize that right now russia is winning? Russia won Crimea (population 2 million) but lost Ukraine (45 million). Russia lost this one. imo russia is exactly as where they want to be for now. the west got sucker punched, and all they can do is cry cry cry |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 42841999 United States03/09/2014 08:57 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Philip DeLizio ‏@teacher1722 2m Quoting: Ontheverge BREAKING -- China joins Russia over Ukraine... [link to www.teapartycrusaders.com] … Many have predicted China\Russia will join forces against the world  Don't get confident, the Nuketards in Ukraine will hunker down for three to six months gaining advanced nato systems then reveal they have a bunch of nukes again in 3-6 months. So will end the soviet union from its old territory. They can hit middle east from there too. Syria? Nukes are being made with plutonium in Japan as well. China is like can you please stop with the plutonium and give it back to the US/EU. So you see it will be Asian vs Asian and Russian/Ukrainian vs Russian. BTW Iraq just declared war on Saudi and Qatars for terrorism, so Arab vs Arab. None of this will end well. There is ZERO chance that Tzar Putin will EVER let Ukraine/Nato put nukes that close to Mother Russia. That would be akin to mexico loading up on nukes near Brownsville Texas! We wouldn't let it happen, Putin won't let it happen. Ah cmon don't we have a destroyer with almost 50 nukes in the black sea capable of hitting all areas of Russia! |
| Use your brian, moran!
User ID: 2782120 United States03/09/2014 08:58 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 I got a ding for "abusive post, violating posting rules" for ragging on some 81 year old lady that HufPo did an article on(no swearing, just called her art fecal matter). Still don't know how/why that's "abusive", unless she posts here or I'm just THAT clueless about how things work around here. Quoting: Use your brian, moran! probably post more than 50% of the article All I posted was the url. Bah, sorry, not trying to derail this thread. Back to Ukraine & the Western provocation of the ongoing situation. I'm a proud Texan & American, posting from Central Texas & have no clue why my flag shows friggin Canada(no offense to my Canadian friends). "Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest." Diderot "Immigration without assimilation is invasion!" - Anonymous Coward Gird your lions, shave your Family & panic sex the 'maters! "When your so-called religion is purely a political theory of conquest, and deception is one of it's core principles then it strikes me as perfectly sane and reasonable to assume literally everyone who is of such a "religion" to be exactly the same POS who deserves to be treated as the enemy non-stop." Darkwolf007 |
| nerdrage88sasr
User ID: 55210838 Australia03/09/2014 08:58 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Let's see if I understand this situation: Quoting: Interested Reader 2 Ukraine had a lawfully elected government that wasn't helping the country, so people protested. Instead of changing government behavior in response to the protests by its People, the government changed the Constitution and OUTLAWED protests! This begot even MORE protests, which begot even MORE government heavy handedness. Ultimately, the people of Ukraine (whether they were urged-on by outsiders or not) revolted, resulting in the use of violence, which caused the downfall of the government to the point where the President actually fled the country. Neighboring Russia called this series of events a "Coup d Etat." I see this as mistake #1. A coup d'etat is defined as "the sudden deposition of a government, usually by a small group of the existing state establishment—typically the military—to depose the extant government and replace it with another body, civil or military. A coup d'état is considered successful when the usurpers establish their dominance." This is NOT what took place in Ukraine. It was not a small group of the existing establishment that undertook what happened; it was the body politic of Ukraine itself. So Russia's description of this series of events as a "Coup d' Etat" is factually wrong. It would be more accurate to call the situation in Ukraine a "Revolution" which is defined as "A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution: Complete change from one constitution to another Modification of an existing constitution. Looking at what took place in Ukraine bolsters the fact it was a revolution and not a Coup. What was a primary demand of the protesters? The RESTORATION of the earlier Constitution. That's exactly what was done after the ousted President fled the country! So based upon actual definitions, what took place in Ukraine was a revolution and NOT a Coup. Next, neighboring Russia decided to exercise its rights pursuant to a Treaty, and began sending thousands of troops into the Crimean region of Ukraine, allegedly to "protect" its Black Sea naval fleet and to "protect ethnic Russians." Their reasons really didn't matter since Russia was exercising Treaty rights. The Treaty made allowance for up to 25,000 Russian Troops. Until Russia hit the 25,000 limit, it was within its rights. But strange things started taking place with those Russian troops: They started rummaging around Crimea. They started pushing their way into Ukraine military facilities and ousting the Ukrainian military from those facilities. NONE of that was within Russia's Treaty rights. Next, Russia started deploying troops outside its bases in Crimea. That was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russia sank a ship in a waterway so as to physically block the entry/exit of the Ukraine navy from its home port. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russian troops took over border control check points. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Now, after a week or so of all this, Russia admits it has 30,000 of its troops in Crimea. This is a direct violation of the written Treaty limit of 25,000 troops. Amid all this chaos, the government of the Crimea declared its desire to become part of Russia. This would be akin to Massachusetts asking Britain to send back its troops because it wants to go back to being a colony of Great Britain and besides, most of its people speak English. That crap doesn't fly. So whatever the local Crimean government wants, is utterly irrelevant from a national level. Here we are, weeks later, and it appears Russia is now hand-delivering ultimatums to other Ukraine military installations in Crimea, setting a deadline for surrender. None of this is within Russia's Treaty Rights. Russia has therefore committed a defacto invasion of the sovereign territory of Ukraine. It has initiated an illegal blockade of Ukraine naval activities, which, in and of itself, is and act of war, and it is giving surrender ultimatums. By any account, Ukraine has a valid Casus Belli, (cause for war.) The question facing the rest of the world is simply this: Will the world stand-up and defend the sovereign territory of one nation, from aggression by another nation? If so, then we can call ourselves civilized. If not, then the only international law is the "law of the gun" that makes us barbarians. Glory to Ukraine!  well written! puts things in perspective for me as well...nice! "Luck is what happens when preparation meets Oppurtunity"-- Seneca (5BC-65AD) |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 37748947 New Zealand03/09/2014 08:59 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Don't get confident, the Nuketards in Ukraine will hunker down for three to six months gaining advanced nato systems then reveal they have a bunch of nukes again in 3-6 months. So will end the soviet union from its old territory. They can hit middle east from there too. Syria? Nukes are being made with plutonium in Japan as well. China is like can you please stop with the plutonium and give it back to the US/EU. So you see it will be Asian vs Asian and Russian/Ukrainian vs Russian. BTW Iraq just declared war on Saudi and Qatars for terrorism, so Arab vs Arab. None of this will end well. There is ZERO chance that Tzar Putin will EVER let Ukraine/Nato put nukes that close to Mother Russia. That would be akin to mexico loading up on nukes near Brownsville Texas! We wouldn't let it happen, Putin won't let it happen. Ah cmon don't we have a destroyer with almost 50 nukes in the black sea capable of hitting all areas of Russia! and look how vulnerable it is with SS N 26 pointed at it. plus, it cat stay there foe more than 3 weeks |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55032886 United States03/09/2014 08:59 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Let's see if I understand this situation: Quoting: Interested Reader 2 Ukraine had a lawfully elected government that wasn't helping the country, so people protested. Instead of changing government behavior in response to the protests by its People, the government changed the Constitution and OUTLAWED protests! This begot even MORE protests, which begot even MORE government heavy handedness. Ultimately, the people of Ukraine (whether they were urged-on by outsiders or not) revolted, resulting in the use of violence, which caused the downfall of the government to the point where the President actually fled the country. Neighboring Russia called this series of events a "Coup d Etat." I see this as mistake #1. A coup d'etat is defined as "the sudden deposition of a government, usually by a small group of the existing state establishment—typically the military—to depose the extant government and replace it with another body, civil or military. A coup d'état is considered successful when the usurpers establish their dominance." This is NOT what took place in Ukraine. It was not a small group of the existing establishment that undertook what happened; it was the body politic of Ukraine itself. So Russia's description of this series of events as a "Coup d' Etat" is factually wrong. It would be more accurate to call the situation in Ukraine a "Revolution" which is defined as "A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution: Complete change from one constitution to another Modification of an existing constitution. Looking at what took place in Ukraine bolsters the fact it was a revolution and not a Coup. What was a primary demand of the protesters? The RESTORATION of the earlier Constitution. That's exactly what was done after the ousted President fled the country! So based upon actual definitions, what took place in Ukraine was a revolution and NOT a Coup. Next, neighboring Russia decided to exercise its rights pursuant to a Treaty, and began sending thousands of troops into the Crimean region of Ukraine, allegedly to "protect" its Black Sea naval fleet and to "protect ethnic Russians." Their reasons really didn't matter since Russia was exercising Treaty rights. The Treaty made allowance for up to 25,000 Russian Troops. Until Russia hit the 25,000 limit, it was within its rights. But strange things started taking place with those Russian troops: They started rummaging around Crimea. They started pushing their way into Ukraine military facilities and ousting the Ukrainian military from those facilities. NONE of that was within Russia's Treaty rights. Next, Russia started deploying troops outside its bases in Crimea. That was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russia sank a ship in a waterway so as to physically block the entry/exit of the Ukraine navy from its home port. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russian troops took over border control check points. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Now, after a week or so of all this, Russia admits it has 30,000 of its troops in Crimea. This is a direct violation of the written Treaty limit of 25,000 troops. Amid all this chaos, the government of the Crimea declared its desire to become part of Russia. This would be akin to Massachusetts asking Britain to send back its troops because it wants to go back to being a colony of Great Britain and besides, most of its people speak English. That crap doesn't fly. So whatever the local Crimean government wants, is utterly irrelevant from a national level. Here we are, weeks later, and it appears Russia is now hand-delivering ultimatums to other Ukraine military installations in Crimea, setting a deadline for surrender. None of this is within Russia's Treaty Rights. Russia has therefore committed a defacto invasion of the sovereign territory of Ukraine. It has initiated an illegal blockade of Ukraine naval activities, which, in and of itself, is and act of war, and it is giving surrender ultimatums. By any account, Ukraine has a valid Casus Belli, (cause for war.) The question facing the rest of the world is simply this: Will the world stand-up and defend the sovereign territory of one nation, from aggression by another nation? If so, then we can call ourselves civilized. If not, then the only international law is the "law of the gun" that makes us barbarians. Glory to Ukraine! FINALLY!!!! a smart person over a 100 pgs not too bad, you hit it head on, the only thing I disagree with is the law of gun statement lmao, because guns are pretty bad a** but other than that your alright in my book fellow American. Basically I see this Ukrainian Revolution no different than a little Revolution that happened back in 1776, which went a little bit to the tune called the American Revolution. Oh srry for the double post, once I saw this though I had to comment and show support. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55385025 Egypt03/09/2014 09:00 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 There is one big problem with your logic, Barack Obama! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 45874141 My biggest fear is Putin makes (continues to make) Obama look the fool. Eventually, with U.S. credibility completely shot, He'll be forced to act. Let us pray this doesn't come to pass. good point AC! I never actually looked at it from his POV.. he must know what people are thinking/saying about his actions..(if not im sure he will be advised) and we all know you cant have people bad-mouth the 'sheriff'.. so he is in a difficult position...he needs to make a statement, (but gently). He needs to make Vlad an example, but without tipping things over the edge....how do you do that? remembering that as far as my understanding goes on this topic...Vlad has done nothing wrong....but called the west's bluff and bluster... what would you do if you were Obama? (thought out reponses guys/gals, not keyboard commando crap) He's first gone off on vacation - and think about that while on the golf course. He's left it to UK Cameron, Germany Merkel now to sort things out with him. Obama and America are not even a main player in this. He will then do diplomatically what looks good on the US and kind of give the impression Russia got a slap on the wrist - behind the scenes talks and deals we will not know of. I really don't think Obama and the US are a big deal now, they have to be quiet just alone on the fact presented about the NGO's and funding of the "uprising". Europe will have to sort it out. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5846208 United States03/09/2014 09:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| The Årtist
User ID: 44124412 United States03/09/2014 09:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 LOL @ the fools still thinking there's going to be a military clash between Russia and the US. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 Another day, another step closer to a "diplomatic solution." The Western order is invincible! You know. I'm beginning to think the US should start WWIII with a nuclear strike. I think the US should also break the nuclear test ban treaty.... I have 4 test areas to begin in. Sydney, Perth, Victoria, and Melbourne. Why are most Aussies asshats? Do you put yourself on record as someone who believes there'll be a military clash between Russia and the US? Let me know so I can taunt you when this whole thing peters out. Nope. There's not going to be any military confrontation unless someone does something incredibly stupid. Putin has what he wants, Crimea. There is nothing more for him to do except wait. The West has failed and has been embarrassed. Next Sunday Crimea will vote to join Russia, Russia will welcome this. Then Russia will militarizes the area like crazy. The world will kick and scream and do absolutely nothing about it, zero. The rest of Ukraine will go to the EU and get raped with austerity. There may be some pro Western protests in Eastern Ukraine but not much else. The only way this escalates is if the West or Ukraine opens a direct conflict with Russia. It is in Russia's interests to take the moral high ground and not fire a single shot and still get Ukraine. The only other way this "war" goes hot is if Ukraine sees an influx of NATO or EU / US military installations right up against Russia. That's probably not going to happen. RAGE |
| Kent User ID: 54313590  Norway03/09/2014 09:02 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 ... Quoting: Littlefeather I'm getting loaded up with "red abusive post" red Karma that are clearly nothing but political persecution. your dear russians can show you what political persecution is they're best at it yeh, well, i'll settle for a fair hearing from the Mods, thank you very much. I got a ding for "abusive post, violating posting rules" for ragging on some 81 year old lady that HufPo did an article on(no swearing, just called her art fecal matter). Still don't know how/why that's "abusive", unless she posts here or I'm just THAT clueless about how things work around here. Thank you for the laugh (no pun intended) "How things work around here" is always unpredictable by the very nature of this site. Live with it. Remember the ISON thread, do you? Take care |
| Ostria1
User ID: 55370701  Greece03/09/2014 09:02 PM  Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 So maybe we should be alarmed today if the US, Russia, China etc change leaders? Ostria |
| aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
User ID: 55385707  Croatia03/09/2014 09:02 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55260799 Australia03/09/2014 09:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Also, what happened to all those people telling me last year there was going to be a military clash between North Korea and the US? LOL. *crickets* The US order is granite. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 51816967 France03/09/2014 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| RelentlessDespot
Abrasive Fuck User ID: 53839221 United States03/09/2014 09:04 PM  Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Putin has already pussied out. Hesitation = weakness. He's got nothin', just like North Korea last year. He can't handle the invincible Western order, and he knows it. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 Umm, not sure I see it that way mate. Im with a few of the other guys/gals here, I believe Putin has got what he wants and is now seeking a way to return to Russia head-held-high. I believe he will: 1)- wait till after the elections, which the pro-Russian side will win, (if they lose- id be thinking its rigged) 2)- Set people in place carefully and by the proper protocols and procedures... 3) return to Russia with a big 'fuck-you UN' smile on his face. I think the only reason Putin will do something stupid is in response to something stupid done by the west. Mind you- if certain people are looking for war/conflict, its easy to pay for people to get caught doing something stupid and have the war your after...The arrival of mercs in the area is not a surprise at all. expect something to happen that may tip this one way or the other. As I have stated before, well-played Mr Putin, well played! I'm with you. I don't think Putin ever intended to take all of Ukraine. My guess is Crimea is his foothold while he waits to see if NATO does anything stupid... If they do? Then it's on. If NATO blinks? Nothing happens just like in Syria. Either way it is nice to see there are leaders in this world of puppets. Wish my country had a leader. Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me. Or something |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 37748947 New Zealand03/09/2014 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 OK, you weasels, I challenge you to take a stand. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 Who here believes there's going to be an overt military clash this year between Russia and the US over this Ukraine incident? I'm taking names for future ridicule. ok retard. ill spell it out for you. putin will not take any obama cock (like you do) |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55385025 Egypt03/09/2014 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Let's see if I understand this situation: Quoting: Interested Reader 2 Ukraine had a lawfully elected government that wasn't helping the country, so people protested. Instead of changing government behavior in response to the protests by its People, the government changed the Constitution and OUTLAWED protests! This begot even MORE protests, which begot even MORE government heavy handedness. Ultimately, the people of Ukraine (whether they were urged-on by outsiders or not) revolted, resulting in the use of violence, which caused the downfall of the government to the point where the President actually fled the country. Neighboring Russia called this series of events a "Coup d Etat." I see this as mistake #1. A coup d'etat is defined as "the sudden deposition of a government, usually by a small group of the existing state establishment—typically the military—to depose the extant government and replace it with another body, civil or military. A coup d'état is considered successful when the usurpers establish their dominance." This is NOT what took place in Ukraine. It was not a small group of the existing establishment that undertook what happened; it was the body politic of Ukraine itself. So Russia's description of this series of events as a "Coup d' Etat" is factually wrong. It would be more accurate to call the situation in Ukraine a "Revolution" which is defined as "A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution: Complete change from one constitution to another Modification of an existing constitution. Looking at what took place in Ukraine bolsters the fact it was a revolution and not a Coup. What was a primary demand of the protesters? The RESTORATION of the earlier Constitution. That's exactly what was done after the ousted President fled the country! So based upon actual definitions, what took place in Ukraine was a revolution and NOT a Coup. Next, neighboring Russia decided to exercise its rights pursuant to a Treaty, and began sending thousands of troops into the Crimean region of Ukraine, allegedly to "protect" its Black Sea naval fleet and to "protect ethnic Russians." Their reasons really didn't matter since Russia was exercising Treaty rights. The Treaty made allowance for up to 25,000 Russian Troops. Until Russia hit the 25,000 limit, it was within its rights. But strange things started taking place with those Russian troops: They started rummaging around Crimea. They started pushing their way into Ukraine military facilities and ousting the Ukrainian military from those facilities. NONE of that was within Russia's Treaty rights. Next, Russia started deploying troops outside its bases in Crimea. That was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russia sank a ship in a waterway so as to physically block the entry/exit of the Ukraine navy from its home port. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russian troops took over border control check points. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Now, after a week or so of all this, Russia admits it has 30,000 of its troops in Crimea. This is a direct violation of the written Treaty limit of 25,000 troops. Amid all this chaos, the government of the Crimea declared its desire to become part of Russia. This would be akin to Massachusetts asking Britain to send back its troops because it wants to go back to being a colony of Great Britain and besides, most of its people speak English. That crap doesn't fly. So whatever the local Crimean government wants, is utterly irrelevant from a national level. Here we are, weeks later, and it appears Russia is now hand-delivering ultimatums to other Ukraine military installations in Crimea, setting a deadline for surrender. None of this is within Russia's Treaty Rights. Russia has therefore committed a defacto invasion of the sovereign territory of Ukraine. It has initiated an illegal blockade of Ukraine naval activities, which, in and of itself, is and act of war, and it is giving surrender ultimatums. By any account, Ukraine has a valid Casus Belli, (cause for war.) The question facing the rest of the world is simply this: Will the world stand-up and defend the sovereign territory of one nation, from aggression by another nation? If so, then we can call ourselves civilized. If not, then the only international law is the "law of the gun" that makes us barbarians. Glory to Ukraine! well written! puts things in perspective for me as well...nice! This is the viewpoint of the MaidanPR and EU guys - those of us who have been here from the beginning and watching this since last October know this wall of text is a whitewash of the actual events. |
| nerdrage88sasr
User ID: 55210838 Australia03/09/2014 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 i was reading yesterday the events that led to WW1 and WW2.. it is interesting that in both wars we had a few new elected heads of countries, many regional wars and meetings for peace. And i dont mean the causes that started the wars but the events that happened a few years before those. Quoting: Ostria1 So maybe we should be alarmed today if the US, Russia, China etc change leaders? lol- good point. the interesting comparisons for me are the 'peace talks' and new treaty signings that occurred close to the start of both wars.... "Luck is what happens when preparation meets Oppurtunity"-- Seneca (5BC-65AD) |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55182009  Canada03/09/2014 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 The rest of Ukraine will go to the EU and get raped with austerity ------------------------------------------------quote This much I agree with. And I am going to enjoy some cheese with the whine when it happens. Something sharp. |
| Use your brian, moran!
User ID: 2782120 United States03/09/2014 09:05 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Let's see if I understand this situation: Quoting: Interested Reader 2 Ukraine had a lawfully elected government that wasn't helping the country, so people protested. Instead of changing government behavior in response to the protests by its People, the government changed the Constitution and OUTLAWED protests! This begot even MORE protests, which begot even MORE government heavy handedness. Ultimately, the people of Ukraine (whether they were urged-on by outsiders or not) revolted, resulting in the use of violence, which caused the downfall of the government to the point where the President actually fled the country. Neighboring Russia called this series of events a "Coup d Etat." I see this as mistake #1. A coup d'etat is defined as "the sudden deposition of a government, usually by a small group of the existing state establishment—typically the military—to depose the extant government and replace it with another body, civil or military. A coup d'état is considered successful when the usurpers establish their dominance." This is NOT what took place in Ukraine. It was not a small group of the existing establishment that undertook what happened; it was the body politic of Ukraine itself. So Russia's description of this series of events as a "Coup d' Etat" is factually wrong. It would be more accurate to call the situation in Ukraine a "Revolution" which is defined as "A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution: Complete change from one constitution to another Modification of an existing constitution. Looking at what took place in Ukraine bolsters the fact it was a revolution and not a Coup. What was a primary demand of the protesters? The RESTORATION of the earlier Constitution. That's exactly what was done after the ousted President fled the country! So based upon actual definitions, what took place in Ukraine was a revolution and NOT a Coup. Next, neighboring Russia decided to exercise its rights pursuant to a Treaty, and began sending thousands of troops into the Crimean region of Ukraine, allegedly to "protect" its Black Sea naval fleet and to "protect ethnic Russians." Their reasons really didn't matter since Russia was exercising Treaty rights. The Treaty made allowance for up to 25,000 Russian Troops. Until Russia hit the 25,000 limit, it was within its rights. But strange things started taking place with those Russian troops: They started rummaging around Crimea. They started pushing their way into Ukraine military facilities and ousting the Ukrainian military from those facilities. NONE of that was within Russia's Treaty rights. Next, Russia started deploying troops outside its bases in Crimea. That was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russia sank a ship in a waterway so as to physically block the entry/exit of the Ukraine navy from its home port. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russian troops took over border control check points. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Now, after a week or so of all this, Russia admits it has 30,000 of its troops in Crimea. This is a direct violation of the written Treaty limit of 25,000 troops. Amid all this chaos, the government of the Crimea declared its desire to become part of Russia. This would be akin to Massachusetts asking Britain to send back its troops because it wants to go back to being a colony of Great Britain and besides, most of its people speak English. That crap doesn't fly. So whatever the local Crimean government wants, is utterly irrelevant from a national level. Here we are, weeks later, and it appears Russia is now hand-delivering ultimatums to other Ukraine military installations in Crimea, setting a deadline for surrender. None of this is within Russia's Treaty Rights. Russia has therefore committed a defacto invasion of the sovereign territory of Ukraine. It has initiated an illegal blockade of Ukraine naval activities, which, in and of itself, is and act of war, and it is giving surrender ultimatums. By any account, Ukraine has a valid Casus Belli, (cause for war.) The question facing the rest of the world is simply this: Will the world stand-up and defend the sovereign territory of one nation, from aggression by another nation? If so, then we can call ourselves civilized. If not, then the only international law is the "law of the gun" that makes us barbarians. Glory to Ukraine! You must take into account the irrefutable fact the West, US was a huge part of this, decided to do what they have been doing in South America, Africa & the Middle East, for decades. Putin, as well as the rest of the World(if they care to pay attention & delve into the evidence) KNOWS that the US Government was involved & he said, "No more! Not with these people & not along our border. We've had enough of your shit!". I'm a proud Texan & American, posting from Central Texas & have no clue why my flag shows friggin Canada(no offense to my Canadian friends). "Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest." Diderot "Immigration without assimilation is invasion!" - Anonymous Coward Gird your lions, shave your Family & panic sex the 'maters! "When your so-called religion is purely a political theory of conquest, and deception is one of it's core principles then it strikes me as perfectly sane and reasonable to assume literally everyone who is of such a "religion" to be exactly the same POS who deserves to be treated as the enemy non-stop." Darkwolf007 |
| The Årtist
User ID: 44124412 United States03/09/2014 09:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 33706236 Canada03/09/2014 09:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 Let's see if I understand this situation: Quoting: Interested Reader 2 Ukraine had a lawfully elected government that wasn't helping the country, so people protested. Instead of changing government behavior in response to the protests by its People, the government changed the Constitution and OUTLAWED protests! This begot even MORE protests, which begot even MORE government heavy handedness. Ultimately, the people of Ukraine (whether they were urged-on by outsiders or not) revolted, resulting in the use of violence, which caused the downfall of the government to the point where the President actually fled the country. Neighboring Russia called this series of events a "Coup d Etat." I see this as mistake #1. A coup d'etat is defined as "the sudden deposition of a government, usually by a small group of the existing state establishment—typically the military—to depose the extant government and replace it with another body, civil or military. A coup d'état is considered successful when the usurpers establish their dominance." This is NOT what took place in Ukraine. It was not a small group of the existing establishment that undertook what happened; it was the body politic of Ukraine itself. So Russia's description of this series of events as a "Coup d' Etat" is factually wrong. It would be more accurate to call the situation in Ukraine a "Revolution" which is defined as "A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution: Complete change from one constitution to another Modification of an existing constitution. Looking at what took place in Ukraine bolsters the fact it was a revolution and not a Coup. What was a primary demand of the protesters? The RESTORATION of the earlier Constitution. That's exactly what was done after the ousted President fled the country! So based upon actual definitions, what took place in Ukraine was a revolution and NOT a Coup. Next, neighboring Russia decided to exercise its rights pursuant to a Treaty, and began sending thousands of troops into the Crimean region of Ukraine, allegedly to "protect" its Black Sea naval fleet and to "protect ethnic Russians." Their reasons really didn't matter since Russia was exercising Treaty rights. The Treaty made allowance for up to 25,000 Russian Troops. Until Russia hit the 25,000 limit, it was within its rights. But strange things started taking place with those Russian troops: They started rummaging around Crimea. They started pushing their way into Ukraine military facilities and ousting the Ukrainian military from those facilities. NONE of that was within Russia's Treaty rights. Next, Russia started deploying troops outside its bases in Crimea. That was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russia sank a ship in a waterway so as to physically block the entry/exit of the Ukraine navy from its home port. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Next, Russian troops took over border control check points. This too was not within Russia's Treaty Rights. Now, after a week or so of all this, Russia admits it has 30,000 of its troops in Crimea. This is a direct violation of the written Treaty limit of 25,000 troops. Amid all this chaos, the government of the Crimea declared its desire to become part of Russia. This would be akin to Massachusetts asking Britain to send back its troops because it wants to go back to being a colony of Great Britain and besides, most of its people speak English. That crap doesn't fly. So whatever the local Crimean government wants, is utterly irrelevant from a national level. Here we are, weeks later, and it appears Russia is now hand-delivering ultimatums to other Ukraine military installations in Crimea, setting a deadline for surrender. None of this is within Russia's Treaty Rights. Russia has therefore committed a defacto invasion of the sovereign territory of Ukraine. It has initiated an illegal blockade of Ukraine naval activities, which, in and of itself, is and act of war, and it is giving surrender ultimatums. By any account, Ukraine has a valid Casus Belli, (cause for war.) The question facing the rest of the world is simply this: Will the world stand-up and defend the sovereign territory of one nation, from aggression by another nation? If so, then we can call ourselves civilized. If not, then the only international law is the "law of the gun" that makes us barbarians. Glory to Ukraine! Fucking eh! |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 23677101 United States03/09/2014 09:06 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55390977 United States03/09/2014 09:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Re: UKRAINE/RUSSIA NEWS: Russian military drills begin near Ukraine day after militants announce 100k strong mobalisation!!!p.7387 OK, you weasels, I challenge you to take a stand. Quoting: Anonymous Coward 55260799 Who here believes there's going to be an overt military clash this year between Russia and the US over this Ukraine incident? I'm taking names for future ridicule. depends on many things if there will be a military clash. in 6 days from now the crimea will be a part of russia. if ukraine then attacks russia, there will be war betweend ukraine and russia. a war between the NATO or US and Russia is not very likely because it would make the australians the only humans left on this planet. and I think nato and russia have one in common. don't let this happen to beloved mother earth. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 55182009 Canada03/09/2014 09:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
